Buffy season 8-- MAJOR SPOILERS-- Twilight reveal

[Anwar]

I wonder how they'd have done the Twilight story in live-action. Would Twilight have a different voice dubbed over, or would they have electronically altered Boreanez's voice?

And why the heck did Buffy think ROBBING A BANK for money was a good idea?

 

[DevilEyes]

What's the deal with Spike being referred to as 'Your Majesty'? Have I missed something?

Those giant bugs from his ship consider him their king or something...

How the hell he came into the possession of the ship and got the bugs to serve him, don't ask, I have no idea.

The current IDW 'Spike' series is apparantly going to deal with this. The series was supposed to be an ongoing run, but now the licence is soon to change hands back to Dark Horse it's only gonna be 8 issues long (2 have come out so far)

It'll be a nice tie in, but still... that kinda sums up a lot of my feelings of Season 8. So much is left unexplained and just "wtf." Like why did the Scooby Gang even end up in Scotland with a big castle anyway? Scott Allie and co have been asked this before and always mention they didn't wanna spend loads of time explaining every little thing that happened since 'Chosen', which is fair enough I suppose, but still.

Also Angel, I still have no idea what his deal and how he really got involved in this whole Twilight thing and why he did it, and how he got the whole US military involved, and found Amy & Warren, etc. Again, I think IDW are gonna touch on a little with their remaining arc before the license ends, but apparantly they'll only slightly cover it. The general plot of Season 8 still doesn't really make any sense to me.

I don't hate this season, but I don't love it either. My biggest problem with it is: not enough character moments, especially in the last few issues, too much plot (convoluted, insane plot) and an over-reliance on OTT moments - Dawn as a giant? Dawn as a centaur? Space frakking? Kitty Twilight the baby-universe? and to top it all, in the latest issue - a GIANT VAGINA-SHAPED MONSTER?! (hey, ma, look! I can do all this stuff in comics that I couldn't do on TV!). The setup this season has been more compelling than the payoff. The things I've enjoyed the most this season have been side stories (decoy Slayer in "The Chain", Buffy and Andrew going on a mission to stop a rogue Slayer, Faith on a mission with Giles), little character moments, dreams and fantasy scenes... issues like "Anywhere But Here" (Buffy and Willow going to see the "Minder" lady Robin), or the supplementary web comic "Always Darkest" - now that were 3 pages of brilliance that really looked like BtVS: it had wit and humor, with poignancy underneath, and a rare insight into Buffy's tortured mind, some foreshadowing, as well as some great meta moments (on issues like shipping, slash and misogyny in fandom). I hope to see something more like this in #40, which I think I'd probably like more than #39. I hope it's a season finale in the vein of "Restless". After all this plot, plot, plot, we really need some character stuff.

And it makes me hopeful that Joss is the only credited writer for #40. Editor-in-chief Scott Allie's comments on the writing process in #39 seem to confirm that he was writing most of it - which doesn't surprise me. Allie is not a great writer, he seems to be all about the plot. Characterization, humor, wit, great dialogue, poignancy - those are not his strong points. Or at least it doesn't seem so, since the issues he seems to be most involved in writing ended up being most plot-driven (apart from the scenes that have been confirmed as written by Joss, like the first 7 pages of #37). We need more writers from the show, like Jane Espenson.

 

[Infinitus]

Be grateful Angel isn't sparkling.

 

[Admiral_Young]

I don't know if they thought it was a GOOD idea but out of necessity regarding the bank robbing thing. Buffy has never been about morals really before, she's not Spider-Man or even Batman. As for Twilight's voice I could see either possibility that you propose Anwar working.

 

[Anwar]

According to Giles, he has access to the resources of the Watchers' Council. Surely THAT would've been a stable enough resource to maintain the Slayer Army.

It just looks like it was a contrivance to get the World Authorities after the Slayers.

 

[Admiral_Young]

Except that Buffy has ignored previous help from the Watcher's in the past and Giles hasn't exactly been one with the gang this season. In fact that was one of the sub-plots in this season.

 

[Ethros]

Amy had a spell going that altered Twilight's/Angel's voice anyway, so it wouldn't really matter.
It was only when Amy was whisked away that the spell wasn't working anymore and Giles recognised his voice

 

[Admiral_Young]

I'm wondering if we'll get hardcover versions of the trades? With Georges sketchbook that he has been giving away at cons this year as part of the extra features special. kind of like a DVD box set type of deal. That'd be sweet.

 

[Ethros]

I think Scott Allie said something like they'll be a duluxe hardcover soon enough.
I don't know if it would include all 40 issues (plus the two one shots), maybe it'd have to be divided into two. But he did mention extras and stuff IIRC.

There is to be a deluxe hardcover from IDW of Angel: After The Fall though in the new year, collecting all 17 issues

 

[tharpdevenport]

Yeah, with the Seed broken they'd lost their superpowers (although Buffy still has normal Slayer powers of course)

Season 7, they revealed her powers comes from demon sources. Wouldn't destroying the seed rob her of all her powers (including any remaining Slayerettes)?

According to Giles, he has access to the resources of the Watchers' Council. Surely THAT would've been a stable enough resource to maintain the Slayer Army.

It just looks like it was a contrivance to get the World Authorities after the Slayers.

What exactly does Andrew have access to? Season 7: Watcher's Council leadership are blown to smithereens, and I seem to recall the books as well, and that earlier on in another Season Giles lost books, and then of course he lost EVERYTHING when Sunnydale became a giant crater (assuming he didn't take anything home with him when he went Motherland bound for a bit).

If the First wanted it all destroyed, and the Council couldn't even protect itself, how in the world were they going to protect their books?

 

[DevilEyes]

Yeah, with the Seed broken they'd lost their superpowers (although Buffy still has normal Slayer powers of course)

Season 7, they revealed her powers comes from demon sources. Wouldn't destroying the seed rob her of all her powers (including any remaining Slayerettes)?

No.

Here is Scott Allie's answer to an e-mail from a fan (she posted it on Buffyforums.net):

SA :Feel free to share the following if you're talking to other readers—
If you go back to a previous issue, #37 or 38, Aluwyn explained these things to Willow—supernatural entities already on this world will remain here. That includes demons—although new demons from other realms will have no route by which to reach this world. But for demons or vampires or Slayers already here—if there is something essentially magical, and the magic is intrinsic to the individual, it remains. But new magic, new energy, new entities, will not be brought into the world from elsewhere. So vampires already here, with their demons in their hearts, remain. And ensouled demons, with their souls in their hearts, remain just as they are—just like you and I don't suddenly lose our souls. Witches, however, draw their energy, through prayers and spells and whatnot, from other realms. Amy, a witch, was using a spell to keep Warren's skin on, something we've stated a few times over the years. So when Amy lost her magic, she lost the spell that was providing Warren's skin. Splat.
How's that work for you?

Buffy's and Angel's superpowers as well as the glow and Twilight's hold on Angel were all maintained by magic, so they disappeared immediately when the Seed was broken. Same thing with Willow's magic, and any other witch's magic. Same with Warren being alive.

But Buffy is still a Slayer, so is Faith, and Satsu, and all the other Slayerettes. Dawn, I presume, is still human. Clem is still there, so are all the other demons who live in this universe, so are vampires who are already there like Harmony. Spike and Angel are still vampires with souls.

(I would assume, but I don't know for sure, that should also mean that Angel's curse is now meaningless except as something that gave him soul in the first place, and that he can't lose it, and that Shanshu is now impossible as well, so basically both Angel and Spike will remain the way they are?)

But no new Slayers can ever be called. The Slayer line is over. Which I guess can sorta-kinda justify the "Buffy betrays herself" idea.

BTW there is a lot of speculation on the forums about Willow and whether she has been paralyzed from the fall.

 

[Admiral_Young]

It certainly looked like she was traumatized by what happened. I want another "Fray" follow up. The crossover arc this season was fun and kind of wrapped things up but there's always room for more Melaka goodness.

 

[tharpdevenport]

Interesting, but I'm sure Buffy will find a way to have her powers transfered out of her, onto someone else, and perhaps the series, with her either old, or maybe dying from battle, will end with words Giles once gave to her:
"Onto each generation is born...", but with the twist, "But unless you take care, carry on and transfer the line, you may be the LAST..."


Even if Spike stayed the same, would there been any kind of affect on him, that he hypotehtically would have missed since he was spaceshiped away?

 

[Admiral_Young]

This might be a little naive of me but I'm still expecting that final battle scenario from that panel from "Fray" to play out. Now after the "Twilight" and "Last Gleaming" arcs I can't help but think that Buffy, all the vamps, and magic was sucked into Twilight. Of course this could easily be retconned now. I just have thought for the longest time since seeing that one panel that it was kind of a 'fixed point in time' to borrow a phrase from Doctor Who.

 

[DevilEyes]

Interesting, but I'm sure Buffy will find a way to have her powers transfered out of her, onto someone else, and perhaps the series, with her either old, or maybe dying from battle, will end with words Giles once gave to her:
"Onto each generation is born...", but with the twist, "But unless you take care, carry on and transfer the line, you may be the LAST..."

I don't see how that would be possible without some kind of magic.

Oh, and TharpJingleport... may I ask who you are? Is your regular name in your location?

Even if Spike stayed the same, would there been any kind of affect on him, that he hypotehtically would have missed since he was spaceshiped away?

I'm not sure what you mean. Spike is still in the same dimension. The loss of magic affects the entire dimension.

It certainly looked like she was traumatized by what happened. I want another "Fray" follow up. The crossover arc this season was fun and kind of wrapped things up but there's always room for more Melaka goodness.

The loss of magic is enough to traumatize Willow. She is obsessed with magic and seems to have disconnected herself from humanity. Nowhere else has it been as obvious as in this issue. She calling for her teacher/mentor/lover, the snake lady Aelwyn, and ignoring Kennedy who was concerned about her. People just think that she may be paralyzed because she fell from high above and because of the angle her legs were at.

This might be a little naive of me but I'm still expecting that final battle scenario from that panel from "Fray" to play out. Now after the "Twilight" and "Last Gleaming" arcs I can't help but think that Buffy, all the vamps, and magic was sucked into Twilight. Of course this could easily be retconned now. I just have thought for the longest time since seeing that one panel that it was kind of a 'fixed point in time' to borrow a phrase from Doctor Who.

They obviously aren't, even if we didn't have Allie's confirmation. After the Seed was broken, and Kitty Twilight left Angel and went off into its own universe, Buffy was still lying on the floor next to Giles' body and sobbing. Angel was standing near Xander and looking dizzy and seemingly coming to his senses, and making a little attempt to reach out to Xander, and Xander just gave him a "WTF? Don't come near me" look before going to console Buffy, with Angel just standing there with his head in his hands. Spike was on his ship flying off to deal with the giant vagina-demon (), Kennedy was taking care of Willow. The invading demons were sucked into the hell dimension, and the witches all lost its powers, and Warren turned into a mesh of blood and meat.

 

[Admiral_Young]

I'm not talking about what happened last issue...I'm still talking about a future battle that we've not seen yet. I'm convinced that now that Twilight exists that it is the mysterious portal that we saw in "Fray". Until I'm shown otherwise I'm sticking with this theory lol.

Yeah Xander did toss Angel a don't even think about it look...and Angel for his part looked dazed and confused. He was probably thinking, man I'm glad that's over.

 

[Admiral_Young]

CBR interview with Scott Allie and Georges Jentry...

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=29830

 

[Admiral_Young]

Was just reading Wizard's 2011 preview and they had a blurb in there about Buffy the Vampire Slayer Season Nine...it will be 25 issues over two years and Joss is working on the outline for the season right now and will be working in a 'executive producer' type capacity on the series. There will also be a new Angel ongoing sometime later this year now that Dark Horse has reobtained the rights. There isn't a creative team yet on Angel. It will be interesting to read the Angel ongoing after the Twilight stuff.

 

[Ethros]

There are some teaser panels for the final issue here-
http://www.darkhorse.com/Blog/211/buffy-season-8-40-preview

Out two weeks today!


It'll be interesting to see as well how IDW wrap up their Angel story. I recently read the new TPB of #33-38, and am glad they've killed of Dez and retconned James as the new Big Bad, thereby (rightfully) pissing of the awfulness that was Aftermath (#18-22)

 

[ClayinCA]

I haven't been able to stand most of the IDW Angel output, though the stuff written by the Tiptons is pretty good. I tried reading the "After The Fall" storyline, but the art was just so horrible, and the pacing was pretty poor, so eventually I just gave up on it. Jumped back on board for the first several Bill Willingham issues, but again found these to be pretty lacking. Has it gotten any better since Willingham left...?