Mulgrew is adament about the lack of a romantic relationship between Janeway and Chakotay. Do you agree?
Methinks the lady doth protest too much!
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Yes, I agree. Of course, she also thinks the idea of a relationship between Seven and Janeway is equally out of the question.
Personally, I think there was some smoke screening going on there.
Personally, I think there was some smoke screening going on there.
I've always been told when a woman refers to you as "friend", it means she sees you as equal to a brother and there is no romantic interest. Janeway called Chakotay "good friend" several times, even asked him for romance advice when she was "dating" Michael. That too me isn't the sign of someone who has romantic interest in you.
Besides I think much like Sisko & Dax, I think it was great that Trek & Mulgrew stood up and tried to squash the myth that a man & woman can't be friends and can only have "romantic" feelings for each other. Plus, it shows Chakotay is capable of thinking with his brain & not his penis.
Besides I think much like Sisko & Dax, I think it was great that Trek & Mulgrew stood up and tried to squash the myth that a man & woman can't be friends and can only have "romantic" feelings for each other. Plus, it shows Chakotay is capable of thinking with his brain & not his penis.
I swear I've seen every episode of TNG at least ten times and I can't remember for the life of me when Riker and Picard held hands. I need to Netflix that series again, maybe? 
I think C & J were better for not having a romantic relationship - the romantic feelings they did have appeared to be sublimated into a much stronger friendship.
Haven't we all had a good friend where the relationship could have developed into something else, but we choose either consciously or unconsciously for this not to happen, as we wanted to keep the friendship the way it was?
Haven't we all had a good friend where the relationship could have developed into something else, but we choose either consciously or unconsciously for this not to happen, as we wanted to keep the friendship the way it was?
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I think that a man and a woman can be just friends as well. However, Janeway and Chakotay were clearly flirting in the early seasons. It's a shame that their relationship was never canonically romantic.
You've been told wrong. A woman can have male friends that she thinks of as brothers and that she has no romantic interest in, but she can also have male friends that she could possibly get romantically involved with. I tend to think that you can't really have a serious romantic relationship with someone if that someone is not able to be your friend, among other things. There are male/female friendships that are free of any romantic overtones, and then there are those where there's sexual tension/some mutual attraction, or attraction on the part of one of them. It's not that uncommon to find two people who started off as friends and eventually became a couple - or those who really do remain friends after the breakup.
Janeway was friends with Tuvok, and there were no signs of any romantic feelings from either of them. She was friends with Chakotay, but there was obvious sexual tension and some open flirting (in "Resolutions") there.
In relation to the topic at hand, it doesn't seem I'm wrong at all. Janeway called Chakotay "good friend" and didn't persue any romantic relationship with him. He was a friend and only a friend.
"Resolutions" was years ago in their journey and they were dealing with the idea of never being in command positions again, not to mention they were the only humans living on the planet. Who else were they going to pair up with? Besides a monkey, they didn't even have anybody but each other to even talk too.
We saw at the conclusion of that ep. and once they were back on Voyager, any and all flirting & ideas of any romantic relationship stopped. I'm sure if it was Tuvok stuck with Janeway in "Resolutions" the same things would have eventually happened. Just like in "Gravity", Tuvok shared his affections for another woman besides his wife when faced with living the rest of his life lost & without her.
Well, Tuvok was logical in that way. 
However, until the storm that knocked out everything in "Resolutions", there was a chance they wouldn't be stuck on the planet forever. Janeway is a very resourceful, intelligent scientist. She was trying to find a cure. I think she would have had she been prepared for that storm to come in.
It was Chakotay who wasn't trying to find a way out of the situation. He was trying to set up house almost immediately, which tells me that he had the hots for her before she even considered being hot and bothered over him. It's like he saw this as his only opportunity to be her with in in that way, and he knew, if they got off the planet, it would never happen. She, on the other hand, wanted to get off the planet.
It wasn't until all hope of finding a cure was pretty much gone that she gave in just a little bit.
However, until the storm that knocked out everything in "Resolutions", there was a chance they wouldn't be stuck on the planet forever. Janeway is a very resourceful, intelligent scientist. She was trying to find a cure. I think she would have had she been prepared for that storm to come in.
It was Chakotay who wasn't trying to find a way out of the situation. He was trying to set up house almost immediately, which tells me that he had the hots for her before she even considered being hot and bothered over him. It's like he saw this as his only opportunity to be her with in in that way, and he knew, if they got off the planet, it would never happen. She, on the other hand, wanted to get off the planet.
It wasn't until all hope of finding a cure was pretty much gone that she gave in just a little bit.
Actually, it tells me Chakotay wasn't a scientist and stuck to what he knew best, which was survival and left the scientific stuff to the scientist. The cure was going to take a longer time to solve, the most important thing was shelter. Making sure we both have a warm dry place to stay when your lost & alone doesn't mean someone has the hots for you. What was Janeway going to do during the storm if Chakotay hadn't built that house? Her cure would have done her little good if she were struck by lighting or died of pneumonia.Well, Tuvok was logical in that way.
However, until the storm that knocked out everything in "Resolutions", there was a chance they wouldn't be stuck on the planet forever. Janeway is a very resourceful, intelligent scientist. She was trying to find a cure. I think she would have had she been prepared for that storm to come in.
It was Chakotay who wasn't trying to find a way out of the situation. He was trying to set up house almost immediately, which tells me that he had the hots for her before she even considered being hot and bothered over him. It's like he saw this as his only opportunity to be her with in in that way, and he knew, if they got off the planet, it would never happen. She, on the other hand, wanted to get off the planet.
It wasn't until all hope of finding a cure was pretty much gone that she gave in just a little bit.
He could have done both, actually. From the moment they found out they were stuck there, he was urging her to make a home there. He kept hinting at the idea that looking for a cure might not be the best use of their time.
True, he was no scientist as Kathryn was, but he could easily have been helping with the research after getting shelter and such set up.
Speaking of shelter and such, she helped him put together a lot of that. The additions he made were all his own doing because he wanted to, not because they needed. As I said before, he was settling down to play house long before Kathryn was.
True, he was no scientist as Kathryn was, but he could easily have been helping with the research after getting shelter and such set up.
Speaking of shelter and such, she helped him put together a lot of that. The additions he made were all his own doing because he wanted to, not because they needed. As I said before, he was settling down to play house long before Kathryn was.
If he wasn't a scientist, the best help he could give was to stay out of her way and let her do what she does best.
Seriously, I think you're reading into it too much.
I suppose that could be said about anything analyzed in the Trek universe, though.
But, you and I have had this conversation before... a long time ago. In fact, you've told me this before.
I think we agreed to disagree. 
What about the angry warrior story of Chakotay's in 'Resolutions'. If that wasn't flirting, then call me Lumba.
I agree with Adm Hawthorne's opinion of the episode. Chakotay certainly appeared to have the hots for Janeway, but they were only hints, no concrete evidence. This story was the last nail in the coffin.
Although the story reflects Chakotay's journey after the caretaker, reflects on the two crews becoming one, and his loyalty to his new captain, why would it be 'easier to say' as a story and not directly, and why did Chakotay find 'inner peace'?
I agree with Adm Hawthorne's opinion of the episode. Chakotay certainly appeared to have the hots for Janeway, but they were only hints, no concrete evidence. This story was the last nail in the coffin.
Although the story reflects Chakotay's journey after the caretaker, reflects on the two crews becoming one, and his loyalty to his new captain, why would it be 'easier to say' as a story and not directly, and why did Chakotay find 'inner peace'?
I agree with Kate Mulgrews version. She wanted to portray the Captain as one would actually act, and as a Captain any relationship with the crew had to be totally platonic.
I personally think the Chakotay/ Seven thing was slipped in at the last minute to boost ratings.
Seven would have been better off with Tuvok, they had alot more in common, alas he was a married man.
I personally think the Chakotay/ Seven thing was slipped in at the last minute to boost ratings.
Seven would have been better off with Tuvok, they had alot more in common, alas he was a married man.
The assumption for many is because, regardless of how she may want to take the relationship, he is with the woman he cares about (read loves).
Remember, it was Kathryn who wanted to lay down parameters after Chakotay started sniffing her hair. Chakotay was the one who didn't have the wherewithal to have an out-and-out discussion. Kathryn wanted to tackle it and move on.
Then, he basically tells her that, when he's with her/helping her, his life has meaning. If that's not a declaration of love, I don't know what is. That's like saying, "You make me want to be a better man." Wait, that's what he said.
She smiles at him sweetly and goes to bed alone. I think that speaks to what she felt for him.
Have we?
I suppose that could be said about anything analyzed in the Trek universe, though.
But, you and I have had this conversation before... a long time ago. In fact, you've told me this before.
I think I have this converstaion with at least one person once a month on any given Voyager/Trek board.
And it's not uncommon to find two people who started off as friends, become lovers, and destroy the friendship in the process.
Janeway couldn't risk that.
I guess that is in the eye of the beholder.
Kathryn's hallucination re: Chakotay's reaction to her death in season 3's "Coda" suggests to me that she sees more between them than CO & XO.
Also in season 3... Chak's reaction to Q's desire to mate with her, and her gentle reassurance towards Chak suggests something more than Federation protocol on inter-alien intercourse.
Season 3's "Future's End is rife with J/C.
Hmmm, I MUST rewatch season 3 soon.
To my jaundiced eye, the J/C flirting didn't end with "Resolutions", but it did go covert. Almost as if the two knew how far they could go if they weren't careful, so they were very careful.
