Why don't you grab one of them by the hand and show them the delights? Put it into their 'untouched crevice' when they want you to, by the way.
No, I bet some of them are alright. Some of them must be quite loving.
Modern Day Society- Male Dating Issues
- Thread starter Mr Silver
- Start date
Why don't you grab one of them by the hand and show them the delights? Put it into their 'untouched crevice' when they want you to, by the way.
No, I bet some of them are alright. Some of them must be quite loving.
Char Aznable
Lieutenant Commander
Understandable.
No, no they seriously aren't. They don't deserve anything beyond our contempt because they are perfectly content with being the pathetic failures they are.
EDIT: To expand my point, I will agree to an extent. There are members there who occasionally bring up valid points and seem to be on the right track. However, these brave souls soon get declared as trolls and are outright banned for daring to imply that it might actually be their own fault they aren't getting any.
Not wanting to be rude, but can we stop with this and get back to relationships? I'm not at all comfortable with this. No-one is worthy of "utter disdain", and particularly not because they dare to be a part of some online forum somewhere. And particularly when they sound like they have troubling psychological/mental health/esteem issues that really need working on.
Why can't people discuss sexuality without it turning into a hate-filled attack on the "pathetic failures" who can't handle relationships (for whatever reason), who are pretty much described as subhuman ("people" rather than people, "don't deserve to breed" comments)?
EDIT: Sorry about this. I'm not deleting the post, because I genuinely feel this way, but I do apologise for the sudden "stop it!!" I just get jittery when hate crops up- whether it's the general misanthropy in that forum or the comments here.
Why can't people discuss sexuality without it turning into a hate-filled attack on the "pathetic failures" who can't handle relationships (for whatever reason), who are pretty much described as subhuman ("people" rather than people, "don't deserve to breed" comments)?
EDIT: Sorry about this. I'm not deleting the post, because I genuinely feel this way, but I do apologise for the sudden "stop it!!" I just get jittery when hate crops up- whether it's the general misanthropy in that forum or the comments here.
Char Aznable
Lieutenant Commander
You're not getting it. These people aren't awful because they have deep personal issues (though I'm sure a lot of them are just butthurt), the point is these people have a deep need to work on themselves . . . but they DON'T. They just wallow in their misery, content to be so as it validates their opinion on the universe. Seriously, actually read through that forum.
Well, I personally don't see having sex/relationships as a right, but as a privilage. Not everyone is going to be as successful as another. However, its not THAT hard and it certainly isn't this super secret clubhouse that all the cool kids get to be in, who are purposely excluding the loveshies from. Getting a woman is a challenge that these creeps genuinely believe they're being deliberately sabotaaged from.
In other words, the reason I despise the love-shy forums is that they blame everything about their, "condition," (which isn't even real BTW) on every thing in their lives . . . except themselves.
I understand your distaste for their outlook; I share it.
But I don't see how hate and aggression helps, other than to reinforce their view that everyone and everything is working against them and thus they should hate the world and all the people in it who are successful. I'm sure we'd agree that if we see someone contemplating throwing themselves off a bridge, screaming "Jump you worthless scum!!" isn't going to help. So when considering these people, why feed right into their hands by giving them the response they "want" and "expect"- namely, that everyone hates them and they are right to stand opposed to the world, which is itself against them? How can they work to better themselves, or come to the understanding that they need to change their outlook, when you're reinforcing the answer they have now- which is that the world is knowingly and aggressively opposed to them?
EDIT: And as Kestra said, plenty of people in all walks of life have difficulty accepting that they need to work on themselves or take responsibility for their situation. The best you can do is offer advice- minus any aggression, which will just negate the wisdom you're trying to communicate. Where is the logic in challenging someone who feels themselves a victimized outcast...if you treat them like an outcast to be victimized?
Char Aznable
Lieutenant Commander
The thing is that people have often tried to offer them advice. I've seen more than one post by girls giving their take on the situation or males who've overcome their shyness, what have you. The thing is, they don't want to learn how to better themselves. I'm not going anything to reinforce their believes because they already firmly believe that anything that doesn't fit into the consensus of their play house is wrong (using words like mangina to describe a man who actually is nice to a pretty lady). They even have coded colors for whenever someone says something on their board they don't like (code red, code pink, etc.) and they respond in kind.
You likely think I'm making all this up. I found this forum and the stories about it hard to believe until I saw it first hand. The more I read, the harder it is to feel sympathy for any of them. ESPECIALLY the ones who glorify/sympathize with George Sodini.
I don't think you're making it up at all.
Believe me, I know firsthand just how unbelievable many people are; I've navigated my way around more than a few online forums myself (representing people of all ages, creeds, genders, backrounds and issues) where it was very, very hard not to react with disgust at the majority of comments and outlooks. But that's a sign of the deep dysfunction in society and I view these people as needing help and aid. We simply can't let people get to us- or we'd be ourselves dysfunctional, bitter and wallowing in our problems rather than solving them, just like those people we observe. That's how I see it, anyway.
Char Aznable
Lieutenant Commander
Well, see, there is where I differ. I agree that a lot of these people need some help, but the majority of their issues would be addressed if they acknowledged the fact that THEY are the reason they continually lose the dating game (or on some cases, can't get to the starters line). Some of these people have seen shrinks/self help groups, but often give up when results aren't fast enough or they are forced to work outside their confort zone. My compassion quickly dies when someone is offered advice on how to improve themselves, only to be met with an, "LOL NUH UH, U CONFORMIST BETA MANGINA!"I don't think you're making it up at all.
Basically, I feel that if you refuse to work on yourself (even a little) in order to better approach women, you forfeit the right to complain about being a permavirgin.
If you were going for over the top, abrasive, and creepifying - you nailed it right there.
I agree...As the thread starter, the intention was not to make cheap, snide little remarks and theres been a bit of it going on, whilst I appreciate everyones opinions, I think people need to be mindful that a couple of posters have opened up and expressed their feelings, which have been shot down by said comments, whilst I can appreciate humor, its vergin on being pretty degrading to women
Sorry for being a killjoy, but I was hoping for some intelligent discussion regarding a surge in men reporting difficulty in finding love, if people can't do this, then don't post in this thread
Anyway, if we can all change the subject
I've been going over some of the threads in the "Love Shy" forum that a previous poster linked, I think while some of the content is disturbing, there is also legitimate content from users on the board, who haven't really had an opportunity to gain self esteem because of their circumstances, whether they didn't fit in at school, or they were sheltered from normal teenage socialising by their family, can that really determine lack of self esteem in adult life, however?
Of course a person's upbringing with affect their adult social functions and self-esteem. I know that it affected how I made friends as an adult.
I think a big issue with some people who are lonely is that they set such high standards that they are unable to meet anyone who meet those standards. Not every woman is Natalie Portman.
I think a big issue with some people who are lonely is that they set such high standards that they are unable to meet anyone who meet those standards. Not every woman is Natalie Portman.
Why do you know so much about what goes on in a forum filled with "the scum of the Earth"? I agree with you that those posters have some pretty severe emotional problems and they are wallowing in self-pity rather than improving their lives, but why do you even care? Millions upons millions of people around the world wallow in self-pity and are just as bitter as those "love shys". Do you just go to that website to laugh at all the "fucked up weirdos"? I don't understand this hatred you have for them.
I think one of the problems with males who identify as "Love Shy" is they have no knowledge of how to attract women...
But who does? there isn't a set way of doing it, unless of course your a complete pig and you follow the "PUA" code and prey on emotionally vulnerable women in order to score
But who does? there isn't a set way of doing it, unless of course your a complete pig and you follow the "PUA" code and prey on emotionally vulnerable women in order to score
A
Amaris
Guest
^
Very good J.
Thank you, Blur.
He was a very wise man, if I may say so. The potential for love and a relationship outweighs the downsides on such a massive scale, that it's only after you've succeeded, that you realize just how amazingly easy it can be to connect on a human level with someone, and that it is so worth it, that your fears are trivial in comparison.
I always get a chuckle out of polls where women are asked which attributes a man needs to have for him to be attractive to them.. the list always goes like humor, understanding, intelligence etc.. and maybe (i stress maybe) the list will include looks and/or a good job (mostly the first).
Reality is that looks will get you noticed and makes you attractive.. you can be the funniest and most knowledgeable guy in the room but women tend to congregate on the tall and well built guys before they even consider noticing you,
Part of it is genetics and instinct but i'd really like women to be honest to themselves and outright admit that they'd rather prefer the athletic or normal sized guy to the chubby, fat or small ones. It would at least be honest but i also believe that those relationships that are built on appearance and style alone are almost always doomed to fail because there's no substance to them.
However those guys who, when feeling secure in themselves, i.e. surrounded by things or people familiar to them are charming, funny and intelligent immediately clamp up when they meet a woman they'd like to date. It's because they are ashamed to be fat, nerdy or not be that successful in life and self esteem goes right out of the window alongside self confidence.
I'm like that and it has kept me back.. those few times i managed to overcome that i've always been rewarded and if it only was a short affair or a one night stand
So in reality it's up to personal confidence.. you may not "get" every woman you want (some just do want that perfect athlete's body and won't budge an inch) but those who manage to look past the physical appearence might be women who are really interesting and worth getting to know.
Reality is that looks will get you noticed and makes you attractive.. you can be the funniest and most knowledgeable guy in the room but women tend to congregate on the tall and well built guys before they even consider noticing you,
Part of it is genetics and instinct but i'd really like women to be honest to themselves and outright admit that they'd rather prefer the athletic or normal sized guy to the chubby, fat or small ones. It would at least be honest but i also believe that those relationships that are built on appearance and style alone are almost always doomed to fail because there's no substance to them.
However those guys who, when feeling secure in themselves, i.e. surrounded by things or people familiar to them are charming, funny and intelligent immediately clamp up when they meet a woman they'd like to date. It's because they are ashamed to be fat, nerdy or not be that successful in life and self esteem goes right out of the window alongside self confidence.
I'm like that and it has kept me back.. those few times i managed to overcome that i've always been rewarded and if it only was a short affair or a one night stand
So in reality it's up to personal confidence.. you may not "get" every woman you want (some just do want that perfect athlete's body and won't budge an inch) but those who manage to look past the physical appearence might be women who are really interesting and worth getting to know.
Well, I'm 22 and never had a girlfriend. Am I pleased about that? Not really. ...but is it a big deal? Not really. It is a fact.
Let's look at the facts. I've never been in any kind of classroom situation, homeschooled my whole non-adult life.
As a teenager, I was a member of a small church with less than 100 members in it, and that was my only social interaction. There were probably less than ten girls there, and nobody was allowed to date/court without parental permission. I mustered enough courage to ask for permission from parents on two occasions (but was denied authorization), so... suffice to say that my teenage years were NOT condusive to any kind of normal dating.
As an adult, I inherited the job of taking care of my mentally messed up mother. Sexy job... NOT! On other fronts, I've held some other jobs to suppliment my income over the last four years. I work at Walmart now, and view that as a long-term career interest. First of all, I believe in professionalism in the workplace, and hitting on girls in a place where you're hoping to make a career seems like a potentially bad, bad idea. Besides, since I have no experience hitting on girls, It wouldn't come naturally.
I have never met someone who I really liked without wierd inhibiting circumstances; but even if I did, it wouldn't matter... because in the end, everything comes down to money. I don't have the kind of stable job necessary to support a family yet. Heck, I still wind up scraping the bottom of the fiscal barrel sometimes just to afford my present lifestyle of Starbucks, work, and keeping the lights on. My life has never been condusive to fostering romance, and I know that.
My single advantage is that I do know that. In time, my finances will mature. My job will mature. My life will get more stable, more normal. For the present, I'm pretty content; and I've found that it is easier to make something of where you are when you aren't trying to get somewhere else in a hurry.
Let's look at the facts. I've never been in any kind of classroom situation, homeschooled my whole non-adult life.
As a teenager, I was a member of a small church with less than 100 members in it, and that was my only social interaction. There were probably less than ten girls there, and nobody was allowed to date/court without parental permission. I mustered enough courage to ask for permission from parents on two occasions (but was denied authorization), so... suffice to say that my teenage years were NOT condusive to any kind of normal dating.
As an adult, I inherited the job of taking care of my mentally messed up mother. Sexy job... NOT! On other fronts, I've held some other jobs to suppliment my income over the last four years. I work at Walmart now, and view that as a long-term career interest. First of all, I believe in professionalism in the workplace, and hitting on girls in a place where you're hoping to make a career seems like a potentially bad, bad idea. Besides, since I have no experience hitting on girls, It wouldn't come naturally.
I have never met someone who I really liked without wierd inhibiting circumstances; but even if I did, it wouldn't matter... because in the end, everything comes down to money. I don't have the kind of stable job necessary to support a family yet. Heck, I still wind up scraping the bottom of the fiscal barrel sometimes just to afford my present lifestyle of Starbucks, work, and keeping the lights on. My life has never been condusive to fostering romance, and I know that.
My single advantage is that I do know that. In time, my finances will mature. My job will mature. My life will get more stable, more normal. For the present, I'm pretty content; and I've found that it is easier to make something of where you are when you aren't trying to get somewhere else in a hurry.
Char Aznable
Lieutenant Commander
Really, I didn't even remember them until this thread and the other one reminded me. I first discovered this site years ago when I myself was feeling lonely and thought no one really understood what I was going through. I never registered as a user, but I merely lurked seeing how people I thought were like me interacted. It was interesting at first and some of what was said occasionally hit home with me. However, as I read, the more and more disgusted I became with the woman hating, blame everyone else but myself bullshit that has spread all throughout that forum.
Suddenly it hit me. Do people no longer want to be virgins? The best way to do that would be to NOT spend your days on a website dedicated to how no woman will let you sleep with her. Seriously, you can do literally anything else with your time and it will still be better than asking a forum of permavirgins how to get laid. I mean, if these people want to continue to wallow in their little hug box, their chances of scoring are literally zero percent. So, I set out to improve myself and focus on things more important than girls (school, hobbies, music) and reassessed my values. I began making friends and discovered that if you make alot of friends, some of them have friends who they'd LOVE to set you up with!
And no, I don't get lulz out of the loveshies, contrary to popular belief. Really, they're more rage inducing than anything. I go there if I think my blood pressure is a little low.
This is good advice except for one thing. I learned the hard way that when a woman says no, it's NO. It's okay to approach them and ask them out, but DON'T PUSH.
For many years, no woman would go out with me because I have cerebral palsy. I was told to my face on one occasion that I wasn't worth dating because of my wheelchair. She called me a retarded crippled freak. But that was only one incident. The rest of the time, the women who turned me down admitted it was because of the chair, but were polite about it, and wished me luck, but also made it clear that I was to leave them alone. Once, when I was younger, I got desperate and refused to take no for an answer. That led to a very ugly situation that for a while, destroyed my self esteem and left me feeling worthless. After that, I decided I was never going to put myself in that position again. From then on, I asked a lady out, got told no, or "go to hell" or whatever, I just shook it off and moved on. I was lonely alot of the time, but what can you do?
Thankfully, that all came to an end last year.
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