• Welcome! The TrekBBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans.
    If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

%18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing facts

Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

Well, it's lower than the percentage of Americans - including me - who think he's an idiot.

You and me both. :techman:

But I think that there is some basis to believe he is a Muslim. He was born to a Muslim father and by some definitions that means he was a Muslim at birth, and he did go to a Muslim school, while living in a Muslim nation. And I think he said something about the Sunrise call to Muslim prayer was one of the most beautiful sounds in the world.

I think that's the point I made upthread with the article I linked. There's a lot of confusion about what he actually believes. If he would just unequivocally state what he believes, he could crush this crap in it's tracks.

No he wouldn't.

1] It's nobody's business what his religion is as long as he upholds the Constitution.

2] No matter what he says, there will be a determined contingent that will continue to hate him.

3] The media wouldn't consider it settled, as that would reduce controversy, which reduces ratings, which means fewer advertising dollars.

4] He's already stated his beliefs. No one who would care has listened.
 
Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

Obama also said "Reverend Jeremiah Wright is as much part of me as my grandmother." If only people would listen to what Obama says instead of looking to see who's the latest victim pinned under the bus.

Obama also plainly and constantly said that he'd close Gitmo (now remaining open indefinitely).

Even CBS news commented that he's named 14 unrelated issues as his administration's sole top priority.

Obama says lots of things but his support for his own words rarely outlasts the echoes of his baritone voice.
 
Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

Pagan would be the opposite of secular.

So Christians took over a Pagan celebration for their second Holiest day, an outstanding strategy. And then as Christianity's influence lessened the secular took over the Christian ceremonial day and traditions.
Easter is also a Pagan holiday.
What? You mean Jesus wasn't a bunny rabbit who laid chocolate eggs?
 
Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

Obama also said "Reverend Jeremiah Wright is as much part of me as my grandmother." If only people would listen to what Obama says instead of looking to see who's the latest victim pinned under the bus.

Obama also plainly and constantly said that he'd close Gitmo (now remaining open indefinitely).

Even CBS news commented that he's named 14 unrelated issues as his administration's sole top priority.

Obama says lots of things but his support for his own words rarely outlasts the echoes of his baritone voice.

Show me a President that has accomplished everything on his agenda. Then, if you have managed to make a list of that, from that list, show me a President that accomplished everything on his agenda less than two years into his term.
 
Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

A Gallup poll was released some years ago that indicated double-digit support for both a geocentric model of the universe and also the notion that the Earth is flat. This continued in a study from 2005. I find this more shocking and revealing about the nature of the electorate's intelligence since the poll likely had fewer fake responses than the Muslim one did, which has to be partially inundated with politically-motivated troll responses. Dr. Miller's data obviously helps Republicans since it carries indirect political connotations, and some of the party platform does rely on a lack of scientific knowledge on the part of the electorate to get people to the polls.


http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/30/s...r=1&ex=1184990400&en=2fb126c3132f89ae&ei=5070

Notable excerpts:

"While scientific literacy has doubled over the past two decades, only 20 to 25 percent of Americans are 'scientifically savvy and alert,' he said in an interview. Most of the rest 'don't have a clue.' At a time when science permeates debates on everything from global warming to stem cell research, he said, people's inability to understand basic scientific concepts undermines their ability to take part in the democratic process.
[...]
Dr. Miller's data reveal some yawning gaps in basic knowledge. American adults in general do not understand what molecules are (other than that they are really small). Fewer than a third can identify DNA as a key to heredity. Only about 10 percent know what radiation is. One adult American in five thinks the Sun revolves around the Earth, an idea science had abandoned by the 17th century."
 
Last edited:
Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

Obama also said "Reverend Jeremiah Wright is as much part of me as my grandmother." If only people would listen to what Obama says instead of looking to see who's the latest victim pinned under the bus.

Obama also plainly and constantly said that he'd close Gitmo (now remaining open indefinitely).

Even CBS news commented that he's named 14 unrelated issues as his administration's sole top priority.

Obama says lots of things but his support for his own words rarely outlasts the echoes of his baritone voice.

Show me a President that has accomplished everything on his agenda. Then, if you have managed to make a list of that, from that list, show me a President that accomplished everything on his agenda less than two years into his term.

That would be almost every President whose party controlled both houses of Congress when elected.

Over the past century that would be the 63rd Congress under Woodrow Wilson, successfully banning blacks from government jobs and enshrining segregation, passing the federal income tax, the red light abatement act, and the all important sponge act. Then the 64th Congress under Wilson continued the push, banning false advertising, dumping, establishing the National Park Service, workman's comp, etc.

The 67th Congress under Harding's first term (who campaigned on doing nothing) passed the act ending WW-I and an enormous amount of other legislation. The 68th Congress under Harding and Coolidge (who wanted to do less than Harding) passed the Bonus Bill, established the Foreign Service, granted full citizenship to all indigenous Americans (Native Americans), and enacted the only federal campaign finance reform until the 1970s.

FDR's Democrat Congresses passed an incredible amount of legislation, almost all of it bad, which extended and deepened the Great Depression, but at least they passed anything that occurred to their pointy little minds. FDR's subsequent Congresses also passed Lend Lease and the Pledge of Allegiance Act, and the first half of Truman's first term continued the pace. Truman lost Congress in his mid-terms to what became known as "the Do Nothing Congress." He regained Congress and kept on trucking. The only brakes on FDR or Truman's delivery on promises were occassional court decisions declaring their actions unconstitutional.

The Ike came in with a Republican Congress and reshaped American defense efforts, but then he got stuck with six years of Democrat Congresses.

Kennedy was elected along with a Democrat Congress, got an amazing amount accomplished, got shot, and Johnson picked things up, both totally transforming American society with huge legislation, such as civil rights, voting rights, Medicare, Medicaid, the Freedom of Information Act, etc. If they failed to pass anything it was only because they didn't think of it.

Nixon and Ford never held either house of Congress, so we remember Nixon for Watergate and once getting on an airplane to China and only remember Ford because Chevy Chase played him on Saturday Night Live.

Carter held both houses of Congress and passed lots of legislation on the environment, paperwork reduction, cancelling the B-1, and giving away the Panama Canal. He could pass anything he wanted, but he couldn't make the economy not suck.

Reagan only held the Senate for two years and still got an amazing amount of legislation through. If he stumped for it, it passed.

George H.W. Bush never held any part of Congress and the only part of his agenda that was left undone was "no new taxes."

Clinton started with both houses and passed so much legislation that the voters rebelled, and after losing both houses for the rest of his presidency he still delivered on his promises.

G.W. Bush held both houses for only a few months in his first term, then held both houses for two elections, getting so much accomplished that Democrats went nuts.

Even Democrats can't figure out the current disfunction. The administration points to a handful of acts that even the public doesn't want, yet can't explain why so many emotionally powerful issues that motivated their supporters were just chucked aside like trash when they held the House and had a filibuster proof Senate majority.

So yes, Obama is pretty unique in not being able to get hardly anything he stumped for, and even what does pass doesn't support the specifics he promised. Leaders in the House and Senate have complained that he doesn't seem to care what is in the bills they vote on, just as long as he can somehow claim title to whatever random things they write in.
 
Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

Obama also said "Reverend Jeremiah Wright is as much part of me as my grandmother." If only people would listen to what Obama says instead of looking to see who's the latest victim pinned under the bus.

Obama also plainly and constantly said that he'd close Gitmo (now remaining open indefinitely).

Even CBS news commented that he's named 14 unrelated issues as his administration's sole top priority.

Obama says lots of things but his support for his own words rarely outlasts the echoes of his baritone voice.

Show me a President that has accomplished everything on his agenda. Then, if you have managed to make a list of that, from that list, show me a President that accomplished everything on his agenda less than two years into his term.

That would be almost every President whose party controlled both houses of Congress when elected.

Over the past century that would be the 63rd Congress under Woodrow Wilson, successfully banning blacks from government jobs and enshrining segregation, passing the federal income tax, the red light abatement act, and the all important sponge act. Then the 64th Congress under Wilson continued the push, banning false advertising, dumping, establishing the National Park Service, workman's comp, etc.

The 67th Congress under Harding's first term (who campaigned on doing nothing) passed the act ending WW-I and an enormous amount of other legislation. The 68th Congress under Harding and Coolidge (who wanted to do less than Harding) passed the Bonus Bill, established the Foreign Service, granted full citizenship to all indigenous Americans (Native Americans), and enacted the only federal campaign finance reform until the 1970s.

FDR's Democrat Congresses passed an incredible amount of legislation, almost all of it bad, which extended and deepened the Great Depression, but at least they passed anything that occurred to their pointy little minds. FDR's subsequent Congresses also passed Lend Lease and the Pledge of Allegiance Act, and the first half of Truman's first term continued the pace. Truman lost Congress in his mid-terms to what became known as "the Do Nothing Congress." He regained Congress and kept on trucking. The only brakes on FDR or Truman's delivery on promises were occassional court decisions declaring their actions unconstitutional.

The Ike came in with a Republican Congress and reshaped American defense efforts, but then he got stuck with six years of Democrat Congresses.

Kennedy was elected along with a Democrat Congress, got an amazing amount accomplished, got shot, and Johnson picked things up, both totally transforming American society with huge legislation, such as civil rights, voting rights, Medicare, Medicaid, the Freedom of Information Act, etc. If they failed to pass anything it was only because they didn't think of it.

Nixon and Ford never held either house of Congress, so we remember Nixon for Watergate and once getting on an airplane to China and only remember Ford because Chevy Chase played him on Saturday Night Live.

Carter held both houses of Congress and passed lots of legislation on the environment, paperwork reduction, cancelling the B-1, and giving away the Panama Canal. He could pass anything he wanted, but he couldn't make the economy not suck.

Reagan only held the Senate for two years and still got an amazing amount of legislation through. If he stumped for it, it passed.

George H.W. Bush never held any part of Congress and the only part of his agenda that was left undone was "no new taxes."

Clinton started with both houses and passed so much legislation that the voters rebelled, and after losing both houses for the rest of his presidency he still delivered on his promises.

G.W. Bush held both houses for only a few months in his first term, then held both houses for two elections, getting so much accomplished that Democrats went nuts.

Even Democrats can't figure out the current disfunction. The administration points to a handful of acts that even the public doesn't want, yet can't explain why so many emotionally powerful issues that motivated their supporters were just chucked aside like trash when they held the House and had a filibuster proof Senate majority.

So yes, Obama is pretty unique in not being able to get hardly anything he stumped for, and even what does pass doesn't support the specifics he promised. Leaders in the House and Senate have complained that he doesn't seem to care what is in the bills they vote on, just as long as he can somehow claim title to whatever random things they write in.

Not some. Not most. All.
 
Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

If he would just unequivocally state what he believes, he could crush this crap in it's tracks.
Just like how the Birthers were satisfied with both he and the State of Hawaii unequivocally stated that he was born in Honolulu?

Oh wait.
 
Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

If he would just unequivocally state what he believes, he could crush this crap in it's tracks.
Just like how the Birthers were satisfied with both he and the State of Hawaii unequivocally stated that he was born in Honolulu?

Oh wait.

I'm satisfied he was born in Hawaii. Idiots are born in all fifty states.
 
Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

That's my point. It doesn't matter what he says because:

a: He's already said it.
b: There are idiots in all fifty states.

There are tons of people who don't think he's Christian or natural born, regardless of facts. It doesn't matter what he nor anyone else says about it. They know they're right. Trying to show that the people who think he's a Muslim, Kenyan, or a Muslim Kenyan are rational and they'll believe what he says if he says it is giving them too much credit.
 
Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

That's my point. It doesn't matter what he says because:

a: He's already said it.
b: There are idiots in all fifty states.

There are tons of people who don't think he's Christian or natural born, regardless of facts. It doesn't matter what he nor anyone else says about it. They know they're right. Trying to show that the people who think he's a Muslim, Kenyan, or a Muslim Kenyan are rational and they'll believe what he says if he says it is giving them too much credit.

I have a sneaking suspicion that most of them watch Beck and are Teabaggers.
 
Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

I think that's the point I made upthread with the article I linked. There's a lot of confusion about what he actually believes. If he would just unequivocally state what he believes, he could crush this crap in it's tracks.

I wish this were actually true in politics, but sadly, it is not the case when people come into an issue refusing to be convinced of anything other than what they already want to believe.

At the big Tea Party rally in Washington D.C. last year, a reporter asked a woman what Obama could do to prove that he was not a Muslim, and she replied, "Nothing."

That sad old woman who famously told Candidate McCain at a rally that she did not trust Obama because, "He's.... he's an Arab..." was interviewed later that day. Despite having been assured personally by her VERY OWN candidate for President that Obama is "a decent family man, a U.S. Citizen" who he (McCain) simply had disagreements with on how to run the country, she stuck tight with what she already had in her mind.

Whether it is in politics or in knowledge of the physical & biological world that surrounds us, this type of unwillingness to examine things rationally is a deadweight that holds us back on the path towards progress in our society and culture.
 
Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

^ As a follow-up, I recently read a long exchange of posts on a site where people were discussing Obama's birth certificate. It was painfully obvious that most of the people disputing the validity of document did not even realize that birth certificates varied from state to state in how they looked (the layout/format) and what information was shown on them. One poster stated that his own tiny footprints were on his certificate, and thus he "knew" that the baby's footprints had to be a requirement for any legitimate birth certificate.

Some of them did not even know that driver's licenses from other states looked different from their own.

How can a reasonable discussion occur on such a subject when people are not even aware of such basic facts relevant to the issue?


The following quote has been attributed to Thomas Jefferson. I think he would be sorely disappointed at how poorly informed many individuals in our current electorate are, and even worse, what small interest some have in learning any new information that might contradict what they already wish to believe:
"Convinced that the people are the only safe depositories of their own liberty, and that they are not safe unless enlightened to a certain degree, I have looked on our present state of liberty as a short-lived possession unless the mass of the people could be informed to a certain degree."
 
Last edited:
Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

Obama also said "Reverend Jeremiah Wright is as much part of me as my grandmother." If only people would listen to what Obama says instead of looking to see who's the latest victim pinned under the bus.

Obama also plainly and constantly said that he'd close Gitmo (now remaining open indefinitely).

Even CBS news commented that he's named 14 unrelated issues as his administration's sole top priority.

Obama says lots of things but his support for his own words rarely outlasts the echoes of his baritone voice.

Show me a President that has accomplished everything on his agenda. Then, if you have managed to make a list of that, from that list, show me a President that accomplished everything on his agenda less than two years into his term.

It probably helps to put some numbers to these things.

Politifact has been keeping track of the promises Obama made during his campaign and whether or not he's followed through. Linky!

They've tracked 506 promises. Out of those, 79% are marked as "kept," "compromise," or "in the works." The other 21% are "broken," "stalled," or "not yet rated."

(And yes, almost half of them are "in the works." But then it can't be said they aren't being worked on.)

24% of the total are marked as "kept." So, in two years, Obama has accomplished about 1/4 of what he promised, and almost half of what he promised is being worked on right now.

But yeah, he's a "failure." :rolleyes:
 
Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

Obama also said "Reverend Jeremiah Wright is as much part of me as my grandmother." If only people would listen to what Obama says instead of looking to see who's the latest victim pinned under the bus.

Obama also plainly and constantly said that he'd close Gitmo (now remaining open indefinitely).

Even CBS news commented that he's named 14 unrelated issues as his administration's sole top priority.

Obama says lots of things but his support for his own words rarely outlasts the echoes of his baritone voice.

Show me a President that has accomplished everything on his agenda. Then, if you have managed to make a list of that, from that list, show me a President that accomplished everything on his agenda less than two years into his term.

It probably helps to put some numbers to these things.

Politifact has been keeping track of the promises Obama made during his campaign and whether or not he's followed through. Linky!

They've tracked 506 promises. Out of those, 79% are marked as "kept," "compromise," or "in the works." The other 21% are "broken," "stalled," or "not yet rated."

(And yes, almost half of them are "in the works." But then it can't be said they aren't being worked on.)

24% of the total are marked as "kept." So, in two years, Obama has accomplished about 1/4 of what he promised, and almost half of what he promised is being worked on right now.

But yeah, he's a "failure." :rolleyes:

Which is the general idea I'm trying to get from gturner. According to him, every President except Obama has accomplished what they set out to do, a complete agenda completely seen through to the end successfully.

People who say Obama's a failure do so because they want him to be a failure and nothing more. He could cure cancer and somehow he'd be a failure to these people. There's no way to really talk sense into such people. They refuse to listen to reason. No fact, statistic, poll, hand drawn picture will convince them otherwise.
 
Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

Two huge things Bush couldn't accomplish while his party controlled both the WH and Congress:

1. Immigration reform.
2. Social Security reform.

Case fucking closed. gturner is full of it.
 
Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

Can we just conclude the fact that some people are idiots and called it a day?

:alienblush:
 
Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

Two huge things Bush couldn't accomplish while his party controlled both the WH and Congress:

1. Immigration reform.
2. Social Security reform.

Case fucking closed. gturner is full of it.

This is the kind of stuff I want to hear in live Presidential debates. :D
 
Re: %18 of Americans think Obama is a Muslim, and other disturbing fac

Two huge things Bush couldn't accomplish while his party controlled both the WH and Congress:

1. Immigration reform.
2. Social Security reform.

Case fucking closed. gturner is full of it.

This is the kind of stuff I want to hear in live Presidential debates. :D

Yeah. Bush banked a ton of political capital on those issues and got burned beyond belief. How quickly we forget...
 
If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Sign up / Register


Back
Top