Maximum speed of the NuEnterprise
- Thread starter EJA
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A full reboot would have let them do their own thing. The alternate timeline should really be using broadly the same Trek tech as the original show albeit updated (appearance wise) for the modern audience and modern tech (e.g. no problem using communicators as camera phones). If they change all the technology as well, making all ships travel dozens of light years in less than a day, then the question why they didn't just do a full re-boot rears its head again.
A lot of the re-designs are just to open up merchandising options. Still, the TMP Enterprise will always be the best to me. None of the others came close to such perfection.
A lot of the re-designs are just to open up merchandising options. Still, the TMP Enterprise will always be the best to me. None of the others came close to such perfection.
I think it was just a case of creative license (and that probably Robert Orci was a big Trekkie himself). I also think it was a way of not really jettisoning everything that came before it by establishing it as taking place in an alternate timeline/universe. And regardless of how you view Trek's continuity, there's no way to deny that there are still a lot of fans of the original (or Prime) universe. The whole alternate universe thing was probably looked at as a way of having something for both old and new fans, because for all intents and purposes, the Prime universe is still out there somewhere--minus Romulus and Spock, of course.
But I think the end result was the same even if they had done a full reboot. The movies are free to do their own thing now and they have pretty much a clean slate to work with from this point forward...
I-Am-Zim
Captain
It's "Star Trek" in name only.
startrekrcks
Fleet Captain
For goodness sake get over the movie I'm interested in other movies and things not just Star Trek at the minute I love Avatar as well not that it has anything to do with Star Trek.
It's the name, the premise and the sci-fi goodness that keeps me watching it. Or was I the only one who still got into Deep Space Nine despite the fact that it was almost totally different in every way from every other Star Trek production before or since (and for a couple of years I kept calling it "Babylon Nine").
I consider DS9 to be the true successor to TOS as far as storytelling spirit goes. TNG was just a little too self-conscious for its own good.
^ True as that is, we all manage to (mostly) tolerate the extreme variations of style and tone of different trek productions for some reason or another. Am I right in assuming that there is something OTHER than slavish adherence to canon that Trekkies find entertaining?
Intelligent storytelling? Not being talked down to by the producers like we're a bunch of drooling morons? It's my contention that Star Trek's slide began when intentional errors, not just continuity errors but dodgy science, started getting passed on, in the vain hope that "nobody'll notice that."
Still a complete falsehood.
Except where it completely agrees with it.
Assuming that 24th-century Romulans don't have access to cloaking technology? Sounds like "flying in the face of canon" to me.
How do you intend to prove they weren't?
Exactly - why assume consistency, when the ship that took out 47 Klingon vessels and destroyed a Federation armada in under a minute can suddenly be painted as weak to prop up an argument?
Hell, THAT started back in TOS. TNG and later only made it worse.
You've failed to prove its impossibility.
Changing the subject. You initially disputed the fact that the drill was the cause of the communication interference.
If you say so. In other words that position is apparently a self-fulfilling prophecy.
No, that still never happened. The person who wrote those things is imaginary and fails to actually exist, so you gain little by arguing against this particular strawman.
None of which undermines my position in any way.
I don't have to. It is illogical and unnecessary to attempt to prove a negative.
No, I originally disputed that the drill was the cause of the seismic disturbances, which you yourself noted in the first place. my original claim--which I stated pretty clearly-- is that, if the drill not the cause of the seismic disturbance (and we have absolutely no evidence that it was) then there is no need to dig up a roundabout explanation for why the Vulcans were able to send a distress signal yet at the same time UNABLE to tell Starfleet what was really going on.
No, his name is Pauln6 (whom I severely hope is not imaginary or else I will feel very silly right about now). You originally responded to my post where I disputed the assumption that the Vulcans had any idea that Nero was the cause of those seismic disturbances because, as far as I can tell, the disturbances were probably caused by gravitational flux from OldSpock's black hole.
Perhaps I was wrong in assuming you had been paying attention to the context of the sentence you quoted in response?
Then I have no idea what your position is, other than that you have alot of convoluted theories about what might have happened off camera. You're welcome to them, of course, but since none of them follow necessarily from the story they are indeed "reaching."
Not quite. In TOS, they generally tried to think up a workaround for the issue, oftentimes by acknowledging the discrepancy, then having Spock noting that apparently someone figured out a way around the problem, and back to the story. TNG modernized the process by introducing technobabble. In either case, though, there was at least an attempt to find a plausible explanation for an apparent violation of some physical law.
ST09 doesn't even try. It's not even apparent that the writers and producers even know where they're screwing up.
Okay, concrete example:
What was the coherent scientific explanation for, say, Miri's planet? Or the "Yangs vs. Cohms" planet? Or the Roman Empire planet?
I know, for example, that the gangster world of Sigma Iota had a relatively plausible explanation, even though it is never explained just how it is that the two most powerful mobsters on the entire planet happen to live within walking distance of each other (in the same city, no less) and that the planet must be united under one of the two of them. And while the Indian colony on Amerind has the beginnings of an explanation with the Preserver thing, no one offers anything resembling an explanation for why the Enterprise wasted time beaming a landing party to look at the flowers BEFORE Enterprise went and deflected that asteroid.
These, to me, seemed to be plot contrivances everyone was hoping the audience wouldn't notice. And they were right: we loved Star Trek so much that we looked the other way even when Trek stories introduced us to totally inexplicable premises with scientifically baffling foundations, then we patted ourselves on the back and grinned smugly about how smart we were for liking such an intelligent show.
Sometimes there was, but technobabble is just "The laws of physics are inconvenient, so let's just ignore them and pretend we're following them."
Nor is it apparent that the rest of us do. How many times on this board have you seen people bitching about how the "monster chase scene" was a convoluted waste of time and that the Delta Vega thing would have worked perfectly well without it? How many of these people are unaware that that the excursion to Delta Vega was actually an excuse to insert that scene into the movie in the first place, because the writers felt "dangerous pursuit by exotic hostile aliens" was a staple of classic Star Trek drama?
Maybe I'm just biased by the fact that I happened to have enjoyed this movie more than I've enjoyed ANY Trek movie in the past fifteen years, but it seems to me--and is becoming more and more clear every day--that the zeal of detractors to point out the film's shortcomings has them pointing out flaws that have been in evidence throughout Trek's entire history. I think the criticism comes from other psychological sources unique to the fan community and the specific grievances are both disingenuous and invalid.
The movie was very enjoyable indeed. I was aware why the put in the scene; I would have just preferred it if the way they inserted the monsters wasn't so random and they could have avoided the ridiculous notion that Kirk would stumble across Spock in a random cave. Too many plot contrivances flow from the decision to dump Kirk in the middle of nowhere in my view.
Here's the thing: when you use the word "you" I tend to assume that you are, in fact, referring to me and not Pauln6. So you've been ascribing another poster's statements to me.
Which doesn't bode well for an attempt to prove that the drill cannot be the cause of the seismic disturbance.
The drill is the reason for the seismic disturbance.
...which was nowhere near Vulcan and oddly affected no other Federation planet, given that there's nothing to stop any other Federation planet from communicating with Starfleet. Under your rules of nomenclature, since this does not follow necessarily from the story, it can be accurately dubbed "reaching".
After that:
Set Harth said:
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Nobody puts Pauln6 in the corner. If I am a figment of anything, it is my own deranged imagination.
There is an internal logic problem here again. It would make sense for the Narada to jam communications at an early opportunity (just as Reliant did in TWoK). The drill doesn't have to be the cause of the loss of communications - I think they only formally establish it as disrupting transporters. So why would Nero wait until AFTER he starts drilling to jam communications?
It is possible that he tried unsuccessfully to use the red matter from orbit - cue seismic disturbances and a signal to Earth. When that failed he figured he would have to drill but he knows the Vulcans will realise this is a hostile act so he jams communications from that point forward.
There is an internal logic problem here again. It would make sense for the Narada to jam communications at an early opportunity (just as Reliant did in TWoK). The drill doesn't have to be the cause of the loss of communications - I think they only formally establish it as disrupting transporters. So why would Nero wait until AFTER he starts drilling to jam communications?
It is possible that he tried unsuccessfully to use the red matter from orbit - cue seismic disturbances and a signal to Earth. When that failed he figured he would have to drill but he knows the Vulcans will realise this is a hostile act so he jams communications from that point forward.
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