G
George1710
Guest
Yup you are absolutely right...
What is your honest opinion of Enterprise?
- Thread starter indolover
- Start date
I was thinking about this question the other day. When the DS9 DVDs came out, it was 10 years after the show originally aired and while it had a popular following here, it gained an even larger fanbase because it was accessable to it. Heck, Even Voyager is gaining appreciation the longer away to get from it.
So what about Enterprise. I actually finished buying the series and watched the series earlier this year and while it's not my favorite Star Trek, there is a lot to like about it. For one, the idea of a prequal series was a good one. I also liked most of the episodes, especially in Season 3 and 4, but my honest opinion of it is it isn't on the level as the other series. It was too plot driven/action oriented for my tastes. It was like Voyager, where we didn't really have time to stop and get to know the characters because there was a crisis or the ship being attacked. Of course we got some of those character episodes like The Forgotten and Home, but they came few and far between. Heck, even in the trilogies of the 4th season, it seemed like they were doing action for action's sake.
I will say though that on the levels of the best of Star Trek, the highest point of Enterprise for me was Azati Prime, Damage, and The Forgotten. All three of this episodes were so tight, compacted, and really served the characters so well. The things these people had to do were not good, but understandable, and in a small way they were still likable. The Forgotten is an episode I would place on the same levels as Inner Light and The Visitor, even though it doesn't make me cry as much.
So what about Enterprise. I actually finished buying the series and watched the series earlier this year and while it's not my favorite Star Trek, there is a lot to like about it. For one, the idea of a prequal series was a good one. I also liked most of the episodes, especially in Season 3 and 4, but my honest opinion of it is it isn't on the level as the other series. It was too plot driven/action oriented for my tastes. It was like Voyager, where we didn't really have time to stop and get to know the characters because there was a crisis or the ship being attacked. Of course we got some of those character episodes like The Forgotten and Home, but they came few and far between. Heck, even in the trilogies of the 4th season, it seemed like they were doing action for action's sake.
I will say though that on the levels of the best of Star Trek, the highest point of Enterprise for me was Azati Prime, Damage, and The Forgotten. All three of this episodes were so tight, compacted, and really served the characters so well. The things these people had to do were not good, but understandable, and in a small way they were still likable. The Forgotten is an episode I would place on the same levels as Inner Light and The Visitor, even though it doesn't make me cry as much.
I enjoyed it on the whole. It was the only Trek show I watched from beginning to end when it first aired, with both DS9 and Voyager I watched regularly and then only occasionally.
I remember on when learning it was canceled talking to a professor at my college, who was a Trek fan, that I'd much rather have BSG canceled and Enterprise continue. He agreed.
The fourth season had shown considerable improvement over the previous three, and even though my favorite character, Reed, had taken a diminished role, I liked where the show was going. I would have liked it to go for seven seasons.
I remember on when learning it was canceled talking to a professor at my college, who was a Trek fan, that I'd much rather have BSG canceled and Enterprise continue. He agreed.
The fourth season had shown considerable improvement over the previous three, and even though my favorite character, Reed, had taken a diminished role, I liked where the show was going. I would have liked it to go for seven seasons.
As a TOS fan I disagree. It violated a LOT of 'fannon'; but in all honesty, abiout the only thing onscreen that DIRECTLY contradiced TOS in a major way was the Romulans with ship cloaking tech in season 2's Minefield.
And they were throwing nods to TOS long before Season 4 came along (and I liked Season 4 a lot as well.) But, the show was definitely a TOS prequel.
As for my honest opinion of it: I liked in a lot. (It's my #2 favorite Star Trek series, right behind TOS at #1); and I've been watching Star Trek first run since 1969. Again a lot of the supposed 'canon' violations (except wahat I mentioned above) were more 'fanon' violations made by people who didn't know TOS canon all that well (including those who thought ENT Vulcans were 'out of character'. Vulcans in ENT were only out of character if you only knew the TNG portrayal of the race. If you saw TOS Journey to Babel or Amok Time ENT's Vulcans were great as a group that pre-dated the TOS Vulcans by 110 years or so. IMO - It was TNG and the other 24th century series that got the Vulcans 'wrong'.)
Tired, flat, and so frequently DULL. Honestly, until season 3, what gets me most about this "sci-fi action series" was how boring it so frequently was. I could barely get through early episodes like "strange new world," "vox sola," "civilization," etc.
It's like the writers had just ran out of gas or something. The horribly dull color scheme compared to the other Treks didn't help.
Archer was the worst captain of any series. The poor characterization of the Vulcans in this series just seemed so gratuitous at times.
And as mentioned by others on this thread, the juvenile "demographics stunts" they'd pull, with the embarrassing decon gel chamber scenes, etc. didn't help.
On the other hand, it did improve somewhat in seasons 3-4.
It's like the writers had just ran out of gas or something. The horribly dull color scheme compared to the other Treks didn't help.
Archer was the worst captain of any series. The poor characterization of the Vulcans in this series just seemed so gratuitous at times.
And as mentioned by others on this thread, the juvenile "demographics stunts" they'd pull, with the embarrassing decon gel chamber scenes, etc. didn't help.
On the other hand, it did improve somewhat in seasons 3-4.
While ENT was never my favorite series, I will say it grew on me.
I appreciated where they were taking it after the Xindi sotryline. I was just starting to get hopeful for the series and then it was canceled.
I appreciated where they were taking it after the Xindi sotryline. I was just starting to get hopeful for the series and then it was canceled.
My honest opinion, well... Let's see.
All in all, it was a decent series, reasonably short and not too boring. However, it implemented way too many generic Trek scripts (possibly unfilmed VOY or TNG episodes) that I certainly could live without. For instance, "Unexpected", "Shuttlepod One" or "Desert Crossing" just reek of Voyager. And stuff like "Vanishing Point", "Precious Cargo" or "Dawn" has been done to death, not only on Trek, but on SF television in general. Did we need to see more of that after 35 years of Trek?
All in all, it was a decent series, reasonably short and not too boring. However, it implemented way too many generic Trek scripts (possibly unfilmed VOY or TNG episodes) that I certainly could live without. For instance, "Unexpected", "Shuttlepod One" or "Desert Crossing" just reek of Voyager. And stuff like "Vanishing Point", "Precious Cargo" or "Dawn" has been done to death, not only on Trek, but on SF television in general. Did we need to see more of that after 35 years of Trek?
^ Unexpected was pretty bad. Desert Crossing, Vanishing Point, and Dawn were pretty generic but ultimately enjoyable. And, I think I might the only one who actually enjoyed Precious Cargo.
Nowhere Man
Commodore
Great idea, poorly executed. A lot of good episodes, never saw an episode I didn't like. I can't say the same for VOY or DS9. I take that back, These Are the Voyages is the worst episode if any television show to ever exist. I put Enterprise above DS9 and VOY. VOY being my least favorite and TNG being at the top, then TOS. Enterprise should have started at season four. The Xindi war should have been shorter and there should have been focus on the Romulan War.
I loved it, especially the Xindi arc. I didn't like how the first two seasons could have easily been done on TNG or Voyager, but they were still just OK. However, they were better than Voyager due to better internal continuity and better characters. Aside from the Xindi arc and Season 4, I especially liked how the series was more down-to-earth and fun than the other ones.
I started watching Enterprise the other day just out of a lack of anything to do. I never watched it when it was being aired on TV and honestly, I missed out.
It reminds me of TNG episodes I watched when I was a young teenager. However the characters are much more realistic and they are easy to empathize with. I like that the storys (while some are campy, and thats ok too at times) are a little darker, a little grittier.
It feels like star trek, reborn-ish. I know thats the feeling they were going for and I'm sad it got cancelled when/how it did.
It reminds me of TNG episodes I watched when I was a young teenager. However the characters are much more realistic and they are easy to empathize with. I like that the storys (while some are campy, and thats ok too at times) are a little darker, a little grittier.
It feels like star trek, reborn-ish. I know thats the feeling they were going for and I'm sad it got cancelled when/how it did.
There's a lot to like in ENT.
I rewatched a few season 1/2 (not sure which) episodes last week: Marauders and Fortunate Son. Marauders was really good. If you take it in the light-hearted vein in which it was intended and don't obsess over the "OMG premature first contact with the Ferengi" anxiety, it's a good episode. Now that I think about it, maybe the "aliens" weren't even Ferengi, but another species that looks like the Ferengi, just like most of the TOS aliens (Klingons included) looked remarkably human. So if you need a continuity-preserving solution, there it is.
Archer was very different from any of the other captains we've seen, but Bakula has a real charisma that I think comes across well. In Fortunate Son, when Mayweather is questioning Archer's decision-making, Bakula makes Archer almost self-effacing. Maybe it's not heroic, but I'd like to think it's the way I'd handle a nervous young ensign coming in to give me a piece of his mind.
And, like I said before, I really like the look of the show, more than any other (save maybe TOS, out of pure nostalgia).
Yes, there is a lot of silly stuff in ENT, but isn't that the story with all Trek? Nobody's going to convince me that T'Pol's catsuit represents a tremendous departure from the TOS skirt uniforms.
Honestly, there are a lot of episodes I don't particularly want to see again, but the ones that I like, I really like.
I rewatched a few season 1/2 (not sure which) episodes last week: Marauders and Fortunate Son. Marauders was really good. If you take it in the light-hearted vein in which it was intended and don't obsess over the "OMG premature first contact with the Ferengi" anxiety, it's a good episode. Now that I think about it, maybe the "aliens" weren't even Ferengi, but another species that looks like the Ferengi, just like most of the TOS aliens (Klingons included) looked remarkably human. So if you need a continuity-preserving solution, there it is.
Archer was very different from any of the other captains we've seen, but Bakula has a real charisma that I think comes across well. In Fortunate Son, when Mayweather is questioning Archer's decision-making, Bakula makes Archer almost self-effacing. Maybe it's not heroic, but I'd like to think it's the way I'd handle a nervous young ensign coming in to give me a piece of his mind.
And, like I said before, I really like the look of the show, more than any other (save maybe TOS, out of pure nostalgia).
Yes, there is a lot of silly stuff in ENT, but isn't that the story with all Trek? Nobody's going to convince me that T'Pol's catsuit represents a tremendous departure from the TOS skirt uniforms.
Honestly, there are a lot of episodes I don't particularly want to see again, but the ones that I like, I really like.
"Enterprise" was a tremendous disappointment for me, mainly because for some reason I had high hopes that Mr. Berman and Mr. Braga really, surely, this time absolutely would throw away the baggage they had built up over several seasons of Voyager and create a new blueprint for an altogether new and better show.
There are actually innumerable reasons why I was disappointed, but let me stick with the top 3.
1. It wasn't really a prequel, just Trek in an older timeframe. Originally the show promised to explain the creation of Starfleet, the birth of the Federation, the decisions that led up to the way things worked in TOS and afterwards, the intrigue and drama of the forging of this newer, better world. And we actually saw none of that. In fact, ENT ended up lopping off Florida in a tragic act of terrorism that interrupted whatever drama and intrigue there would have been (insert backstory here). And then, in a final insult to the viewer, ENT tried to zip tight the huge, gaping hole of unfulfilled promises in a single episode of The Next Generation in a little vacation time on the holodeck.
2. What a waste of great screen talent. Folks may hate Robert Beltran from Voyager for openly complaining about how much his character sucked; but you have to admit, at every opportunity, the new classes of writers both pre- and post-Xindi made efforts to render the main characters as wooden and dull-as-dishwater as Chakotay. T'Pol died halfway into the first season; Jolene Blalock, a fine actress, diligently tried to resuscitate her and failed. Where there were great episodes, they were in large part due to Connor Trinneer. And now that we know for absolute certain that Scott Bakula remains a versatile, gifted performer. . . A Night in Sickbay? That's what you give him? Tell me Bakula would have accepted this role if he were given that script instead of the pilot.
3. Portions of ENT were the sequel to Voyager. Particularly those parts that continue the same "shorthand" that Braga and the others used for Voyager, to quickly speed through the same series of events that get repeated over and over. You know what I mean: "They're charging weapons." "Hail them." "No response." "Polarize the hull plating." Boom. "Hull plating down to 68%." Boom. "Down to 32%. We can't take another hit." "Return fire." Thwack. "Direct hit." "They're signaling us." "Open a channel." Beep. "This is the captain of the starship Voya - I mean, Enterprise. Explain yourself." Etc. With all the character boiled out of the characters until they had no more personality than the extras walking back and forth through the fake corridors, when they did have something to say to each other, it seemed out of place. Tucker and T'Pol have a relationship? Why?? Because she's female and he's not? No. . . It's for the same reasons Seven had a relationship with Chakotay. "We needed some sex." Situations were written and things were done not to build up the plot, but to get it over with.
In the end, the series felt like something a C-student would turn in to me to be graded, rather than an attempt to impress me and hold my attention for an hour. When it was good, it was nice. When it was bad, it was worse than bad Trek. It was bad television.
-DF "'A Night in Sickbay' was Well-Named, Though" Scott
There are actually innumerable reasons why I was disappointed, but let me stick with the top 3.
1. It wasn't really a prequel, just Trek in an older timeframe. Originally the show promised to explain the creation of Starfleet, the birth of the Federation, the decisions that led up to the way things worked in TOS and afterwards, the intrigue and drama of the forging of this newer, better world. And we actually saw none of that. In fact, ENT ended up lopping off Florida in a tragic act of terrorism that interrupted whatever drama and intrigue there would have been (insert backstory here). And then, in a final insult to the viewer, ENT tried to zip tight the huge, gaping hole of unfulfilled promises in a single episode of The Next Generation in a little vacation time on the holodeck.
2. What a waste of great screen talent. Folks may hate Robert Beltran from Voyager for openly complaining about how much his character sucked; but you have to admit, at every opportunity, the new classes of writers both pre- and post-Xindi made efforts to render the main characters as wooden and dull-as-dishwater as Chakotay. T'Pol died halfway into the first season; Jolene Blalock, a fine actress, diligently tried to resuscitate her and failed. Where there were great episodes, they were in large part due to Connor Trinneer. And now that we know for absolute certain that Scott Bakula remains a versatile, gifted performer. . . A Night in Sickbay? That's what you give him? Tell me Bakula would have accepted this role if he were given that script instead of the pilot.
3. Portions of ENT were the sequel to Voyager. Particularly those parts that continue the same "shorthand" that Braga and the others used for Voyager, to quickly speed through the same series of events that get repeated over and over. You know what I mean: "They're charging weapons." "Hail them." "No response." "Polarize the hull plating." Boom. "Hull plating down to 68%." Boom. "Down to 32%. We can't take another hit." "Return fire." Thwack. "Direct hit." "They're signaling us." "Open a channel." Beep. "This is the captain of the starship Voya - I mean, Enterprise. Explain yourself." Etc. With all the character boiled out of the characters until they had no more personality than the extras walking back and forth through the fake corridors, when they did have something to say to each other, it seemed out of place. Tucker and T'Pol have a relationship? Why?? Because she's female and he's not? No. . . It's for the same reasons Seven had a relationship with Chakotay. "We needed some sex." Situations were written and things were done not to build up the plot, but to get it over with.
In the end, the series felt like something a C-student would turn in to me to be graded, rather than an attempt to impress me and hold my attention for an hour. When it was good, it was nice. When it was bad, it was worse than bad Trek. It was bad television.
-DF "'A Night in Sickbay' was Well-Named, Though" Scott
Saquist
Commodore
My honest opinion is that it should get 5 out of 10. It had some good stories now and then, but I can't think of any episodes that warrant "best ever" status. No The Inner Lights/Darmoks/The Drumheads/In the Pale Moonlights/Duets/Year of Hells.
Season 4 was well done, especially the Klingon Augments and the Aenar episodes. One thing also is that Linda Park is seriously hot!And smart too, she can speak four languages.
Notice the pattern...
NX copied from Akira
Enterprise tech copied from TNG
Best episodes of ENT copied from TOS, TNG and DS9.
If you ignore what I would call artistic plagiarism to the extreme and look at the show itself...yes it's entertaining even with one Massively HAMMY actor and 2 Wooden actors.
But it wasn't going to win any awards or popularity contest. It wasn't special. If you're like me then you can't ignore the plagiarism and the failure of the show to identity. Surely the kids that grew up on ENT will look back on it fondly. Older Trek Fans usually find it a pretentious exercise of copy and paste and the hard core think it's one big canon violation.
Mostly forgettable, but there were some great episodes.
You lasted a season longer than me.
It soured the milk. I stopped caring. Hardly watched any Trek since. Still not seen the new movie.
I grew up on TOS and TAS reruns in the 1970s; I don't know if that makes me an "older" Trek fan or not. I think ENT is a good show. It's not like any of the other series represent the pinnacle of high art or anything.
Saquist
Commodore
Mileage will vary.
It all depends on what one finds important in a TV series or story. Many people just want to be entertained but others are more discriminating.
I tuned into the first episode out of curiosity. And there were two things that annoyed me almost immediately.
Firstly: they name the first Klingon we see, Klang. Klang???
They couldn't be fucking serious! It was if they were deliberately trying to say something stupid about their own show. Who the hell would name a character with such a stupid sounding name???
The second thing that really annoyed me was the patronizing attitude of the Vulcans and how they supposedly mentored humanity into space beyond our solar system. It really grated on my nerves and went against the impression I got from TOS that we had gotten into deep space all on our own. I really didn't like what ENT setup and was suggesting. Of course, they were taking their cue from a film that I thought was eminently stupid anyway.
After that I'd drop in every now and then and occasionally would see a nugget of interest, but nothing of substance. And as someone said upthread the show was basically rehashing previous ideas yet in a lacklustre manner. It had nothing of its own. It really was TNG/VOY redux in a different setting.
Firstly: they name the first Klingon we see, Klang. Klang???
They couldn't be fucking serious! It was if they were deliberately trying to say something stupid about their own show. Who the hell would name a character with such a stupid sounding name???The second thing that really annoyed me was the patronizing attitude of the Vulcans and how they supposedly mentored humanity into space beyond our solar system. It really grated on my nerves and went against the impression I got from TOS that we had gotten into deep space all on our own. I really didn't like what ENT setup and was suggesting. Of course, they were taking their cue from a film that I thought was eminently stupid anyway.
After that I'd drop in every now and then and occasionally would see a nugget of interest, but nothing of substance. And as someone said upthread the show was basically rehashing previous ideas yet in a lacklustre manner. It had nothing of its own. It really was TNG/VOY redux in a different setting.
