The ENT Timeline's Survival (STXI Spoilers)

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

I am very pleased that the ENT timeline is the only one that survives unscathed in Star Trek XI. It's just a delicious irony after all the ENT bashing I have read for years.

HAHAHA IN YOUR FACE ENT BASHERS !!!

Just had to get that off my chest.

 

[ChristopherPike]

While I'm still coming to terms with it, I suppose the beauty of an Alternate Reality is that Prime Universe hasn't been erased.

I'm actually wondering since they done divergence now, if they'd ever converge at some point in the future... Maybe impossible with one founding Federation member left without a homeword now.

It is nice Enterprise that has a foot in both camps... twice as many opportunities to be revisited in the future.

 

[Nebusj]

I am very pleased that the ENT timeline is the only one that survives unscathed in Star Trek XI. It's just a delicious irony after all the ENT bashing I have read for years.

HAHAHA IN YOUR FACE ENT BASHERS !!!

Just had to get that off my chest.

However, it does present a logical problem with the ``ENT DEFENDER'' position that any (apparent) discrepancies between the Original Series timeline and the Enterprise timeline could be explained by the time-travel interference seen in First Contact. Given the considerable difficulties in supposing that First Contact proceeded to happen, in fact, at a minimum the Borg episode has to be pitched overboard.

 

[Cyrus]

There was some discussion of this in the TrekXI forum:

http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=93046

In that thread TrekGuide makes a good case that ENT time line remains unchanged.

 

[Skywalker]

I am very pleased that the ENT timeline is the only one that survives unscathed in Star Trek XI. It's just a delicious irony after all the ENT bashing I have read for years.

HAHAHA IN YOUR FACE ENT BASHERS !!!

Just had to get that off my chest.

However, it does present a logical problem with the ``ENT DEFENDER'' position that any (apparent) discrepancies between the Original Series timeline and the Enterprise timeline could be explained by the time-travel interference seen in First Contact. Given the considerable difficulties in supposing that First Contact proceeded to happen, in fact, at a minimum the Borg episode has to be pitched overboard.

It's like in Lost: "Whatever happened, happened." The events of First Contact in the 21st century, "Regeneration," all of it.

 

[Penhall99]

Yeah, I was thinking about this the other day. ENT is the only show that officially still occured in the new timeline.

But thats okay. ENT was my least favorite of the Trek shows, but what I watched of the last few seasons was pretty solid. I missed so many episodes throughout, I'd like to go back and watch it again.

And I do wish it had gotten a better final episode, one that really ended it and gave the series more closure.

 

[qstor]

I am very pleased that the ENT timeline is the only one that survives unscathed in Star Trek XI. It's just a delicious irony after all the ENT bashing I have read for years.

HAHAHA IN YOUR FACE ENT BASHERS !!!

Just had to get that off my chest.

As I posted in the other forum. We don't know that yet. We have to see what happens with the Klingons and the Andorians.

Mike

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Given the considerable difficulties in supposing that First Contact proceeded to happen, in fact, at a minimum the Borg episode has to be pitched overboard.

I don't think so. Not only does ENT survive unscathed, but the beauty of alternate timelines and the fact that they can continue to exist, means that ENT episodes that feature them (Regeneration, In A Mirror Darkly) also can be unchanged.

Nothing has happened to the prime timeline. It hasn't been wiped out or altered in any way. So those episodes that feature characters from that timeline, logically must be able to still happen. Remember, in ENT's time, THERE IS NO DIVERGENCE. The separate timelines - prime, and abramsverse - don't even exist yet.

 

[teacherbrock]

Given the considerable difficulties in supposing that First Contact proceeded to happen, in fact, at a minimum the Borg episode has to be pitched overboard.

I don't think so. Not only does ENT survive unscathed, but the beauty of alternate timelines and the fact that they can continue to exist, means that ENT episodes that feature them (Regeneration, In A Mirror Darkly) also can be unchanged.

Nothing has happened to the prime timeline. It hasn't been wiped out or altered in any way. So those episodes that feature characters from that timeline, logically must be able to still happen. Remember, in ENT's time, THERE IS NO DIVERGENCE. The separate timelines - prime, and abramsverse - don't even exist yet.

ENT itself is a divergence from the TNG worldline. There was no NX model in the conference room of enterprise-e, no history of a warp 5 vessal named Enterprise until went back in time and spilled the beans to Zephrim Cochrin.

The reason the NX was named Enterprise is because Jordi and Riker just had to show and NAME their ship to him.

Abramsverse is a divergence from the first contact divergence.

 

[Broccoli]

Given the considerable difficulties in supposing that First Contact proceeded to happen, in fact, at a minimum the Borg episode has to be pitched overboard.

I don't think so. Not only does ENT survive unscathed, but the beauty of alternate timelines and the fact that they can continue to exist, means that ENT episodes that feature them (Regeneration, In A Mirror Darkly) also can be unchanged.

Nothing has happened to the prime timeline. It hasn't been wiped out or altered in any way. So those episodes that feature characters from that timeline, logically must be able to still happen. Remember, in ENT's time, THERE IS NO DIVERGENCE. The separate timelines - prime, and abramsverse - don't even exist yet.

ENT itself is a divergence from the TNG worldline. There was no NX model in the conference room of enterprise-e, no history of a warp 5 vessal named Enterprise until went back in time and spilled the beans to Zephrim Cochrin.

The reason the NX was named Enterprise is because Jordi and Riker just had to show and NAME their ship to him.

Abramsverse is a divergence from the first contact divergence.

The NX-01 wasn't a Federation starship, which might be why it wasn't included in the 1701 display. Also, if we are going to split hairs here for nitpicking the producers on something that hadn't occurred yet, how come the display for the E-B didn't include the fins, yet in Generations, the E-B had fins?

 

[Hopeful Romantic]

The nitpicking can go overboard. Is there an in-story reason that Saavik looked different in ST2 and ST3? No. She's still Saavik. The fact that the character was played by two different actresses is a "God's eye view" explanation that isn't relevant to the world of the story. Is there an explanation in-story for why T'Pol's eyebrows changed between Season 2 and Season 3? No. Do these lapses shake the very foundation of the entire Trek universe? Not for me.

Sometimes the gods of the Trekverse (the writers) choose to address these real-world matters (ex: the makeup for Klingons varied wildly because of budget, makeup artists, creative decisions) and have some fun weaving an explanation into the world of the story (the difference in Klingon foreheads was due to a virus). But if they don't address something that might not match up because it didn't exist in the minds of the gods at the time...eh. I figure they're hoping some fans, somewhere, don their "suspension of disbelief" gear and sail merrily along with the story. Personally, I prefer that to a director going back and re-editing the bejeebus out of his old movie in some impossible quest to make it "perfect."

With Trek XI, there is that whole scene that lays out the existence of an alternate (not replacement) universe. Consider that there may be any number of timelines, including the unscathed as-is Enterprise timeline, and a new timeline altered by Nero's actions retroactively. A pre-"First Contact" timeline and a post-"FC" timeline. All at once. It seems that Trek adopted this POV long ago with its co-existing mirror universe.

You have the freedom as a viewer to choose what explanation is credible for you and satisfies you (or gives you reason to object ).

 

[buzzknox]

[QUOTE from Brocolli]
The NX-01 wasn't a Federation starship, which might be why it wasn't included in the 1701 display. [/QUOTE]

I can't recall but was CVN-65 depicted as a predecessor in name to the 1701-D, as it was the 1701/1701-A?

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Neither the briefing room wall on the Ent-E, nor the rec room scene in ST:TMP, displayed *every* ship that was ever named Enterprise. They all had to pick and choose which Enterprises they would show. So any ship's absence from either display is hardly definitive. Just because a ship (such as the NX-01) doesn't appear in one or the other, doesn't mean it never existed.

For example, the TMP rec room scene only shows the *first* aircraft carrier Enterprise (the one that existed during the second world war), and not the second one, the CVN-65 which is in use today. Yet CVN-65 obviously exists. Make of that what you will.

 

[Broccoli]

buzzknox:

The post I was responding to questioned why the NX-01 wasn't in the ship display that displayed only starships on the Ent-E (which, I believe, only displayed the Fed starships).

Also, if you are going to quote someone, at least spell their name correctly.

Neither the briefing room wall on the Ent-E, nor the rec room scene in ST:TMP, displayed *every* ship that was ever named Enterprise. They all had to pick and choose which Enterprises they would show. So any ship's absence from either display is hardly definitive. Just because a ship (such as the NX-01) doesn't appear in one or the other, doesn't mean it never existed.

For example, the TMP rec room scene only shows the *first* aircraft carrier Enterprise (the one that existed during the second world war), and not the second one, the CVN-65 which is in use today. Yet CVN-65 obviously exists. Make of that what you will.

Bing! Bing! Bing! We have a winner.

 

[Praetor]

Of course in the XI version of the events of "Enterprise," there's lots of lens flare, different production designs, and an entirely different cast.

 

[Star Treks]

I know what is supposed to be inferred from the film, but...

In theory, since we know there are plenty of alternate timelines (including the "Mirror Universe" and the timelines we see in Parallels), is there any real reason to assume that the pre-Nerofied universe at the beginning of Trek XI actually is the "prime" timeline that we know and love?

Actually, it makes more sense to assume that it isn't (the Kelvin looks totally different from either Enterprise or TOS design, for example). Now I know we're supposed to think of it as the prime timeline, but there's not any real canonical reason to assume that this was the same timeline before Nero meddled (hell, there's no reason to assume that our Spock in Trek XI is actually our Spock and not just a similar Spock from a vaguely similar timeline).

Just sayin'.

 

[iguana_tonante]

On the other hand, that means that there is only one version of Enterprise, while we have two versions (original and alternate) of TOS, TNG, DS9 an VOY, one of which we have never watched! 24 brand new seasons of good Trek!

 

[witchie]

As an Enterprise fan, I was thrilled (maybe giddy) with the Enterprise references. Finally some respect within the fandom. If they never mention any Enterprise again, I'm good with what we did get. Though, I must admit to wondering if T'Pol was on Vulcan at the time of its destruction and if Trip was the professor Scotty got into the argument with. But I can fanwank those answers.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

T'Pol was never happy living on Vulcan. As her mother said she always struggled to control her emotions when young and now of course she is permanently compromised thanks to trellium damage. I seriously doubt she would be spending her elder years there.. by then she would be mourning Trip's death, probably quite at peace with her emotions in a way similar to Old Spock. I have every reason to believe she would be living offworld.

 

[buzzknox]

buzzknox:

The post I was responding to questioned why the NX-01 wasn't in the ship display that displayed only starships on the Ent-E (which, I believe, only displayed the Fed starships).

Also, if you are going to quote someone, at least spell their name correctly.

Neither the briefing room wall on the Ent-E, nor the rec room scene in ST:TMP, displayed *every* ship that was ever named Enterprise. They all had to pick and choose which Enterprises they would show. So any ship's absence from either display is hardly definitive. Just because a ship (such as the NX-01) doesn't appear in one or the other, doesn't mean it never existed.

For example, the TMP rec room scene only shows the *first* aircraft carrier Enterprise (the one that existed during the second world war), and not the second one, the CVN-65 which is in use today. Yet CVN-65 obviously exists. Make of that what you will.

Bing! Bing! Bing! We have a winner.

I was trying to parse the multiple quotes down to just the specific item I was asking about and had what we shall call "technical difficulties". I noticed the error in terms of CV-6 and the misspelling of your name when I came back to this thread just now. My apologies for both.