Resolutions pissed me off

[Anthony Sabre]

Long time DS9 fan here; picked up VOY season 1-3 and will soon be picking up the rest for a complete rewatch. I'm nearly thru season 2 and watched Resolutions tonight. I was pretty mad after watching it.

No, not because of the Janeway/Chakotay romance. I've been expecting that and had forgotten where it got started. What made me angry was the apparent total disregard the crew had for Tuvok once he was placed in command. Granted I'm biased since Tuvok is my faovrite character. However I couldn't believe the crew was seemingly ready to mutiny because he was following Janeway's final order. The icing on the cake comes when the Vidians attack and nobody even bothers to say, "Gee Tuvok, guess you were right after all." Plus it was his strategy that saved the day in the end.

I didn't realize that, at this point anyway, he was isolated from the crew along the same lines that Spock was isolated from the TOS crew during its syndication.

Made for a very interesting episode, along with The Thaw which I watched right before it.

 

[Guy Gardener]

If we are to believe the bad guy from Warlord he was supressing some "needs" to keep kes warm at night, but isolation doesn't mean the same thing for Vulcans as it does for Vulcans.

This episode is one of the best examples of why Kim is a punk.

 

[Anthony Sabre]

This episode is one of the best examples of why Kim is a punk.

You can say that again. Based on one of the other threads going in this forum, I guess Kim wanted his mommy back. I just didn't like the way he went about doing it.

 

[Udat]

Kim needed to get the stick out of his ass

 

[Guy Gardener]

Wait... This is back when he was a "Perfect Officer" as he claimed to have once been in The Disease by the time he was much more hard boiled?

 

[Shatnertage]

Yes, the crew doesn't seem to get the idea of "chain of command" very well. I think Tuvok makes a pretty good captain. He knows exactly what he's doing, and how to do it.

Kim's attempted mutiny brought something to the character, at least. It would have been better if they'd have followed it up with more rebelliousness.

 

[henbane]

Made for a very interesting episode, along with The Thaw which I watched right before it.

The Thaw is one of my favourite episodes - Has a lot of TOS atmosphere (and colour).

 

[Dusty Ayres]

Kim's attempted mutiny brought something to the character, at least. It would have been better if they'd have followed it up with more rebelliousness.

They did, in "The Disease", where he fell in love with the woman on the generation ship, deifying Janeway's orders not to do so and Starfleet protocol.

 

[stj]

Kim being a very dutiful person does not really conflict with a resolute determination to save Janeway. As is well known, Janeway is his substitute mother. Every male ingenue needs one, after all.

And, bizarre as it may seem, being a perfect soldier is not regarded as a good thing by the writers, who much prefer to daydream about being badasses, like the Klingons. The remark in The Disease was just forgetting about this little episode completely. Since it was Harry making it, that still makes sense.

Since it is an article of faith that Klingons are kewl, it is not clear why Harry is a punk in Resolutions. He's not even the one who makes Tuvok look bad. It is true that leading delegations to the captain are a Bad Sign of trouble in the ranks, but Kes the lovely elf maiden is the one who wraps Tuvok around her little finger. Not noticing that's who makes Tuvok look weak seems a little obtuse to me.

What doesn't make sense is Nightingale. If Janeway didn't rate Kim very highly, then sending him off was nonsense. If she respected him, then why the snort? Indeed, if Janeway didn't like Kim, why do him a favor?

Of course, the whole Nightingale episode is nonsense if taken at face value. The plot requires that Janeway, Chakotay, Tuvok and Seven of Nine never trouble to actually look at the cargo in the alien ship! Plots that require characters to be idiots or they don't work have been nicknamed idiot plots (by Damon Knight, I think.)

Nightingale only makes sense as 1) a veiled attack on UPN or Berman for micromanagement using a semiregular who's just in the main cast credits to make the show look more inclusive, or 2) a character assasination of Kim because Biller or Berman or both didn't like Garret Wang (or maybe Chinese in general.)

Janeway's actions in The Disease only make sense if Janeway also feels maternal about Kim. Which fits from first season up to Muse.

The funny thing I just notice is that we've already discussed most of the Kim episodes. The only one left is Favorite Son?

 

[Gary7]

Made for a very interesting episode, along with The Thaw which I watched right before it.

The Thaw is one of my favourite episodes - Has a lot of TOS atmosphere (and colour).

One of my favorites as well, despite the lack of scenic diversity. The actor who portrayed the clown gave a remarkable performance. Fantastic comic timing and delivery.

Of course, the most basic flaw was for the clown to kill anybody. He has no guarantee that everybody will continue living... so, killing off one person reduces his longevity. Kind of ironic.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Kes didn't wrap Tuvok around his finger. She used logic and persuasion to put forward a good case. He wanted to go back, he just needed a good reason. Kim jumping up and down throwing his dung about and beating his chest wasn't any reason or reasoning at all.

How many times have you gotten out of a speeding ticket by screaming and threatening the officer writing the ticket? Though I suppose if we completely followed Kim's example, we would have thumped the officer, locked him in the boot of his cruiser and sold the that police car to someone unscrupulous.

 

[vas2009]

Long time DS9 fan here; picked up VOY season 1-3 and will soon be picking up the rest for a complete rewatch. I'm nearly thru season 2 and watched Resolutions tonight. I was pretty mad after watching it.

No, not because of the Janeway/Chakotay romance. I've been expecting that and had forgotten where it got started. What made me angry was the apparent total disregard the crew had for Tuvok once he was placed in command. Granted I'm biased since Tuvok is my faovrite character. However I couldn't believe the crew was seemingly ready to mutiny because he was following Janeway's final order. The icing on the cake comes when the Vidians attack and nobody even bothers to say, "Gee Tuvok, guess you were right after all." Plus it was his strategy that saved the day in the end.

I didn't realize that, at this point anyway, he was isolated from the crew along the same lines that Spock was isolated from the TOS crew during its syndication.

Made for a very interesting episode, along with The Thaw which I watched right before it.

Oh Yeah that pissed me off!!!!
One more week maybe even one more day... Sailing across the lake, boat tips over... Kathryn and Chakotay get all wet... Clinging to each other to stay afloat. The attraction is unbearable now, they are all alone...
"who needs these wet clothes anyway?"
Oh no, I have to stop... but they wouldn't.

Stupid Harry, brat, no consideration for his Captain's love life... I love Tuvok he knew what was going to happen its only logical.

Resolution and The Thaw made it on to my Ipod... Love them both. The end of Thaw is one of my Fav Janeway moments.

 

[Shatnertage]

^^^I haven't all the episodes yet, but "The Thaw" and "Resolution" are definitely on my "rewatch" list.

But please, vas2009, control yourself! I have no idea why any woman would find Janeway's situation remotely enviable. Just imagine--you're marooned with your rugged co-worker, who starts doting on you, doing all the cooking and building you a bathtub. He gives great massages. Then one night, in a speech so beautiful that it brings tears to your eyes, he confesses that he has only known peace since he vowed to do anything to make his "beautiful, brave" co-worker's burden lighter, and that he will always remain by her side.

Really, I've got no idea what' so great about that.

 

[Guy Gardener]

She's just not into him.

We've all had to turn down suitors before. It's weird. In retrospect I'm wondering WHY in the here and now. And honestly an episode called "resolutions" testing true the hypothesis that she wouldn't touch him with "yours" if he was the last man on the planet... That's a pretty stone cold resolution to the question of their un/impending coitus.

Politically speaking if Janeway and her crew had stayed on the planet from basics, world she ave had to have married that half evolved ape savage shaman village mayor to unify their groups? intermarrying is the only way to keep the gene pool healthy and make sure their neighbours don't decide that they are food.

Giving into Chakotay's needs or taking one for the team?

Besides when did the XO stop being in love with B'Elanna too like we saw in that dream?

 

[henbane]

Made for a very interesting episode, along with The Thaw which I watched right before it.

The Thaw is one of my favourite episodes - Has a lot of TOS atmosphere (and colour).

One of my favorites as well, despite the lack of scenic diversity. The actor who portrayed the clown gave a remarkable performance. Fantastic comic timing and delivery.

Of course, the most basic flaw was for the clown to kill anybody. He has no guarantee that everybody will continue living... so, killing off one person reduces his longevity. Kind of ironic.

His name is Michael McKean. He was in that epic cult movie called SpinalTap.

 

[sevenstars]

Stupid Harry, brat, no consideration for his Captain's love life... I love Tuvok he knew what was going to happen its only logical.

That's it, exactly!

As much as I love the episode, it seemed a little untrue to the dynamic that had been built up among the crew.

And leaving them behind on the planet, forever, to shave a few months off a seventy year trip? Lately I've been wondering, what if the disease had affected a couple of junior crew members? Would they have left them behind?

No matter what, this episode is never going to work out right for me.

 

[Guy Gardener]

They backtracked at least a month, possibly longer, during an ad-break, to fix up Neelix when they thought he was terminal in Jetrel and he's just a ride along they could throw out with the garbage if he ever got difficult.

They never went back for Chakotay's child. With the technology available it's obvious that they don't even ever need women to incubate any more (baring archaic but binding legal fears left over from the wake of the Eugenics War forbidding the advancement in certain eras of science.) that they could have extracted the child DURING conception and still been able to rear it to term fine...

I figured out (remembered) something earlier today that some of the, even Human, Maquis were actually Cardassian Citizens awarded all the rights and protections of Cardassia, which is one of the reasons Picard let all those people stay when the border shifted. If there's at least two (politically, not biologically) Cardassians on board Voyager after Seska left, then they have a majority and a power block in any popular vote if Janeway was to open a Cardassian Embassy in some office/cupboard on the lower decks, that if Seska was a good and loyal daughter of the Empire rather than a seedy opportunist, she could be ordered to come back and behave like a dutiful soldier even though it may mean her own doom and Chakotay's child along with her as well as the protection of the Kazon Nistrem which was in he pocket.

You know, if Taylor hadn't made the brat (great shades of Michael Jackson!) not his kid.

 

[vas2009]

^^^I haven't all the episodes yet, but "The Thaw" and "Resolution" are definitely on my "rewatch" list.

But please, vas2009, control yourself! I have no idea why any woman would find Janeway's situation remotely enviable. Just imagine--you're marooned with your rugged co-worker, who starts doting on you, doing all the cooking and building you a bathtub. He gives great massages. Then one night, in a speech so beautiful that it brings tears to your eyes, he confesses that he has only known peace since he vowed to do anything to make his "beautiful, brave" co-worker's burden lighter, and that he will always remain by her side.

Really, I've got no idea what' so great about that.

I know what was I thinking?!

She's just not into him.

We've all had to turn down suitors before. It's weird. In retrospect I'm wondering WHY in the here and now. And honestly an episode called "resolutions" testing true the hypothesis that she wouldn't touch him with "yours" if he was the last man on the planet... That's a pretty stone cold resolution to the question of their un/impending coitus.

Besides when did the XO stop being in love with B'Elanna too like we saw in that dream?

This is an interesting point but I think in time when she got over the fact that she wasn't leaving, then, well you know... birds and bees. It takes alittle longer for women to give in to temptation... well, women like Janeway. I don't think she turned him down. She was just playing hard to get. The crew just interupted the game in progress.


B'Elanna was in LUV with Chakotay... It was B'Elanna's dream. I believe.

 

[Guy Gardener]

They weren't sharing dreams?

Or was that the other one?

Besides in my fanfiction I usually have it that he's still got a thing going on with that Gilmore Girl.

 

[Anthony Sabre]

B'Elanna was in LUV with Chakotay... It was B'Elanna's dream. I believe.

Persistence of Vision is the episode in question I think. Just watched that one not long ago too. It was Torres' dream.