Discouraging Kirk/Spock slashers...

[barnaclelapse]

As a writer, I cut my teeth on fan fiction when I first got truly serious about writing for a living when I was about eleven, twelve years old. I wrote tons of fan fiction for tons of different fandoms, was very successful with it and had a great time until I quit to focus on original material.

I'm only saying this as a frame of reference. The point I'm trying to make is that there is absolutely nothing in any film, television, book, comic or any other creative medium that a fan fiction writer can't explain away in order to fuel their own stories.

 

[Mr. Adventure]

Thanks for the excerpt, Mr. Adventure. Great! Got a bit more where that came from? Or is that about the size of it?

Hey, someone saw it! As far as I have read (about 90 pages or so) I think that's the only type of reference and it's presented as an odd "editor's note" type of footnote.

where did you post it?

Post #51, I edited the post to make it more obvious, maybe it looked like I was just quoting someone's post.

 

[cubbie]

it was in his TMP novelization. he certainly enjoyed the interest it generated.

I haven't read this. What exactly did he put in there?

From the ST:TMP Novelization:

*Editor's note: The human concept of friend is most nearly duplicated in Vulcan thought by the term t'hy'la, which can also mean brother or lover, and since Kirk and Spock's friendship was unusually close, this led to some speculation over whether they had actually indeed become lovers. At our request, Admiral Kirk supplied the following comment on the subject:

"I was never aware of this lovers rumor, although I have been told that Spock encountered it several times. Apparently he had always dismissed it with his characteristic lifting of his right eyebrow which usually connotated some combination of surprise, disbelief, and/or annoyance. As for myself, although I have no moral or other objections to physical love in any of its many Earthly, alien, and mixed forms, I have always found my best gratification in that creature woman. Also, I would dislike being thought of as so foolish that I would select a love partner who came into sexual heat only once every seven years."

I'm only part way through it but it's a trippy read.

Missed it! Thanks for the excerpt!

 

[Admiral Pike]

Re: Dicouraging Kirk/Spock slashers...

See, you have to ignore these people. Just like Hawkeye/Trapper slashers, they can't be reasoned with or discouraged. You can't even convince them that there are other really disturbing pairings they could do that make more sense.

Riker/Worf.
Data/Geordi.
Tuvok/Kim.
Archer/Trip.
Janeway/Seven

 

[An Officer]

Re: Dicouraging Kirk/Spock slashers...

Now, my curiosity is satisfied, courtesy of Mr. Adventure. I actually love this forum. Reminds me of why I first started posting on tbbs...

 

[indranee]

I haven't read this. What exactly did he put in there?

From the ST:TMP Novelization:

*Editor's note: The human concept of friend is most nearly duplicated in Vulcan thought by the term t'hy'la, which can also mean brother or lover, and since Kirk and Spock's friendship was unusually close, this led to some speculation over whether they had actually indeed become lovers. At our request, Admiral Kirk supplied the following comment on the subject:

"I was never aware of this lovers rumor, although I have been told that Spock encountered it several times. Apparently he had always dismissed it with his characteristic lifting of his right eyebrow which usually connotated some combination of surprise, disbelief, and/or annoyance. As for myself, although I have no moral or other objections to physical love in any of its many Earthly, alien, and mixed forms, I have always found my best gratification in that creature woman. Also, I would dislike being thought of as so foolish that I would select a love partner who came into sexual heat only once every seven years."

I'm only part way through it but it's a trippy read.

Missed it! Thanks for the excerpt!

oh me too!

thanks, Mr. Adventure!

 

[indranee]

Re: Dicouraging Kirk/Spock slashers...

See, you have to ignore these people. Just like Hawkeye/Trapper slashers, they can't be reasoned with or discouraged. You can't even convince them that there are other really disturbing pairings they could do that make more sense.

Riker/Worf.
Data/Geordi.
Tuvok/Kim.
Archer/Trip.
Janeway/Seven

Neelix/Tuvok takes the cake though

and it's canon... well, almost

 

[cubbie]

The scary ones are in Harry Potter fandom.

Snape/monster from the lake

 

[An Officer]

Re: Dicouraging Kirk/Spock slashers...

Neelix/Tuvok takes the cake though

and it's canon... well, almost

Now I'm going to have to wash out my eyes, with bleach, after reading that. Surely that deserves a warning for being intolerably disgusting?

 

[indranee]

just don't watch VOY then

 

[An Officer]

^ You speak blasphemy, my child. I must worship at the alter of Voyager daily.

 

[seniorsleuth]

Re: Dicouraging Kirk/Spock slashers...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirk/Spock

Do you agree with the above entry that Uhura is paired with Spock (with Kirk also salivating after her), largely to discourage slashers in nutrek?

Or it could lead to a new brand of K/U/S slash, where it is a very, very complicated love and sex triangle.

Honestly, I don't think anything could discourage those that are into reading or writing that particular brand of fan fiction. It's existed and will continue to exist whether or not we agree with it.

From the essay that was quoted in wikipedia:

2. I've read reviews which suggest that the Uhura in this film represents a progressive reworking of the character from classic Trek. I'm not convinced yet, even though I very much liked the actress who played the part. However limited her role might be ("hailing frequencies are open, Captain"), the original Uhura was defined first and foremost by her contributions as a member of the Enterprise Crew. Whatever subtext there was suggesting a Kirk/Uhura romance, it was just that -- a subtext -- left for fans to infer from a few telling moments in the trajectory of the series, among them, the first interracial kiss on American television -- albeit executed under mind control -- albeit an implied projection of one or both of the character's actual desires.
In the new film, Uhura asserts her professional competence but she never really demonstrates it. How does that make her different from many of the female professionals in classic Trek who are introduced in terms of their professional abilities and then reduced to being the girlfriend of the week for one of the primary characters? Here, more screen time is devoted to her but she's ultimately a love object in some kind of still to be explored romantic triangle between Kirk and Spock. Basically, she's been inserted into the story to discourage fans from writing slash stories, though most of us won't have any trouble figuring out how the exchange of women facilitates an expression of homosocial/homoerotic desire.



SOURCE: http://henryjenkins.org/2009/05/five_ways_to_start_a_conversat.html

Despite Jenkins' assertion about the affect of Uhura and Spock's relationship on K/S fanfic, I must say that I agree with his appraisal of Uhura's role in terms of her professional competence. I was disappointed that we didn't get to see Uhura in action, using her abilities as a lingusit. While I'm glad she is finally the female lead of a Trek movie, I felt that the writers merely told us of her abilities rather than showing us.

Well, we don't particularly "see" the skills of McCoy either (except his making Kirk sick and then better), but we can infer them in all sorts of ways. I think Uhura has been positioned as the third most important character, at least equal to McCoy, and I expect to see this played out in future installments. She's already more central to the plot than Uhura ever was in TOS.

 

[kimc]

just don't watch VOY then

That's crazy talk!

 

[indranee]

*cowers*

 

[Minuialeth]

Thanks for the quote, Mr Adventure

Also, I would dislike being thought of as so foolish that I would select a love partner who came into sexual heat only once every seven years.

Well, Spock is half human

I have no problem with slash, I do read it from time to time when the pairing isn't completely out of there.
Cubbie, there can be scary ones in Lord of the Rings, too. Legolas/Treebeard

I've never tried to read any Kirk/Spock yet, in fact I had never read any ST fanfiction until I started to search for some Spock/Uhura after watching the movie. I did write some (bad) ST fanfiction eons ago (TOS and TNG), when I only had paper, pen and a typewriter to do so.
I don't know if you are familiar with Patrick O'Brian's books, but Kirk and Spock's friendship somehow remind me of Aubrey and Mathurin's. The laters have been slashed to death. Hmmm, maybe I should read some Kirk/Spock, there's more of those stories around on ff.net than the Spock/Uhura ones anyway

 

[cubbie]

Cubbie, there can be scary ones in Lord of the Rings, too. Legolas/Treebeard

That gives new meaning to a woody.

 

[PiperMaru22]

In regards to the subject of this post...has no one considered that it's not Uhura that's breaking up K/S but our good ole Doctor McCoy?! I mean, I never slashed K/S (err...um...why hello there Spock/McCoy -I think it's all the bickering), and while I think this movie probably does more for that pairing than the original show did...I gotta say that I found the Spock/Uhura and Kirk/McCoy parallels very interesting. And that foursome doesn't even have to be seen in a sexual context (except for S/U of course), but I think it's definitely there. McCoy and Uhura pretty much were Kirk and Spock's respective back-ups/moral support in the new movie.

I haven't read this. What exactly did he put in there?

From the ST:TMP Novelization:

*Editor's note: The human concept of friend is most nearly duplicated in Vulcan thought by the term t'hy'la, which can also mean brother or lover, and since Kirk and Spock's friendship was unusually close, this led to some speculation over whether they had actually indeed become lovers. At our request, Admiral Kirk supplied the following comment on the subject:

"I was never aware of this lovers rumor, although I have been told that Spock encountered it several times. Apparently he had always dismissed it with his characteristic lifting of his right eyebrow which usually connotated some combination of surprise, disbelief, and/or annoyance. As for myself, although I have no moral or other objections to physical love in any of its many Earthly, alien, and mixed forms, I have always found my best gratification in that creature woman. Also, I would dislike being thought of as so foolish that I would select a love partner who came into sexual heat only once every seven years."

I'm only part way through it but it's a trippy read.

Thanks for that! I think I need to read the TMP novelization now! Good to know Kirk has no objections to any sort of physical love (that playa). I cracked up though at "I would dislike being thought of as so foolish that I would select a love partner who came into sexual heat only once every seven years" -because we all know Kirk couldn't handle only getting some every seven years!

The scary ones are in Harry Potter fandom.

Snape/monster from the lake

Or Sirius/Buckbeak? Or hey, even the classic Hogwarts/Squid?

 

[An Officer]

I recently read a very good fanfic where McCoy tells Kirk that if he had to fill out a sexual preference form for him, instead of ticking a preference, he'd probably have to indicate "All of the above."

 

[indranee]

^

if you guys really want to read some outstanding K/S, I couldn't recommend Killashandra's stories more. she's an unbelievable writer.

http://www.fanhistory.com/wiki/Killashandra

here's a K/S story that's probably her best:

http://seacouver.slashcity.net/killa/part1.html

 

[Captain Fine]

Thanks for your post writergal. It was informative

Thanks! I think fan fiction gets a bad rap - a lot of people sneer at it and say it's not really serious writing, but honestly some of the best fiction I've ever read has come out of the Hornblower fanfic list that I moderate. It's great for early writers because you don't have to worry about establishing characters or setting - the originators have done that work for you - and can concentrate on telling the story and maybe creating new characters.

And you have a built-in readership, of people who already like the show, so they're more willing to give your writing a shot and tell you what they did or didn't like about it. Writers live on feedback, so this is very cool. Some fanfiction writers have gone on to become published, and get paid for their work.

I think you bring up some points. Writing is writing. If you can learn to write WELL from fanfic, and had fun doing it, more power to you. Many moons ago I was writing a Star Wars kind of EU story. I don't know what happened to it. Lost on another hard drive somewhere. But I think I spent more time making lists of the Star Destroyers in my characters' fleets than writing story