Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Aide?

[siskokid888]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

Your review pretty much sums up my feelings towards the movie. While I wouldn't go as far as calling it an "abomination" outright, I agree with most of what you said. And I can't understand why people praise it so much, perhaps there's some kinda subliminal messages hidden in there that hypnotize people and blind them to the fact that the plot is awful.

Yea, the plot is awful. No where as good as a group of near cave men taking over a starship and Spock dying....but not really dying as he comes back to life and then they go back and save the whales to stop a probe that will destroy earth (for the second time) and then Spock's brother (!) shows up and easily steals the Enterprise and then the Klingon's moon explodes and drunk Klingons are saved by the Ent crew reading books and then Kirk and Picard with the chance to come back in time anywhere come back at the most assinine moment possible and then they chase the Borg, who only ever send one ship, back in time and then they rebel against starfleet although not really because it was their duty to stop a crime and then Picard's clone that looks and acts nothing like him attacks the Federation. Yup, JJ's story really pales against that. I tell you what - why don't all you naysayers head to the basement and slap in that well worn copy of Trek 5 and continue to try and figure out where the hell Sybok came from. The rest of us will join JJ on what looks to be a hell of a ride on the Enterprise.

 

[Vigilance]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

And I can't understand why people praise it so much, perhaps there's some kinda subliminal messages hidden in there that hypnotize people and blind them to the fact that the plot is awful.

I know this might come as a shock but...

Your tastes are not universal. Other people can like things you hate without being blind *OR* hypnotized.

 

[bismarck_1892]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

And I can't understand why people praise it so much, perhaps there's some kinda subliminal messages hidden in there that hypnotize people and blind them to the fact that the plot is awful.

I know this might come as a shock but...

Your tastes are not universal. Other people can like things you hate without being blind *OR* hypnotized.

There is no subliminal message. The movie had the same problems every other Trek movie had (well almost everyother).

 

[Phantassm]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

It's just a film to me. I don't live and drink star trek and I most certainly don't get depressed over it. I love TOS and as I have said in many threads, I got 79 episodes and 6 motion pictures. I'm cool.

 

[RAnthony]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

You're already criticizing a movie that you haven't seen, yet I'm the fanatic because I can't take you seriously because of that. Okay.

No, you're the fanatic because your signature is taken from the film. You're the fanatic because your avatar is you in a Star Trek costume with a Star Trek background. You're the fanatic because the slightest negative comment sends you on a keyboard driven attack.

As of now, you're griping about a movie you haven't seen, and insulting people who have seen it and like it. Now who is whom in this little situation?

I'm the SF person who isn't afraid to walk away from a franchise (held by a company that has given the word 'franchise' a negative connotation) that has strayed so far from cannon that it bears little resemblance to the original other than the names of characters.

I'm the SF 'fan' who understands what it means to be a fanatic, and knows enough to step away from the keyboard when I'm about to embarrass myself.

As someone who was watching in '67, I think I have the right to reserve judgment on Paramount's (and Abrams') work until I see it, while still having the bad taste of Nemesis and Enterprise left in my mouth; and no amount of gushing from fans is going to change that.

I'll see it when I see it, but Paramount's (and Abrams') track record don't inspire confidence.

I'm also the Star Trek fan who's willing to watch the 'franchise' of Trek die for lack of interest, rather than promote anything with the Trek name on it, just so it will continue. Anyone who does this meets the definition of mindless fan.

Gene and his vision meant more to me than that.

-RAnthony

 

[cyberengland]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

I am glad that RAnthony's opinion is in the minority here.

 

[gottacook]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

...the first week or two is always the most irrational as far as the fanbase goes. Invariably, people cool down and their opinions of the film become much more nuanced. People who once thought the movie was absolutely good with no exception start to see more uneven aspects, and fanatical critics realize some of the merits of the film. I would implore everyone to try and reach back to how they felt about any film they really, really liked at first glance and see if their opinion became a little more sophisticated over time. ... Opinions -always- become more nuanced with time and thought.

This brings to mind the reaction to the first Star Trek movie in December 1979, which was equally expensive (for its time) and equally highly publicized. Fans, myself included, were indeed overjoyed at first but then found they had much to take issue with. And not just fans: I lived in center-city Philly at the time, and the Inquirer's movie reviewer was ga-ga at first (headline "The Film's Just Heavenly") but soon backtracked in print ("With some reservations, I liked it very much").

[Personally I haven't seen Abrams-Trek and probably won't, not because of fans' story-related quibbles, but rather because I don't react well to shakycam cinematography (either in TV or movies), and I've seen enough clips to know that's what is on offer here. What happened to the art of directing?]

 

[backstept]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

If you stop and think about it, there is no way that this movie could have pleased everyone and still been the huge success that it is.

A new cast was necessary - The surviving castmembers of The Original Series and all 4 spinoffs are getting older. A new cast was necessary because all the rest are legendary, and we know them so well that telling a new story with them would be very difficult for the movie to be a success.

A new story was necessary - After Nemesis (outside of Trek Lit.) TREK itself felt tired and stretched thin . . . the only logical option left was an origin story. In each of the series the crews were already in place, and we gradually explored their backstories, but never did we see how the original characters came to be such strong friends aboard Enterprise. For this movie to be the success that it is, and appeal to new fans as well as the old guard, the only logical option was the origin story, because honestly, we've seen everything else.

A new look was necessary - The Original Series was a vision of the future from the 1960s, STAR TREK is a vision of the future from 2009. There was no way that 60s trek's cardboard sets, and even ST:TMP-VI's vision of future from the 80s and 90s would be at all convincing or appealing to today's audience. There's no beating around the bush on this one: a new look was necessary because everything else is severely dated.

Everything came together perfectly. Orci and Kurtzman gave us a story where every character has their moment. Think about the NextGen movies: Picard and the Nexus, Picard and the Borg, Picard and the Fountain of Youth Planet, Picard and His Evil Romulan Twin. Orci and Kurtzman made sure that every character had a purpose in the story, and that the minor characters weren't just there because they're familiar. Sulu had more to do than just say "Course plotted." Chekov had more to do than say "Aye, Keptin." Uhura had way more to do than just say "Hailing frequencies open." Sure, Kirk and Spock are the stars, but this movie was about more than just how these two icons came to be legends. It was about the whole crew working together to make Enterprise the legendary ship it is.

Abrams turned Orci and Kurtzman's script into a living and breathing adventure where each character IS who they're supposed to be, without copying past performances or doing bad impressions of the original actors.

There is simply absolutely no other way this movie could have been made for it to be such the huge success that it is.

Why do some feel insulted? The changes made in this movie may feel like a lack of respect for the original. I say it's the exact opposite: the changes made in this movie were made out of utmost respect for the original, and were necessary to give new life to a dying franchise.

This was a triumph, and a huge success. Star Trek is still alive.

 

[Captain_Rogers]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

If you stop and think about it, there is no way that this movie could have pleased everyone and still been the huge success that it is.

Indeed.

And honestly, if the film had been made for the people who are whining and bitching the most around here, the film would have grossed $47.50 opening weekend and Trek would be done.

The movie isn't about pleasing fanatics. Making respectable box office receipts to justify the franchise continued existence.

This film is making records for Star Trek. And it was good and fun.

It respected Roddenberry's vision and spirit.

This isn't NuTrek, and it's not Abrams Trek. It's Star Trek.

 

[RAnthony]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

If you stop and think about it, there is no way that this movie could have pleased everyone and still been the huge success that it is.

28th on the list of all time most grossing opening weekends.
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/alltime/weekends/

Good, but not huge. Two of the three second trilogy Star Wars films finished higher. Last weeks Wolverine opening also finished higher (I have seen that one, it's pretty good) Personally, after 42 years of the franchise that defined fandom, I would have expected better. Chalk it up to Paramount's manhandling of the fans, I guess.

-RAnthony

 

[Lumen]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

That's silly. Star Trek fans -- whatever is left of them -- aren't numerous enough to make this opening any bigger.

 

[Borgminister]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

Two of the three second trilogy Star Wars films finished higher.

And were far superior stories than Star Trek!

Last weeks Wolverine opening also finished higher (I have seen that one, it's pretty good)

Shakespeare by comparison to Star Trek!

 

[RAnthony]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

Two of the three second trilogy Star Wars films finished higher.

And were far superior stories than Star Trek!

"I'm haunted by the kiss you shouldn't have given me" all time worst written love scenes, all of them in the Star Wars prequels. Man, I hope the film is better than that.

-RAnthony

 

[casey325]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

Anyone who has watched Star Trek for any amount of time would realize that this movie is so "fresh and new" just like Gene would of liked it. I think Abrams did a great job and tied it in all perfectly so hey it makes sense and he doesn't have to explain himself everytime he gets a new "creative" idea. Just an observation

 

[Amaris]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

That's silly. Star Trek fans -- whatever is left of them -- aren't numerous enough to make this opening any bigger.

We saw what happened when only Star Trek fans showed up, and that was Nemesis. $67,312,826 worldwide for the entire run. Star Trek is about to, if not already, succeed that number and it did it in 3 days and only counting what was made nationwide.

J.

 

[Nightcreature]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

I haven't watched the movie and will not spend money on it.

I don't drink the Kool Aid and I'm proud of it!!! I agree Shatner is Kirk and the crew did not need to be recast. It's an insult to the original series. What's next?? Recasting TNG a few years from now? DS9? Where does it end?

I'm sure reading non canon series like New Frontier would be much more enjoyable than watching this new reboot, recast desperation Trek. Is this origin story really canon?? I thought it conflicted with a lot of established Trek??? Where is Robert April?

I think if they came up with a new crew and a new ship, that would have been even better. Why fix it if it ain't broke? The old crew did not need to be recast. They were fine just as they were unlike Batman or Bond.

 

[Amaris]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

I haven't watched the movie and will not spend money on it.

I don't drink the Kool Aid and I'm proud of it!!! I agree Shatner is Kirk and the crew did not need to be recast. It's an insult to the original series. What's next?? Recasting TNG a few years from now? DS9? Where does it end?

I'm sure reading non canon series like New Frontier would be much more enjoyable than watching this new reboot, recast desperation Trek. Is this origin story really canon?? I thought it conflicted with a lot of established Trek??? Where is Robert April?

I think if they came up with a new crew and a new ship, that would have been even better. Why fix it if it ain't broke? The old crew did not need to be recast. They were fine just as they were unlike Batman or Bond.

"Yay, I'm not spending money on a movie I don't want to see! Someone tell me how good I am and how rebellious I am!"

Really. It's not a feat. Hell, for your one ticket I'm taking 10 people this week and I'll get to see it 3 more times. So what's your point? The movie is popular and is making serious money. Lots of people like it and are finding great things about it to like. Why should your refusal to see it denote anything other than an unwillingness to open your mind for a brief second and see the possibilities?

Lots of hardcore fans are loving this movie, and it's bringing in lots of new fans. You not seeing it makes no impact, and all it does is let you feel justified about things you don't care to know. Good luck with your 'victory'.

J.

 

[DiSiLLUSiON]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

The old crew did not need to be recast.

Okay... How would you have gone about it then? Since half the TOS crew are, you know, dead... CGI?

 

[RisenStar]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

Moral understories are overrated and not as important to "good Star Trek" as people seem to think, especially in the films -- for example, what was TWoK's moral message? What about FC?

I wouldn't call them "moral stories" per se, but there were important themes to both:
TWoK - Facing Death
First Contact - Vengence (ala Melville).

It's hard to accomplish that kind of story telling when a third of your movie, at least, requires character introduction and establishing relationships. It was a bit light in this one, but I hope for more in future iterations.

I realized something else that potentially affected my perception of this movie: TNG and DS9 ruined me to just enjoying a pretty simple adventure story in the Trek-Verse. In a turn of sweet irony, when my wife and I got home from my second viewing (which I enjoyed much more once I realied the following) there was a rerun of the Doomsday Machine episode from TOS on NBC. It occurred to me that this movie is much much much more like a show from TOS than more modern episodes of Trek which were heavily concerned with parabolic teaching and thematic storytelling.

IMO, It's an artificial limiting factor of your own enjoyment of Trek to require a homily or deeply entrenched moral theme every time it appears - especially in what amounts to an entry-level reintroduction of the entire franchise. A television show, by virtue of the medium, is more able to do that than a movie like this ever could have. However, if the next one doesn't improve in terms of character development and theme, I will probably start to be concerned.

Baby steps.

 

[RAnthony]

Re: Come on people - am I the only fan who can't drink Abrams' Cool Ai

That's silly. Star Trek fans -- whatever is left of them -- aren't numerous enough to make this opening any bigger.

So, let me get this straight, Wolverine's fanbase had nothing to do with it's higher grosses? Then how do you explain it's success?

The returns on sequel films are completely driven by fan loyalty. That's why the Star Wars films rank as high as they do. We'll see what the fans really think when it comes to second week box office returns. Sinks like a stone, watch the budget numbers and the possibility of a second film get smaller and smaller...

-RAnthony