The Doctor and His Regenerations

[TyberiusDeAngelo]

There is something about the way RTD handled the Tenth Doctor's regeneration into the Eleventh Doctor that doesn't sit right with me. I will admit upfront that I am not familiar with the older Doctor Who episodes, only the NuWho with the 9th,10th, and 11th Doctors, so if there is something from the older series that explains what I am talking about please forgive me.

The way I saw the 9th's regeneration into the 10 is that he was the same man with a new body. Ten picked up right where nine left off on going to Barcelona and then asked Rose what he looked like. It appeared to me he just changed and went about his business. I understand that each regeneration means a new personality for the Doctor but he still retains his memories....hatred for the Dalek, loves the Tardis, won't use guns, etc. He even tells Rose and Harriet Jones he is the same man with a new face. So that has been the assumption I have thought of the Doctor until "The End of Time"

The Tenth Doctor's comment to Donna's father about each regeneration feeling like death and some new man walks away seemed odd to me because again isn't he still the same person with a different body/personality? I know that regeneration is not something that should be taken lightly because he has a limited number and doesn't want to waste them. So, is each Doctor a seperate entity that just shares the memories of the pervious Doctor? Or is the Doctor at the core the same person with just a different face?

Finally, can the Doctor change sexes or regenerate into someone that does not look human? Eleven seemed happy to have legs, arms, fingers, and thought for a moment he was a girl.

Thank you for your comments

 

[Whofan]

Regeneration does change the personality-it's established in the classic series several times. I believe the very first audio drama reveals that the Doctor's brain chemistry is 'rebalanced' every regeneration.

In "Destiny of the Daleks" the Doctor's time lady companion, Romana, seems to regenerate into at least one non-human body. So I think it's possible.


The novels (and some of the comics) do establish that the Doctor's personas are sort of stored in his mind or something like that-there are times in the classic series where he 'channels' a prior persona.

 

[Worf2DS9]

The Tenth Doctor's comment to Donna's father about each regeneration feeling like death and some new man walks away seemed odd to me because again isn't he still the same person with a different body/personality?

I think Ten was really upset at the prospect of an upcoming regeneration because he really liked his current incarnation and didn't want to change. (Sort of like how he told Five in "Time Crash" that he really liked being him - even though technically he's the same guy). Ten would become a "new man" in a sense because he wouldn't be the exact same as he was before. I think he was rather over-emotional at this stage and a bit cranky at the though of regenerating.

(I like to think of it as something similar to the Trills on DS9. The symbiont Dax is like the Doctor, the man, while the hosts are like the various incarnations he regenerates into. The symbiont (the Doctor) goes through an assortment of hosts (incarnations) over its lifetime, while retaining memories, skills, etc. Dax itself remains the same while it has a variety of different bodies that also come with their own distinct personalities.)

Finally, can the Doctor change sexes or regenerate into someone that does not look human? Eleven seemed happy to have legs, arms, fingers, and thought for a moment he was a girl.

As you stated, changing sexes is a possibility, as Eleven thought that might have happened briefly. And Nine pondered the possibility of coming back with two heads, or no heads. As for not looking human, well, the Time Lords look humanoid, so I don't imagine the Doctor would want to change into anything else. Of course, Nine also mentioned that regeneration is "a bit dodgy. You never know what you'll end up with." So who knows!

 

[Kitty Worrier]

The Tenth Doctor's comment to Donna's father about each regeneration feeling like death and some new man walks away seemed odd to me because again isn't he still the same person with a different body/personality?

I think Ten was really upset at the prospect of an upcoming regeneration because he really liked his current incarnation and didn't want to change.

That would make sense... there were times it seemed like the Doctor hated himself when he was Nine. If he likes who he is again (as Ten), he woud not want to give that up.

 

[David cgc]

Also, the Tenth Doctor had that interrupted regeneration. My impression is that the process kind of sucks up through the dying part, but he's usually so giddy with his new body, it blunts the pain of losing the old one. Until "Journey's End," he'd never had to face just the bad parts, so this time, he was far more keenly aware of what he'd be losing, and not so much considering that the new Doctor might be a cool person to be, too. It gave him more existential dread of the moment than usual. Not to mention that he'd had a rough couple of years during which he knew it was coming.

Though, in several of the prior regenerations (generally the ones he was conscious for), there was always a sense of melancholy leading up to it. For instance, Nine was talking to Rose like he was never going to see her again.

The analogue I like to think of it is the personality change of a regeneration is like that of normal life experience, but all at once. Imagine just skipping from being a surly middle schooler to a college grad, or from a dateless slacker teen to a happily married person with a job and two-point-five kids. Or, heck, backwards from being a retired grandfather to a Chaplin-esque tramp. You'd barely recognize yourself. You might even be afraid of the change and think you'd hate living that way (I'm getting up at seven every morning and never sleep until two? Dude, sucks!). But you'd still be the same person, but a different same person.

 

[DWF]

The Doctor: I can still die. If I'm killed before regeneration, then I'm dead. Even then, even if I change, it feels like dying. Everything I am dies. Some new man goes sauntering away... and I'm dead.

This is one of the better lines of the entire series old or new IMO and I can't think of any of the Doctors who went out willingly, all the regenerations were done to save his life in one way or another. His first body was too old, the second Doctor complained that people knew him on earth so the Time Lords changed him, the third Doctor died of radiation just as the tenth did, the fourth fell off a radio telescope and so forth.

Yes he's got the same memories and in many ways is the same man, but the man he was no longer exists in a way as well.

 

[The Borgified Corpse]

The 10th Doctor doesn't cope well... with ANYTHING.

 

[Tom]

it really makes your wonder if the dreamlord/valeyard is is some how 10 trying to get out.

 

[Galileo7]

The Doctor...
Yes he's got the same memories and in many ways is the same man, but the man he was no longer exists in a way as well.

It is the best excuse ever created for the ability to recast a part with a new actor without any need to question the character continuing intact.

 

[DWF]

The 10th Doctor doesn't cope well... with ANYTHING.

Yeah well, there's no easy way to deal with slavery, genocide, opression and murder. At least he didn't call his companion "just another stupid ape".

 

[starsuperion]

The Doctor...
Yes he's got the same memories and in many ways is the same man, but the man he was no longer exists in a way as well.

It is the best excuse ever created for the ability to recast a part with a new actor without any need to question the character continuing intact.

I disagree with that statement..

in many respects, I find that Matt Smith and other doctors channel and mimic certain aspects of the former doctors actors..

in many ways, Matt Smith embodies the 2nd doctor and some of the 10th..with a large portion of Troughton's charm and pin-ash..Most regens have held some semblance of the former.. that is except davidson, who had no personality what so ever..

 

[Starkers]

The statement's perfectly valid, it is the greatest excuse ever for recasting the lead character without the new person having to slavishly try to mimic the last guy (in fact mimicing the last guy is usually the last thing you want to do).

And whether you like Peter Davison or not it's unfair to suggest he didn't take on characteristics of other Doctors--he was doing the grumpy befuddled old man in a young man's body decades before Smith; the difference is that Smith's take is more natural.

Lets be honest, whatever your view, there's a damn sight more of Hartnell's performance in Davison's than there ever was in Tom's. Sometimes I think people take loudness and scene stealing to equate to personality.

Ah well, Steven Moffat agree with me when it comes to Peter Davison at least, and he knows a thing or two

 

[The]

Lets be honest, whatever your view, there's a damn sight more of Hartnell's performance in Davison's than there ever was in Tom's. Sometimes I think people take loudness and scene stealing to equate to personality.

Couldn't agree more. "Loudness", in fact, immediately turns me off. Makes me think the actor can't sell a scene without overdoing every bit of acting. Davison may not be my absolute favorite Doctor, but the actor played it with such subtlety that if you're just looking for a cookie-cutter superhero like Tennant you would never catch the sincerity in Peter's performance...

 

[Captaindemotion]

That's the first time I've ever seen anyone disparage Davison's performance so much. I always thought he did a great job in replacing the man who had, at that stage, come to be viewed as the Definitive Doctor.

I always viewed Davison as the last great Doctor of the original series; C Baker and McCoy did nothing for me.

 

[Mark_Nguyen]

[Nostalgic-philosphical digression a-comin'...]

I view the dying thing as true in THAT Doctors mind, anyway. We ALL change considerably over our lifetimes, but as a Time Lord he has pretty defined lines about how that happens, AND a huge physical change to boot.

I'm certainly a different man three years ago to where I am now, versus the post-college nerd I'd been for a decade. I'm now happily married with a daughter, with a FRACTION of the time I used to have to geek out about Trek, Who or anime. But I'm very happy regardless of these changes, and still the same man with the same knowledge and memories as before, but a whole different outlook on things. And having lost thirty pounds in that time, you could say I've undergone large physical changes too. :P

Point being, when you think about it, regeneration IS change, but one that can still be analogous to what everyone goes through anyway. Would the me of three years ago think that getting to be the me of today would mean the death of him? Going from spending time and energy on discussing warp nacelles and artron energy to discussing my next mortgage terms and what school my kid should go to? Probably. And yet here I am, the same man sauntering around, but different. The Tenth Doctor may not have liked it, but other Doctors may have been innately wise enough to understand that shit happens, you deal with it, and move on.

Mark

 

[The]

^Well said. I like that.

 

[DWF]

It is the best excuse ever created for the ability to recast a part with a new actor without any need to question the character continuing intact.

I disagree with that statement..

in many respects, I find that Matt Smith and other doctors channel and mimic certain aspects of the former doctors actors..

in many ways, Matt Smith embodies the 2nd doctor and some of the 10th..with a large portion of Troughton's charm and pin-ash..Most regens have held some semblance of the former.. that is except davidson, who had no personality what so ever..

Davison's Doctor was meant as a combination of Troughton and Hartnell, he wasn't meant as a dominate Doctor the way Pertwee and Tom Baker was before him. I can see other Doctors in Tennant's Doctor as well including Davison's.

Tenth Doctor: You know, I loved being you. Back when I first started, at the very beginning, I was always trying to be old and grumpy and important, like you do when you're young. And then I was you, and it was all dashing about and playing cricket and my voice going all squeaky when I shout. I still do that, the voice thing, I got that from you! Oh, and the trainers, and [puts on his glasses] snap. 'Cos you know what, Doctor? You were my Doctor.

And that was written by Moffat himself.

 

[C.E. Evans]

I remember longtime Doctor Who novelist Terrance Dicks describing the Fourth Doctor as "having the intellectual arrogance of the First, the humor of the Second, the flamboyance of the Third" with perhaps a child-like curiosity of his own.

I recall someone else saying the Fifth Doctor had the occasional crankyness of the First Doctor with the vulnerability of the Second Doctor--there was always a possibility that he could be defeated.

The Sixth Doctor was said to also have the short temper of the First Doctor, but also a biting sarcastic wit.

The Seventh Doctor...started off humorous and comedic, but supposedly turned considerably less so towards the end, even somewhat manipulative and slightly sinister perhaps?

 

[Shatnertage]

[Nostalgic-philosphical digression a-comin'...]

I view the dying thing as true in THAT Doctors mind, anyway. We ALL change considerably over our lifetimes, but as a Time Lord he has pretty defined lines about how that happens, AND a huge physical change to boot.

I'm certainly a different man three years ago to where I am now, versus the post-college nerd I'd been for a decade. I'm now happily married with a daughter, with a FRACTION of the time I used to have to geek out about Trek, Who or anime. But I'm very happy regardless of these changes, and still the same man with the same knowledge and memories as before, but a whole different outlook on things. And having lost thirty pounds in that time, you could say I've undergone large physical changes too. :P

Point being, when you think about it, regeneration IS change, but one that can still be analogous to what everyone goes through anyway. Would the me of three years ago think that getting to be the me of today would mean the death of him? Going from spending time and energy on discussing warp nacelles and artron energy to discussing my next mortgage terms and what school my kid should go to? Probably. And yet here I am, the same man sauntering around, but different. The Tenth Doctor may not have liked it, but other Doctors may have been innately wise enough to understand that shit happens, you deal with it, and move on.

Mark

This is unexpectedly profound, and completely true.

 

[The Borgified Corpse]

[Nostalgic-philosphical digression a-comin'...]

I view the dying thing as true in THAT Doctors mind, anyway. We ALL change considerably over our lifetimes, but as a Time Lord he has pretty defined lines about how that happens, AND a huge physical change to boot.

I'm certainly a different man three years ago to where I am now, versus the post-college nerd I'd been for a decade. I'm now happily married with a daughter, with a FRACTION of the time I used to have to geek out about Trek, Who or anime. But I'm very happy regardless of these changes, and still the same man with the same knowledge and memories as before, but a whole different outlook on things. And having lost thirty pounds in that time, you could say I've undergone large physical changes too. :P

Point being, when you think about it, regeneration IS change, but one that can still be analogous to what everyone goes through anyway. Would the me of three years ago think that getting to be the me of today would mean the death of him? Going from spending time and energy on discussing warp nacelles and artron energy to discussing my next mortgage terms and what school my kid should go to? Probably. And yet here I am, the same man sauntering around, but different. The Tenth Doctor may not have liked it, but other Doctors may have been innately wise enough to understand that shit happens, you deal with it, and move on.

Well said. To put it more briefly, I'm reminded of a line from Buffy the Vampire Slayer. It's during Whistler's voiceover at the end of "Becoming, Part 1."
"Bottom line is, even if you see 'em coming, you're not ready for the big moments. No one asks for their life to change, not really. But it does. So what are we, helpless? Puppets? No. The big moments are gonna come. You can't help that. It's what you do afterwards that counts. That's when you find out who you are."

I remember longtime Doctor Who novelist Terrance Dicks describing the Fourth Doctor as "having the intellectual arrogance of the First, the humor of the Second, the flamboyance of the Third" with perhaps a child-like curiosity of his own.

While I think that there are some ostensible qualities that Tom Baker had in common with his predecessors, it combined in a very different way. Most new Doctors, either deliberately or by virtue of the way they're written, contain some obvious personality elements of their predecessors. (I've definately felt the continuity between Eccleston, Tennant, & Smith. There are times where I'll hear Smith's voice in my head saying a line, then realize that the line is from a Tennant episode. I used to do the same thing with Tennant & Eccleston.) But I think Tom Baker was a very clean break. Aside from a couple scenes with the Brigadier in "Robot," I can never see any other Doctors in Tom Baker's performance.