Endgame - an anti-climax?

[jimoinj]

What did you think about the final episode of Voyager, Endgame? I only watched the whole Voyager series for the first time this year, so I'm a latecomer. I've really enjoyed it, particularly with the unifying goal of them getting home. So I was pretty disappointed with this episode, with nothing shown of the crew's arrival home. It felt like an anti-climax to me.

I also thought the time-travel thing just made the episode unnecessarily complicated and paradoxical, not that this hasn't happened before in the series. For example, if future Janeway really thought it was too terrible to have been stuck in the Delta Quadrant so long, why not travel back to the beginning and stop herself destroying the Caretaker's array? After all, she said she regretted that decision. Also her goal was supposed to be to save the lives of crewmembers, she could have saved all of them if she went back in time earlier.

She also would have avoided the immoral choice of giving Starfleet access to future weaponry and technology, which also seemed something of a cop out. It reduced the Borg from being a worth nemisis to a pathetic pushover.

Finally I just feel showing the fireworks and ticker tape parade for them coming home, along with promotions would have given better closure for what had been a long journey and enjoyable series. Showing the fireworks show for Voyager's return in an alternate future may have been good for shock value at the beginning of the episode, but wasn't quite the same as if it had been for the real Voyager we had known and followed for those 7 seasons.

Nevertheless, I enjoyed the episode, particularly Janeway's confrontation with the Borg queen. Mostly though I was disappointed by the episode because it could have been so much better. What do you guys think?

 

[Gaith]

There's a rather lengthy thread on it, active as recently as a month ago, here.

 

[froot]

^ I'd say you're floating in the same boat as a lot of us. Some folks do like Endgame, but it's not a well-received episode overall, mostly for the reasons you stated.
Besides the C/7 crack pairing, the whole "what-if" element to the episode really ruined it for me. VOY did a lot of "what-if" episodes, and I wish they had not done one for the big finale.

I remember how damn excited I was for the final episode - the script had leaked on the Internet, but I decided not to read it. The week before it aired, the only thing I could doodle in my schoolbooks were Borg cubes After finally watching the episode, I was like... "that's it?" I'm pretty sure all VOY fans wanted something much more epic. We didn't get to see families or reunions or anything outside of the alternate timeline!

That being said, there are a few things about the finale I did like - I thought Admiral Janeway was pretty accurate, if a little bitter, and I was pretty happy that they rolled with the "family" and "journey" themes throughout the episode. Those are what defined the show for me, and they kept the finale from being a total loss.

(My friend just finished watching VOY through Netflix about a month ago, and when he stopped by our house, the first thing he said was "man, that finale was totally anti-climatic.")

EDIT: Whoops, didn't realize that older thread was still up. ^

 

[jimoinj]

Sorry I did numerous searches for End Game in thread titles and didn't come up with anything...

 

[sonak]

I don't see the big deal on new threads about the same subjects-there's only so much Trek, topics will be repeated, so what? It's fresh perspectives on old subjects that's important.


The best description of this episode I've heard was from an old internet review site, the Cynic's Corner. He called Endgame "a big up-yours card from Voyager's writers to Voyager's viewers. For seven years, fans had waited for the homecoming of USS Voyager, to see what happens with Tom Paris and his dad, with the Maquis crewmembers, with Seven of Nine, the reunion of other senior officers with family or partners, etc.

What do we get? NONE OF THAT. We get a run of the mill time travel episode featuring the Borg, who'd already been overused in Voyager, and no time spent on the "epilogue" of Voyager returning home.

They should've returned Voyager with a few episodes left in the seventh season, and shown the aftermath of their return. Compare this series finale to DS9's WYLB, which CARES about its characters and takes time to reveal their direction after the show.


Yes, I know that the books cover a lot of this territory, but not all fans read all the series, and I for one HATE how the serialized storylines have taken over TNG-DS9-VOY books. I used to be able to pick out good random one-shot books to read from all the various Trek book series. Oh well, a different thread...


Overall, not bad if it had been a random two-hour episode in the middle of the series run, but TERRIBLE as a series finale.

 

[exodus]

I think the point was, it didn't matter what happened to them after they got back to Earth but rather the fact they all got home as a family of their own. Most of the crew were estranged from their families anyway, so even upon coming home they all still had stronger bonds with each other than those left behind on Earth. Janeway, Tom, Be'Lanna, Chakotay almost had no family to come home too, their family was now the crew. Other than getting to Earth, there was no reward for them greater than what they had on Voyager. Even Harry upon talking to his parents how much they babied him, he wasn't treated that way on Voyager.

If Janeway had gone back to the start she would have lost EVERYTHING she and Voyager gained during the journey. That brought home new technology and information that would advance Starfleet tactical and medical rescearch for decades to come. She brought back more info on new life & new civilizations than Kirk.
With the few lives Voyager lost, what they gained could help an entire quaderant of people.

 

[Gaith]

I don't see the big deal on new threads about the same subjects-there's only so much Trek, topics will be repeated, so what? It's fresh perspectives on old subjects that's important.

I don't think it's unfair to ask that threads as recent as two or three months be revived rather than ignored, particularly when the thread topics are as identical as the two in question.

Some of us put a lot of time and thought into our posts. To see them vanish and be ignored just because someone decided not to run a quick search to see if the topic had been discussed recently is a mild insult, imho.

 

[Jetfire]

^

Sorry I did numerous searches for End Game in thread titles and didn't come up with anything...

Gaith, OP said they tried a search and didn't find what they were looking for...plus they are new.

Plus if you have a problem...notify a MOD.

As far as Endgame goes...I felt it was good...not the best...but worked to end the series for me...would have liked a VOY movie though.

 

[exodus]

^

Sorry I did numerous searches for End Game in thread titles and didn't come up with anything...

Gaith, OP said they tried a search and didn't find what they were looking for...plus they are new.

Plus if you have a problem...notify a MOD.

Word, yo.

 

[Gaith]

I wasn't blaming the OP. But sonak asked a question, and I answered it. Is that allowed?

 

[Akiraprise]

Is that allowed?

NO! No questions. No answers. No discussion. Voyager was awesome and the bestest Trek. That is the only point of view allowed in here!

 

[exodus]

Is that allowed?

NO! No questions. No answers. No discussion. Voyager was awesome and the bestest Trek. That is the only point of view allowed in here!

.....and I repeat: Word, yo!

 

[froot]

Is that allowed?

NO! No questions. No answers. No discussion. Voyager was awesome and the bestest Trek. That is the only point of view allowed in here!

YEAH!

Oh, wait, that was sarcasm. Dang it. *wanders away*

 

[Akiraprise]

Yes, for those actually wondering if the mod had gone batshit insane that was sarcasm.

 

[kimc]

Is that allowed?

NO! No questions. No answers. No discussion. Voyager was awesome and the bestest Trek. That is the only point of view allowed in here!

No questions and put away that tea. We drink coffee in here!

 

[JanewayRulz!]

Can I assume the Voy mods have gotten into the leftover halloween candy and are simply enjoying a wicked sugar rush?

Oh, no?

Okay.

Moving along quietly.

 

[vas2009]

Is that allowed?

NO! No questions. No answers. No discussion. Voyager was awesome and the bestest Trek. That is the only point of view allowed in here!

No questions and put away that tea. We drink coffee in here!

LOL! I thought it was a requirment?!

 

[sonak]

For the record, my "question" was more of a rhetorical device than an actual request to be enlightened with further information on the subject.

 

[Gaith]

Perhaps, but your need for enlightenment was quite real.