A Niner Watches Babylon 5 (NO spoilers, please)

[stonester1]

^
Not really. He may be completely ignorant of human mating, but is he going to be fooled into thinking running around and yelling constitutes their sexual activity?

He claimed supreme knowledge. He showed he didn't have it and had fundamental lack of understanding of all sorts of things human and on Babylon 5. But insisted on claiming understanding anyway.

Humans have done STUPID things, crazy things, stubborn things in the name of pride. Now imagine that pride magnified.

And on "transferrence" or other mechanics, he didn't care about "transferrence" or biology. He just wanted to have sex. Most humans don't care about "transferrence" or biology when they want to have sex, either.

 

[TheGodBen]

Like what?

I'd have beaten him up. Well, not me personally since I'm weak and spindly, but if I was Ivanova I would have beaten him up, and if he attempted to fight back I would have accused him of not doing it right. That way I'd be playing on his ignorance, he'd be getting his just desserts, and I'd keep my dignity.

Then I'd throw in some lines about how I'm Russian and how I wish I could have beaten up the Psi Corps.

 

[Kegg]

And on "transferrence" or other mechanics, he didn't care about "transferrence" or biology. He just wanted to have sex. Most humans don't care about "transferrence" or biology when they want to have sex, either.

Believe me, many humans consider the transferrence thing sort of important. Getting pregnant is no laughing matter (for women, anyway).

But more than that, most of us basically understand how it works more or less and that it involves physical contact and excretion of something. Ivanova's plan basically only works because the writer says it did.

Which is ignoring the important thing: It's as painfully unfunny as Rebo and Zooty.

 

[stonester1]

Like what?

I'd have beaten him up. Well, not me personally since I'm weak and spindly, but if I was Ivanova I would have beaten him up, and if he attempted to fight back I would have accused him of not doing it right.

Why is commiting violence on him better than a silly dance that revealed his ignorance?

And how is that in any way more, or even as clever, in solution or in ending? Oh yay, another "chick power ass kicking".

 

[stonester1]

Believe me, many humans consider the transferrence thing sort of important. Getting pregnant is no laughing matter (for women, anyway).

Not the point. Most people aren't thinking of biology or transferrence or whatever when having sex, most of the time. Most of the time, if it's making love, it's sharing of feelings. If it's straight fucking, it's the big O.

That's it.

As for the writer "saying it did", sure. And I had no problem with the rationale, considering how he set it up.

Which is ignoring the important thing: It's as painfully unfunny as Rebo and Zooty.

Your opinion.

 

[Kegg]

Not the point. Most people aren't thinking of biology or transferrence or whatever when having sex, most of the time. Most of the time, if it's making love, it's sharing of feelings. If it's straight fucking, it's the big O.

That's it.

And if I say 'Let's have sex' and explain I mean I'll poke at them with a stick while reading from Goethe's erotic poetry?

I think most people would dispute that this constitutes sex.

If you're having sex with an unfamiliar alien species, well, you'd still have limits to what you'd believe could be done (and if you're sane, a healthy concern in knowing exactly what's going on - who knows what sort of alien things could be diseases to you? )

Which is ignoring the important thing: It's as painfully unfunny as Rebo and Zooty.

Your opinion.

Well, no, concrete scientific fact, proved after years of careful surveys of the geostatic thermum of the triplanetary core.

 

[stonester1]

And if I say 'Let's have sex' and explain I mean I'll poke at them with a stick while reading from Goethe's erotic poetry?

I think most people would dispute that this constitutes sex.

Not even remotely the same scenario depicted in this episode.

If you're having sex with an unfamiliar alien species, well, you'd still have limits to what you'd believe could be done

Who says? Further, if you have supreme pride, are totally confident in your racial and cultural superiority, and you've just been challenged?

(and if you're sane, a healthy concern in knowing exactly what's going on - who knows what sort of alien things could be diseases to you? )

If this were a big concern for you, you wouldn't be going around engaging in rampant sexcapades.

Humans don't always do that, either, get overly concerned about diseases, that is. They take chances ALL THE TIME.

Well, no, concrete scientific fact, proved after years of careful surveys of the geostatic thermum of the triplanetary core.

Leave the funny to the pros. Yes, even JMS.

 

[Oden]

JMS is very talented. One thing he is sorely lacking though is the ability to produce anything of comedic value. Just watch mentioned "sexscene" and the whole sockpuppet thing on the lost tales.

Its all very horrible.

 

[Kegg]

JMS is very talented. One thing he is sorely lacking though is the ability to produce anything of comedic value. Just watch mentioned "sexscene" and the whole sockpuppet thing on the lost tales.

Its all very horrible.

I wouldn't go that far. Green/Purple is great (although the deadpanning of the actors who played the Drazi is a big part of that), so there are times he can make funny work.

The thing is about JMS is, well, he's very much a product of his career writing for such quality TV shows like Walker, Tex Ranger; no matter how good he gets (and he gets damn good) there's always a whiff of TV hackery somewhere down the line.

Not even remotely the same scenario depicted in this episode.

It's actually exactly as plausible. I'm saying something sexual while not doing anything sexual.

Further, if you have supreme pride, are totally confident in your racial and cultural superiority, and you've just been challenged?

Challenged by nonsense? Yeah, it's a big risk that someone will not call you out on your nonsense.

If this were a big concern for you, you wouldn't be going around engaging in rampant sexcapades.

That's like suggesting daredevils shouldn't take safety precautions.

Leave the funny to the pros. Yes, even JMS.

The leave the stating of the obvious to somebody else?

 

[stonester1]

It's actually exactly as plausible. I'm saying something sexual while not doing anything sexual.

Does your scenario have in individual supreme in his belief in the superiority of his culture and species, utterly ignorant about much of that in others, and with too much pride to admit it?

No, it does not.

It's all about context, Kegg.

Challenged by nonsense? Yeah, it's a big risk that someone will not call you out on your nonsense.

Again, context.

That's like suggesting daredevils shouldn't take safety precautions.

Some don't. I take it you've never watched Jackass?

The leave the stating of the obvious to somebody else?

No, you state your opinion very often like it's a fact everyone should recognize. I find it annoying, so every now and then, I'm going to make fun of you.

 

[TheGodBen]

Why is commiting violence on him better than a silly dance that revealed his ignorance?

Because it would have spared me from having to watch the silly dance.

Leave the funny to the pros.

Okay, fine, I'll get back to being funny.

Funny... funny... what would be funny...?

Aha, got it!

The two people that remember this joke are now mildly amused.

 

[Kegg]

That's like suggesting daredevils shouldn't take safety precautions.

Some don't.

And some do. Ivanova's plan isn't super smart, it's an obscenely reckless gamble. She just happens to luck onto exactly the response she needed. He has to not have any concern about safety precautions, and he has to be able not to think or question about what is happening at all. Luckily, he doesn't, but if he did, kaput goes your stab.

I take it you've never watched Jackass?

Of course not.

No, you state your opinion very often like it's a fact everyone should recognize.

My opinion is a fact.

So, if it is my opinion that Londo Mollari is the main character of B5, then it is factually true that this is my opinion.

My opinion is not fact, though. The 'a' is important, methinks.

But that aside, I just like simple, declarative statements, because the alternative is the rambling overlong sentence with far too many commas that a dyslexic might create, for example, this one.

 

[sidious618]

I found Babylon 5 funny quite often. JMS is funny in the script books, too.

 

[Stone_Cold_Sisko]

JMS is very talented. One thing he is sorely lacking though is the ability to produce anything of comedic value. Just watch mentioned "sexscene" and the whole sockpuppet thing on the lost tales.

Its all very horrible.

I think this is mostly true. Maybe a tad harsh but generally right.

The "humorous" scenes on Babylon 5 are truly cringe-worthy. The "sex" scene is a particularly egregious example, but there are a fair amount of other "cute" funny scenes which are mind-bogglingly un-funny.

 

[stonester1]

Why is commiting violence on him better than a silly dance that revealed his ignorance?

Because it would have spared me from having to watch the silly dance.

Leave the funny to the pros.

Okay, fine, I'll get back to being funny.

Funny... funny... what would be funny...?

Aha, got it!

The two people that remember this joke are now mildly amused.

That's better.

 

[stonester1]

And some do. Ivanova's plan isn't super smart, it's an obscenely reckless gamble. She just happens to luck onto exactly the response she needed. He has to not have any concern about safety precautions, and he has to be able not to think or question about what is happening at all. Luckily, he doesn't, but if he did, kaput goes your stab.

She gambled. Sometimes you do this. She had reason to believe she had the high hand.

There's a "rolling the hard six" joke in here someplace.

I take it you've never watched Jackass?

Of course not.

Well...there you go.

 

[Reverend]

I have watched Jackass. It's not funny.

The Ivanova dance isn't funny either, it's cringe worthy. However the reactions of the two Lumati is certainly comical. As for the plausibility of the ruse...well since we have no clue how alien sex rituals compare (nor do I really want to, especially if a pak'ma'ra is involved) I suppose it's as plausible as anything else.
Still if you must have a point of comparison, the newcomers on Alien Nation did it by humming loudly on each other's backs while Vulcans have a thing with gentle finger touching. I wouldn't be surprised if Drazi foreplay involved a head butting contest.

Point is the Lumati are culturally insular and wouldn't know any different. Plus Ivanova is at her core a mischievous extrovert and a party girl (seriously, watcher her any time she has a drink in her hand; 'Parliament of Dreams' is a good example.) The whole morbidly depressed, deathly serious, rip your lungs out as soon as look at you thing is just an elaborate front.

 

[Kegg]

Oh I can buy the dance as foreplay (surely that could be hypothetically anything, and there could be species who do not use the concept). But not as sex. Which apparently Ivanova is selling it as.

 

[stonester1]

I have watched Jackass. It's not funny.

Of course it's not. The question was whether stunt people always put on safety gear. The answer is NO.

The Ivanova dance isn't funny either, it's cringe worthy. However the reactions of the two Lumati is certainly comical. As for the plausibility of the ruse...well since we have no clue how alien sex rituals compare (nor do I really want to, especially if a pak'ma'ra is involved) I suppose it's as plausible as anything else.

Exactly. Although I like Ivanova's stuff, though more what she said than the dance itself.

Still if you must have a point of comparison, the newcomers on Alien Nation did it by humming loudly on each other's backs while Vulcans have a thing with gentle finger touching. I wouldn't be surprised if Drazi foreplay involved a head butting contest.

Don't forget Klingons...

Point is the Lumati are culturally insular and wouldn't know any different.

And in the case of their rulers, never, ever, EVER admit it.

 

[Kegg]

I have watched Jackass. It's not funny.

Of course it's not. The question was whether stunt people always put on safety gear. The answer is NO.

It was never that.

First, it was whether or not they sometimes take precautions.

And second, that they take precautions.

That's different. Stuff like researching what it is you're going to do and what the consequences to you could be, and, of course, how to do it right.