Yeah, the first ten minutes of The World is Not Enough was awesome. Sadly, the rest of the movie couldn't live up to it.
A James Bond Fan Reviews the Franchise
- Thread starter Admiral Shran
- Start date
Yeah, the first ten minutes of The World is Not Enough was awesome. Sadly, the rest of the movie couldn't live up to it.
You hit the nail right on the head there. I never did understand why they felt they had to have a Bond Girl who was already an known actress - first with Teri Hatcher, then with Denise Richards, and finally with Halle Berry.
Even some of the other Bond Girls were famous (ish) - Michelle Yeoh and Sophie Marceau.
Rett Mikhal
Captain
Denise Richards as the foremost nuclear science expert.
...'KAY!
...'KAY!
Yeah, on the whole most Bond girls were unknowns, although on occasion they'd get a 'name', Dianna Rigg for example. Although much as it pains me to say it I'm not sure how well known Rigg was outside of the UK.
Much as I'm not a great fan of Eva Green as Vesper (but more about that when you get to Casino Royale) I think she's much preferable to the notion of hiring Jolie. I dunno, for me European actresses work best as Bond girls, I'm not sure quite why that is. Denise Richards is attractive and is an ok actress, but Denise Richards as a nuclear scientist? ITs just wrong on so many levels!
Hatcher just seemed to think she was bigger than Bond, does anyone know just how much of her stuff ended up on the cutting room floor? Still that shot where she loses her dress is quite nice (though not sure if it was actually her, wasn't she pregnant at the time?)
As for Halle Berry. I'd actually go out on a limb and say that Jinx was better than she had any right to be. That doesn't mean I like her, never been a fan of Berry, frankly never found her that attractive, but Jinx wasn't quite the abomination I feared. Still I was rooting for Miranda Frost at the end...but I'll come back to Rosamund Pike when you do DAD.
^ They actually considered Angelina Jolie for the role of Vesper?! 
When OHMSS was filmed, Diana Rigg was already fairly well known in America thanks to her Emma Peel role. (By "fairly well known," I mean every male between the ages of 12 and 90 fell in love with her.)
And Honor Blackman was an established actress, known for playing Cathy Gale in The Avengers pre-Diana Rigg, when she took on the role of Pussy Galore in Goldfinger -- although she was probably not that familiar to American audiences at the time.
Sophie Marceau was the evil chick from The World is Not Enough, right? She was fucking beautiful.
I liked Eva Green a lot in Casino Royale. I thought her chemistry with Daniel Craig was great.
I liked Eva Green a lot in Casino Royale. I thought her chemistry with Daniel Craig was great.
Indeed. And the posters and print ads featured her prominently, pretty much selling the film as "007 Vs. Grace Jones."
Die Another Day (½)
Oh God. Oh my God! That movie.... hurt me.
Seriously, where do I even begin? Let's return to our list format from Moonraker, shall we?
Problem #1: The Villain
Damn, I thought that Renard and Elektra from The World Is Not Enough were annoying. Graves leaves them so far in the dust that it isn't even funny. I don't think I've ever - ever - seen a more annoying character in a movie in my entire life, and I've watched a lot of Jack Black and Owen Wilson movies, so that's really saying something. There is absolutely nothing menacing or threatening about him AT ALL, either as Graves or as the North Korean colonel at the beginning of the film. In fact, the whole stage is set when we see him beat the hell out of his anger therapist for "lecturing him." I could only think, "are you serious, that's his job!" The villains in the Brosnan's movies have seriously gone downhill since Trevelyan and I just don't understand why. If it was an attempt to make Bond look better in comparison, it failed. Weak villains don't make a hero better; all they do is make the hero look weak for only defeating lesser men. Again, all I could think whenever the character was on the screen was "SHUT UP ALREADY!" Not a good sign for a Bond villain.
Also....
Problem #2: The Bond Girls
Jinx:
This character is just so damn bland and uninteresting. All she is is a female Bond, nothing more. Bond Girls have almost always had definable characteristics of their own, but not Jinx. So, what was the point of creating her?
And maybe, just maybe, a little more development would have helped before she jumped into bed with Bond. I remember watching this movie in the theater and hearing someone behind me say "Christ, they're fucking already!" That pretty much sums it up.
Miranda Frost:
Another bland, uninteresting and ultimately annoying character. Whether she lived or died meant nothing to me (and I'm speaking of before it was revealed that she was a villain, because once that happened everyone with a brain knew she was going to die somehow.) She's absolutely gorgeous, but that isn't enough to overcome her annoying personality.
Verity:
Madonna?! Why?! Her title song was awful enough; why include her in the cast?
Problem #3: Storytelling Problems
This movie makes the cardinal mistake of just about every film genre, with the exception of porn - it puts spectacle over substance. There's way too much action, most noticeably the sword fight between Bond and Graves - was there even a point to that sequence? Too often it gets mired in unnecessary special effects and CGI. This is even felt in the gun barrel sequence when she see a CGI bullet come flying at us. Why? Bond shouldn't be about the effects, it should be about the story. The characters, in turn, really get short changed in the process. For example, Bond and Moneypenny don't even share a scene together, aside from Moneypenny's fantasy.
Also, there are at least a couple of MAJOR plot holes. First, how did MI6 miss the fact that Miranda Frost and Graves/Moon were school friends? Second, why is that after the Americans fail to destroy Icarus, they decide that the only other alternative is to mobilize all of the South Korea's forces? Here's an idea, shoot more than one missile at Icarus from different locations.
Problem #4: Everyone's attitudes towards Bond
Why is everyone so damn condescending toward Bond in this movie. It all starts when Michael Madsen says "Look at him. You would think he's some kind of hero." Well, let's recap - he's saved the world from an economic meltdown by keeping London from being EMPed into the Stone Age, averted a major war between China and the U.K., saved Istanbul from being nuked off the map, from your perspective stopped a North Korean lunatic from invading South Korea with weapons you were too stupid to know exist and undergone fourteen months of horrible torture without giving up your secrets. Sounds like a hero to me.
Miranda Frost describes as his worst trait that he's a womanizer. Oh God, I'd hate to have that quality in a man who routinely saves the world! But then again, why is a womanizer? Because he enjoys casual sex? It seems to me that all the women he beds also enjoy casual sex, and you never hear anyone complain about that, either in the movies themselves or in real life.
But worst of all is M. She abandons him to torture in North Korea, flat out tells him that if it were up to her he would still be there and refuses to believe him over the Americans. I've said it before and I'll say it again - I simply do not get this whole antagonistic relationship between these two. For decades it was established that M had a deep respect for and faith in Bond and would always rely on his judgment. Yet ever since Judi Dench took over the role, M has had to constantly relearn the lesson that Bond is MI6's best and most reliable agent. Also, she abandons him to torture and thinks nothing of it after he goes out of his way to save her life in Istanbul?
Problem #5: Gadgets
I said that Goldeneye was too reliant on gadgets. Well, that movie is relatively gadget-free compared to this one. And many of the gadgets themselves are simply ridiculous.
An invisible car?
....
....
....
....
This pretty much sums up my reaction to that.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CplUqjQqTq0
How is it even possible that MI6 has a virtual reality simulator that puts Star Trek's holodeck to shame?
An electrocution suit, a glass shattering ring, a wristwatch with a laser, a mini air supply, a special repealing line, etc....
LAY OFF THE GADGETS AND FOCUS ON THIS STORY!
Problem #6: Bond Himself
Yes, even Pierce Brosnan is a problem. How is it that Bond completely forgets about being tortured for over a year? Aside from the flashback he experiences in the hospital, he isn't affected by it at all. I suppose that Brosnan could only work with the script that was given to him, but he could have added some subtext to the role - make it seem as though Bond has been negatively affected, mentally, by his experience.
Also, we might as well abandon all the pretext that James Bond is a spy any longer. He's a special forces commando. I mean, when even the Chinese intelligence community knows exactly who he is, and he knows that they know, and they know that he knows, and he knows that they know that he knows that they know.... okay, I've lost my train of thought, but you get the idea.
So, Die Another Day is easily the worst movie thus far. In fact, there's only one slight aspect that keeps it from getting a zero rating....
Halle Berry in an orange two-piece bikini.
That's Amore: 50
Bond slept with Jinx and Miranda Frost.
Body Count: 337 (+25)
Oh God. Oh my God! That movie.... hurt me.
Seriously, where do I even begin? Let's return to our list format from Moonraker, shall we?
Problem #1: The Villain
Damn, I thought that Renard and Elektra from The World Is Not Enough were annoying. Graves leaves them so far in the dust that it isn't even funny. I don't think I've ever - ever - seen a more annoying character in a movie in my entire life, and I've watched a lot of Jack Black and Owen Wilson movies, so that's really saying something. There is absolutely nothing menacing or threatening about him AT ALL, either as Graves or as the North Korean colonel at the beginning of the film. In fact, the whole stage is set when we see him beat the hell out of his anger therapist for "lecturing him." I could only think, "are you serious, that's his job!" The villains in the Brosnan's movies have seriously gone downhill since Trevelyan and I just don't understand why. If it was an attempt to make Bond look better in comparison, it failed. Weak villains don't make a hero better; all they do is make the hero look weak for only defeating lesser men. Again, all I could think whenever the character was on the screen was "SHUT UP ALREADY!" Not a good sign for a Bond villain.
Also....
Well, that took you long enough. The rest of us have known that for over forty years by this point!
Problem #2: The Bond Girls
Jinx:
This character is just so damn bland and uninteresting. All she is is a female Bond, nothing more. Bond Girls have almost always had definable characteristics of their own, but not Jinx. So, what was the point of creating her?
And maybe, just maybe, a little more development would have helped before she jumped into bed with Bond. I remember watching this movie in the theater and hearing someone behind me say "Christ, they're fucking already!" That pretty much sums it up.Miranda Frost:
Another bland, uninteresting and ultimately annoying character. Whether she lived or died meant nothing to me (and I'm speaking of before it was revealed that she was a villain, because once that happened everyone with a brain knew she was going to die somehow.) She's absolutely gorgeous, but that isn't enough to overcome her annoying personality.
Verity:
Madonna?! Why?! Her title song was awful enough; why include her in the cast?
Problem #3: Storytelling Problems
This movie makes the cardinal mistake of just about every film genre, with the exception of porn - it puts spectacle over substance. There's way too much action, most noticeably the sword fight between Bond and Graves - was there even a point to that sequence? Too often it gets mired in unnecessary special effects and CGI. This is even felt in the gun barrel sequence when she see a CGI bullet come flying at us. Why? Bond shouldn't be about the effects, it should be about the story. The characters, in turn, really get short changed in the process. For example, Bond and Moneypenny don't even share a scene together, aside from Moneypenny's fantasy.
Also, there are at least a couple of MAJOR plot holes. First, how did MI6 miss the fact that Miranda Frost and Graves/Moon were school friends? Second, why is that after the Americans fail to destroy Icarus, they decide that the only other alternative is to mobilize all of the South Korea's forces? Here's an idea, shoot more than one missile at Icarus from different locations.
Problem #4: Everyone's attitudes towards Bond
Why is everyone so damn condescending toward Bond in this movie. It all starts when Michael Madsen says "Look at him. You would think he's some kind of hero." Well, let's recap - he's saved the world from an economic meltdown by keeping London from being EMPed into the Stone Age, averted a major war between China and the U.K., saved Istanbul from being nuked off the map, from your perspective stopped a North Korean lunatic from invading South Korea with weapons you were too stupid to know exist and undergone fourteen months of horrible torture without giving up your secrets. Sounds like a hero to me.
Miranda Frost describes as his worst trait that he's a womanizer. Oh God, I'd hate to have that quality in a man who routinely saves the world! But then again, why is a womanizer? Because he enjoys casual sex? It seems to me that all the women he beds also enjoy casual sex, and you never hear anyone complain about that, either in the movies themselves or in real life.
But worst of all is M. She abandons him to torture in North Korea, flat out tells him that if it were up to her he would still be there and refuses to believe him over the Americans. I've said it before and I'll say it again - I simply do not get this whole antagonistic relationship between these two. For decades it was established that M had a deep respect for and faith in Bond and would always rely on his judgment. Yet ever since Judi Dench took over the role, M has had to constantly relearn the lesson that Bond is MI6's best and most reliable agent. Also, she abandons him to torture and thinks nothing of it after he goes out of his way to save her life in Istanbul?
Problem #5: Gadgets
I said that Goldeneye was too reliant on gadgets. Well, that movie is relatively gadget-free compared to this one. And many of the gadgets themselves are simply ridiculous.
An invisible car?
....
....
....
....
This pretty much sums up my reaction to that.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CplUqjQqTq0
How is it even possible that MI6 has a virtual reality simulator that puts Star Trek's holodeck to shame?
An electrocution suit, a glass shattering ring, a wristwatch with a laser, a mini air supply, a special repealing line, etc....
LAY OFF THE GADGETS AND FOCUS ON THIS STORY!
Problem #6: Bond Himself
Yes, even Pierce Brosnan is a problem. How is it that Bond completely forgets about being tortured for over a year? Aside from the flashback he experiences in the hospital, he isn't affected by it at all. I suppose that Brosnan could only work with the script that was given to him, but he could have added some subtext to the role - make it seem as though Bond has been negatively affected, mentally, by his experience.
Also, we might as well abandon all the pretext that James Bond is a spy any longer. He's a special forces commando. I mean, when even the Chinese intelligence community knows exactly who he is, and he knows that they know, and they know that he knows, and he knows that they know that he knows that they know.... okay, I've lost my train of thought, but you get the idea.
So, Die Another Day is easily the worst movie thus far. In fact, there's only one slight aspect that keeps it from getting a zero rating....
Halle Berry in an orange two-piece bikini.
That's Amore: 50
Bond slept with Jinx and Miranda Frost.
Body Count: 337 (+25)
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I share your opinion on the horrid DAD.
Yet it broke Bond box office records, so go figure.
I really really wanna find *something* positive, so I'll grasp--
Some ideas were good. Bond losing for a change, getting captured and the bad guy North Koreans win. An original idea in the Bond movies. Credit for the new idea, if not the presentation.
I liked the fencing sword fight.
I think real-life name Rosamund Pike is a better Bond girl name than fictional name Miranda Frost.
Since this was the 40th year anniversary Bond film, there were many many in-jokes and references to all the earlier Bond films. Some corny, but most nice.
And that's about everything good I can say about DAD.
Too bad Brosnan leaves the Bond role on a bad note. Like Connery did in DAF and Moore in AVTAK. Oh well.
Yet it broke Bond box office records, so go figure.
I really really wanna find *something* positive, so I'll grasp--
Some ideas were good. Bond losing for a change, getting captured and the bad guy North Koreans win. An original idea in the Bond movies. Credit for the new idea, if not the presentation.
I liked the fencing sword fight.
I think real-life name Rosamund Pike is a better Bond girl name than fictional name Miranda Frost.
Since this was the 40th year anniversary Bond film, there were many many in-jokes and references to all the earlier Bond films. Some corny, but most nice.
And that's about everything good I can say about DAD.
Too bad Brosnan leaves the Bond role on a bad note. Like Connery did in DAF and Moore in AVTAK. Oh well.
Dusty Ayres
Commodore
If the UK had sent in the SAS or some other commando unit, and they got caught (just like in this incident), it would have been World War III. Sending the two most top agents with commando experience was a wise idea, since if one died, the other would have succeed.
M - Before you say it, I don't have a problem with M being a woman. My problem is that she is so antagonistic to Bond, really for no reason. What was the point? It destroys the whole Bond/M relationship that has been established. It's one thing to push Bond hard, like M has always done. It's another to act like "I don't care if you always get the job done. I don't like you because you're a misogynist." When has Bond ever shown a hatred of women?And even though she dislikes being thought of as an accountant, that's exactly what she appears to be.
Sadly, she's right; Bond has been utterly misogynistic, and as mentioned in the novels (the Benson ones), acted in a way with his personal secretaries so much so that he had to be given a male one.
Obviously, Moneypenny's grown up and matured, and no longer has a puppy-love thing for Bond. This has been communicated to all the other women in the Double-O Section, with Miranda Frost being very direct about her relationship to Bond in DAD.
I wish that a variation on the character of Cedar Leiter had been used instead (she comes from the novel For Special Services), or a version/variation on Felix acted by Billy Bob Thornton or Matthew McConaughey, who is just as capable as Bond, and not an idiot. So,I'll agree with you on that.
But worst of all is M. She abandons him to torture in North Korea, flat out tells him that if it were up to her he would still be there and refuses to believe him over the Americans. I've said it before and I'll say it again - I simply do not get this whole antagonistic relationship between these two. For decades it was established that M had a deep respect for and faith in Bond and would always rely on his judgment. Yet ever since Judi Dench took over the role, M has had to constantly relearn the lesson that Bond is MI6's best and most reliable agent. Also, she abandons him to torture and thinks nothing of it after he goes out of his way to save her life in Istanbul?
I've got to disagree with you about Judi Dench's M. I think the antagonistic approach her character has brings much more depth to the role. I mean, Bernard Lee was great and all, but the character was pretty flat. Off the top of my head, I'd find it pretty tough to actually say much about his personality traits.
And I think the other thing to remember is that Dench is playing a different character. M is a codename, and Bond mentions her predecessor in Goldeneye.
I actually like DAD. It's not as good as Goldeneye but it's better than its two immediate predecessors and better than any other Bond movie since the 1960s.
Great opening sedquence and I like how Bond gets captured and tortured - not just for an hour or two but for years! Long before 24 did this to Jack Bauer, incidentally.
Love the nods to the previous movies & gadgets, from Halle's Daniel Craig pose, oops, I mean her Honor Blackman pose, the Oddjob lookalike, the jetpack, etc etc. And I love that Bond pretends to be an ornithologist - Ian Fleming took the character's name from a book about birds of the Carribean, IIRC. Then you have great scenes like Bond slowing his heartbeat to feign death, his entry into the hotel and some memorable dialogue. 'Liver shows signs of damage' 'Definitely him, then' or the exchange with M about the cyanide pill.
Admittedly, the movie has a dire CGI sequence, the notorious wind-surfing scene (which is uncannily like the equally crap scene in Escape From LA - which at least has the excuse of having been made years earlier), I could have done without the invisible car and the final sequence is like an identikit compilation of a zillion other Bond movies. But I think they're outweighed by the plusses. I don't get the hate for Jinx (who at the time was popular enough that there was talk of her own spin-off - not to mention that we actually got to see 007 making the beast with two backs for a change) and I likd Miranda Frost fine.
This is way above DAF or AVTAK.
Great opening sedquence and I like how Bond gets captured and tortured - not just for an hour or two but for years! Long before 24 did this to Jack Bauer, incidentally.
Love the nods to the previous movies & gadgets, from Halle's Daniel Craig pose, oops, I mean her Honor Blackman pose, the Oddjob lookalike, the jetpack, etc etc. And I love that Bond pretends to be an ornithologist - Ian Fleming took the character's name from a book about birds of the Carribean, IIRC. Then you have great scenes like Bond slowing his heartbeat to feign death, his entry into the hotel and some memorable dialogue. 'Liver shows signs of damage' 'Definitely him, then' or the exchange with M about the cyanide pill.
Admittedly, the movie has a dire CGI sequence, the notorious wind-surfing scene (which is uncannily like the equally crap scene in Escape From LA - which at least has the excuse of having been made years earlier), I could have done without the invisible car and the final sequence is like an identikit compilation of a zillion other Bond movies. But I think they're outweighed by the plusses. I don't get the hate for Jinx (who at the time was popular enough that there was talk of her own spin-off - not to mention that we actually got to see 007 making the beast with two backs for a change) and I likd Miranda Frost fine.
This is way above DAF or AVTAK.
He did, and that book appears as a prop in the film.
This one had a number of problems, but at the very least it was a memorable failure rather than a forgettable one as were the two prior films. Sort of the Moonraker of its era.
