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Phase II - Your Opinions?

How do you think Phase II would have been, had it been made?

  • Good overall

    Votes: 45 71.4%
  • Bad overall

    Votes: 12 19.0%
  • Meh, neither

    Votes: 6 9.5%

  • Total voters
    63
If it needs some foreground miniatures and/or a Bruce Campbell-level performance from somebody on a viewscreen, gimme a holler. I've been rereading a ton of my old script stuff and watching some of the old super 8 and 16mm bits and pieces and itching to do SOMEthing.
Oh. REALLY?! I love FG miniatures. Hmmm...
 
On further review, it looks like a lot of the episodes would have sucked, ala TNG's first season, but the characters seem mostly solid. Spock would've been severely missed, but Xon might well have been an interesting replacement. I always thought Decker and particularly Ilia (the carbon unit one) got short shrift in TMP, so it would've been nice to see more of them.

But get a load of this:

Sulu is very Occidental in speech and manner. In fact, his attitude toward Asians is that they seem to him rather "inscrutable."
Welcome the 23d century. It's apparently all the same crap. Of course, maybe they're "inscrutable" because they're a bunch of atomic mutants. Utter destruction in Asia in WW3 is the only reason I can think of there aren't about 1/3 East Asians and about 1/2 Asians in general making up the Human ranks. And atomic mutants are hard to understand.
 
On further review, it looks like a lot of the episodes would have sucked, ala TNG's first season, but the characters seem mostly solid. Spock would've been severely missed, but Xon might well have been an interesting replacement. I always thought Decker and particularly Ilia (the carbon unit one) got short shrift in TMP, so it would've been nice to see more of them.

But get a load of this:

Sulu is very Occidental in speech and manner. In fact, his attitude toward Asians is that they seem to him rather "inscrutable."
Welcome the 23d century. It's apparently all the same crap. Of course, maybe they're "inscrutable" because they're a bunch of atomic mutants. Utter destruction in Asia in WW3 is the only reason I can think of there aren't about 1/3 East Asians and about 1/2 Asians in general making up the Human ranks. And atomic mutants are hard to understand.

I think you're misunderstanding. The Star Trek Phase II Writers/Directors Guide doesn't say "Asians are 'inscrutable;'" it says that they seem inscrutable to Sulu--which is not Sulu's style. So the Writers/Directors Guide explicitly instructs writers and directors to have George Takei play against the sterotype. (In fact, I remember Captain Kirk saying "Mister Sulu, you're the most 'scrutable' man I know.")
 
I vaguely recall that too. Perhaps I'm making a misreading; I suppose it doesn't hurt anything that Earth hasn't developed the monoculture it appears to possess in the 24th century.:)
 
Regarding Sulu, it says:

SULU-Ship's Helmsman, played by actor George Takei. Mixed Oriental in ancestry, a Lieutenant Commander, Japanese predominating, Sulu is very Occidental in speech and manner. In fact, his attitude towards Asians is that they seem to him rather 'inscrutable.' Sulu fancies himself more of an old-world "D'Artagnan" than anything else. He is a compulsive hobbyist; like all "collectors," he is forever giving his friends a thousand reasons why they, too, should take on the same hobby.

I recall a reference at the end of TAS's 'The Infinite Vulcan' in which Kirk reassured Sulu that he was 'the most scrutable man [he] know' but I don't remember the whole thing.
 
The TOS writer's guide entry of Sulu reprinted in 'TMoST' begins:

"Sulu, despite being of mixed Asian ancestry, is not an inscrutable Oriental."

It also notes he is a rather "hip" character with an excellent sense of humor.
 
Does the TOS writer's guide exist anywhere other than what is printed in 'TMoST'?

Based on a review of it there, excluding the parts that were clearly added for the book, compared to what is printed in the Reeves-Stevens' 'Phase II' book, I'd say there are more than a few differences.
 
The Phase II writer's guide is mostly a cut-n-paste job of the original series writer's guide, with some updates.

I'm sure Jon Povill would thank you for that assessment.

I'm sure he'd confirm my assessment as well. I have both writer's guides, and a lot of the text is identical. I think they even carried over some of the typos from the earlier guide.

I'm wondering if there were two P2 bibles, because the stuff that they had in the TREK THE LOST VOYAGES book as sidebars was all stuff I didn't remember reading in the xerox a friend had (and that xerox really WAS almost like the first bible.) Was there just a whole extra batch of stuff about earth added, while the character stuff remained the same?
 
I'm sure Jon Povill would thank you for that assessment.

I'm sure he'd confirm my assessment as well. I have both writer's guides, and a lot of the text is identical. I think they even carried over some of the typos from the earlier guide.

I'm wondering if there were two P2 bibles, because the stuff that they had in the TREK THE LOST VOYAGES book as sidebars was all stuff I didn't remember reading in the xerox a friend had (and that xerox really WAS almost like the first bible.) Was there just a whole extra batch of stuff about earth added, while the character stuff remained the same?

Didn't Povill write additional memos/materials that fleshed out more of the 23rd century, particularly Earth and humanity?

TGT once posted such a memo/material.
 
From my vaguest recollection (sad since I only re-read it a few months ago) I believe Povill did. I remember reading some memos where Povill was asking questions and fleshing stuff out. I need to pull that book out and skim.

Also, I may be an idiot, but where is the TOS bible on Roddenberry.com? Do you have to buy it?
 
Also, I may be an idiot, but where is the TOS bible on Roddenberry.com? Do you have to buy it?

Yeah, you have to buy it. I just went on their site, looks like it ain't there anymore. But you used to be able to buy that and the Phase II bible, etc. Maybe their doing something different now that their are cafepress editions of the scripts.
 
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