The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

[RobertScorpio]

Re: Robert Scorpio's take

If you're someone who doesn't like this movie then you are so out of touch with reality it wont matter what anyone says..

You expected something else from someone who deems their opinion worthy of its own thread?

Yep...or maybe no...good question!!!

Rob

 

[Valley Forge]

Hi all,

I voted average. It was a reasonably good popcorn flick.

It was NOT the second coming of Star Trek.

First the good:

Casting choices were reasonably good. Most of the performances were very well done.

The special effects, and certain production elements were done VERY well. The Vulcan cities/landscape, Iowa (yes, it really is THAT flat), and the exterior ship design.

Next, the not so good:

The interior sets of the ships looked like those old 80's flicks that were filmed inside an old industrial complex.

All the easter eggs. I mean, really, it was as if someone, who didn't really understand Trek, simply plucked random elements out of the shows/movies and threw them in the movie, without even stopping to consider the context.

Finally, the Horrible.

THE STORY! ACKPTH! ANOTHER TIME TRAVEL STORY...nuff said on that.

Destroyed the continuity. CRA's arguments are well founded, and I agree with most of them.

The battle scenes were absolutely horrible. Abrupt, loud and incoherent. Makes nuBSG's shakeycam battles look like ballet.

Ridiculous plot elements. Kirk's 3rd attempt at the KM test...I mean, you at least have to LOOK like you're trying, even if you're cheating.

The destruction of Vulcan...totally rewrites the history of the Federation. You might not agree, but it was totally unecessiary from a plot perspective.

Cadet to Captain...over officers that were already graduated and serving on the E and other ships. GMAFB. That absurd plot device ruined the movie for me.

The Kirk and Spock's relationship was LONG and COMPLICATED, and we're supposed to belive their best buds overnight, with major elements of that development now eliminated due to the changed time line? Not to mention Spock was re-written as a lustful sociopath.

Sorry, it seemed like a 10 year old fanboy wrote the story. Too many absolutely absurd AND unecessary plot fails. Some adult supervision with the story would have added at least a measure of respectibility

Vf

 

[Magickthise]

Re: Magickthise's One Sentence Review

3) Have we met? I knew TGT when he was still Mr Stinkypants

I don't think we have, no. But what the fuck, TGT was once Mr. Stinkypants? Somehow that fits.

omg, there is a whole story to tell there. has hasn't shared that? I still think of him as Stink omg

There's still a big UGO banner up top...

TGT was The Great Mambo Chicken or something similar too...

I should have said pre-vBulletin, my bad. This forum was very different then. We're talking 8-10 years ago. My bad.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

After the second viewing I'm leaning toward "best Star Trek film, period." There's a lot to like about TWOK but, removing sentimentality from the equation, it's also pretty limited in many respects. "Casablanca" it ain't.

 

[Starbreaker]

Re: Magickthise's One Sentence Review

Ole Big Blue... you can go back to that skin in the control panel... if your eyes can take it.

 

[Amaris]

Hi all,

I voted average. It was a reasonably good popcorn flick.

It was NOT the second coming of Star Trek.

First the good:

Casting choices were reasonably good. Most of the performances were very well done.

The special effects, and certain production elements were done VERY well. The Vulcan cities/landscape, Iowa (yes, it really is THAT flat), and the exterior ship design.

Next, the not so good:

The interior sets of the ships looked like those old 80's flicks that were filmed inside an old industrial complex.

All the easter eggs. I mean, really, it was as if someone, who didn't really understand Trek, simply plucked random elements out of the shows/movies and threw them in the movie, without even stopping to consider the context.

Finally, the Horrible.

THE STORY! ACKPTH! ANOTHER TIME TRAVEL STORY...nuff said on that.

Destroyed the continuity. CRA's arguments are well founded, and I agree with most of them.

The battle scenes were absolutely horrible. Abrupt, loud and incoherent. Makes nuBSG's shakeycam battles look like ballet.

Ridiculous plot elements. Kirk's 3rd attempt at the KM test...I mean, you at least have to LOOK like you're trying, even if you're cheating.

The destruction of Vulcan...totally rewrites the history of the Federation. You might not agree, but it was totally unecessiary from a plot perspective.

Cadet to Captain...over officers that were already graduated and serving on the E and other ships. GMAFB. That absurd plot device ruined the movie for me.

The Kirk and Spock's relationship was LONG and COMPLICATED, and we're supposed to belive their best buds overnight, with major elements of that development now eliminated due to the changed time line? Not to mention Spock was re-written as a lustful sociopath.

Sorry, it seemed like a 10 year old fanboy wrote the story. Too many absolutely absurd AND unecessary plot fails. Some adult supervision with the story would have added at least a measure of respectibility

Vf

You are free to speak your mind, and form your own opinions, but in reference to whether this Trek is not the Second Coming of Trek:
I strongly disagree, and I think the Box Office will too.

J.

 

[M'Sharak]

Re: Magickthise's One Sentence Review

TGT was both Mr. Stinky Pants and The Great Mambo Chicken previously, and off we go to the Grading & Discussion thread. Care for a tiny package of in-flight mixed nuts?

 

[erebus]

What else could they do that would top that in this new universe?

I feel like maybe they've topped themselves here.

They can do (and clearly capable of achieving) anything at all.

Star Trek took its risk, tempted fate again per its charter, and now is free at last of the shackles of self-imposed dogma (which Mr Roddenberry himself warned us against).

And with that freedom there can be new insights into our beloved characters and a brand new universe a brave new imagining to explore which in turn will provide new situations and therefore new insights into old knowledge.

If you think you knew all about these characters, about the star trek universe and its vision - i suspect we haven't seen anything yet!

Its an exciting prospect.

No wonder Mr Nimoy is so proud and moved: in interview he looks as if a great weight of responsiblity has been lifted from him and something he cared for and cared about for so long can carry on with his blessing to gift the future with an enduring legacy of hope that he and his friends created and with which they (and i guess in a way we too) will be forever linked.

 

[Squiggy]

Anyone know the current record for "fasted thread to 1000 posts"?

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Anyone know the current record for "fasted thread to 1000 posts"?

I believe it was the "Who wants me to post a picture of Freema Agyeman's tits?" thread in the Doctor Who forum, but that's another story.

 

[Tim]

Anyone know the current record for "fasted thread to 1000 posts"?

Probably one of the "masturbation" threads in Misc.

 

[M'Sharak]

Re: Robert Scorpio's take

Merging...

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

And...the movie appears to have been pirated already.

 

[igrokbok]

Saw it today. What an experience to behold. Just when you thought STar Trek was dead something like this comes along!

The tomb of talky Tachyon-ified Bermanized Trek has been effectively sealed by this strong, fun, smart reminder of what Star Trek started out as back in 1966. See what happens when writers and directors pay attention to what came before??

Welcome back Star Trek, my old friend, it's damn good to see you again! It's been WAY too long.

 

[Orac Zen]

If you haven't seen it. Here is the one spoiler that will make you hate JJ Abrams.

HE DESTROYED VULCAN.

I thought it was freaking awesome that he had the balls to do it and not reset it like Berman or others would have done...remember, this isn't the TNG universe anymore...Tuvok and Vorik and Selar and all the rest aren't dead...they're just in another part of the multiverse.

Agreed. I was genuinely expecting the Enterprise to be sucked into the anomaly / singularity / whatever you want to call it and everything being undone. The fact it didn't happen is just brilliant. No reset buttons in this parallel universe.

And while I completely understand where people like galleywest are coming from, I don't mourn the fact that future movies won't take place in the Trek universe we've known for the past four decades. That universe is perfectly intact and it won't be going anywhere, but trying to cater to those four decades of stories and continuity led to Insurrection and Nemesis - two of the worst movies imaginable. This parallel universe offers its own future and I for one want to see what that future will be like.

Since it's being brought up, I would like to point out that I whole-heartedly approve of the lack of a reset button. Normal Trek resets/ cop-outs are pretty bad, but to do something this big and make that many changes, I would have been pissed if they had Old Spock fix everything or some cheap crap like that.

Agreed. As I said above I was waiting for the reset, and I'm stoked that there wasn't one.

Starfleet isn't the military. It has a military heirarchy, sure, 'cause it runs smoother that way but these people aren't soldiers. They're scientists and swashbucklers banding together as an "instrument of civilization," as Kirk once said. Where the military breaks its members down to little more than machines following an authoritarian command structure, Starfleet's strength comes from its attempt to cultivate and maximize the strengths of each individual. That's why Starfleet is so much more forgiving of insubordination and familiarity in the ranks. It wasn't until DS9, Voyager and Enterprise that it was reinterpretted to be a military organization.

Kirk proved his talent by saving every single Federation world from Nero when a dozen experienced starship commanders had failed to do it. He was rewarded with a place in Starfleet where he could fully actualize himself, to the benefit of the entire organization. The fact that something like that would never happen in today's military is an indictment of today's military, not of Starfleet.

Terrific post. QFT.

I'm actually suprised that more people don't feel the same way. I guess everyone is so starved they will eat anything.

Don't mean to pick a fight. Just feel that it was not necessary to destroy fourty years of Trek to make a great Trek movie.

But nothing's been "destroyed". This movie is essentially in a parallel universe. The "original" universe is intact and undamaged, and able to be enjoyed on its merits. So is this universe. Frankly, I think it's great that we have both.

Did anyone stay until the very bloody end? I kinda wished they put it earlier, either at the very beginning or at the start of the end credits, but the last slide was "In memory of Gene Roddenberry and Majel Barrett-Roddenberry." I thought that was pretty neat.

I always stay to the very end of a movie and so I saw that. Very classy touch on behalf of Abrams and co., IMO.

 

[DaveG]

Saw it late this afternoon. About 20 people in the theater and there were no lines when we left around 8ish.

While OK the movie didn't feel right. Characters were well cast but the story left me wanting something else. I was reminded of Praetor Shinzon when I saw Cpt. Nero (did he have a fiddle I wonder) and their huge ships looked somewhat similar, designed to destroy entire worlds. Too many fights. Some actions scenes were a blur. Red lava lamp blobs that trigger black holes? Ice planet (Hoth?) - homage to Star Wars and oh, Kirk just so happens to run into Spock senior in the middle of nowhere while being chased by I wanna eat you creatures. Was there another writer's strike I missed? Come on.
And the Enterprise. The bridge looked good, but the rest looked like a dry cleaning factory. Was that a winshield I noticed? Cracked no less while "she's breakin' free" from the lava lamp induced black hole.

I doubt I'll be seeing this flick again. I'm actually sorry to say that. I was really looking forward to the reboot, but instead got something else.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

I was reminded of Praetor Shinzon...

Who?

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

And while I completely understand where people like galleywest are coming from, I don't mourn the fact that future movies won't take place in the Trek universe we've known for the past four decades. That universe is perfectly intact and it won't be going anywhere, but trying to cater to those four decades of stories and continuity led to Insurrection and Nemesis - two of the worst movies imaginable. This parallel universe offers its own future and I for one want to see what that future will be like.

So wonderfully true. We have SIX series in the original Trek universe, 10 films and if you're a treklit reader some truly awesome series going on at the moment. It's all there and all rewatchable.. I am rewatching one or another series all the time and believe me it is quite enjoyable and there is so much of it that sometimes it's like watching a new ep because I've forgotten the gist of it.

I am ready for the new future. I'm very very excited about it. No one has destroyed the old one, my shelves are groaning with dvd sets and novels!

 

[DaveG]

I was reminded of Praetor Shinzon...

Who?

The bad guy from Nemisis.

 

[rramarr]

I never seen such a large group of Star Trek starved fans. It was a saltine and you are calling it a Ritz. It was a great "Trek" film but not a great film. Some thread even mentioned Oscars. What!!!. You know how many great sci-fi films never got a whisper at the oscars. It was so great but yet only about 25 people showed up on opening night in a large metro area theatre I heard it was no different tonight. If you watch the 10 prior films there is no way you can give this film's screenwriting Oscar consideration if those other films didn't get it. There was a good portrayal of characters but my buddy does a good Nimoy impersonation too - should we give him an Oscar. Enjoy it love it as I did but recognize its limits and your predispoistion to loving it before you seen it.