World Premiere/Advance screening discussions [SPOILERS GUARANTEED]

[Cky]

It's weird how I'm seeing so many sterotypes in here. Bitching about how different this is and the fact that Trek is officially for the "new generation".

All of the people that think this are wrong, from a certain point of view. Now, the main people saying this are people from the TOS run, and see it now as something it's different, and "not Trek". But lets face it, if Trek was like the way it was in the 60's nobody would be interested in seeing it. For you to say that this isn't Trek annoys me so much I can't put it in to words.

I'm a TNG guy, I grew up watching TNG. Where does that put me? Am I a "New Generation" fan? I loved TOS and watch it whenever I can, but I'm still going to watch this because I think it looks amazing.

So come out of your little secluded bubble, give the film a chance, and if you don't like it, so be it. Stop bitching.

 

[Supervisor 194]

I'm old enough to remember when TOS was the only series, before there was even such a thing as Star Wars to put it in context, and I think this movie was made for me.

It's the first movie to actually try to adapt the original series for the big screen and it seems to have succeeded admirably. I couldn't care less about Star Trek: The Franchise but I dearly love Star Trek: The Original Series and I'm glad to see that TPTB are trying to breathe new life into it. I'm much, much more surprised (and glad) to see how little they changed as opposed to how much. Cosmetic changes don't bother me, and I'm glad to see the core of TOS has been honored pretty well.

 

[Hartzilla2007]

Ha s anyone here actually read the Destiny Trilogy by David Mack which is set in the Prime Trek universe becuase it kind craps on your arugments.

Maybe you would like to elaborate further?

Well

Spoiler: Spoilers for Destiny

A massive Borg invasion occures resulting in the destruction of Deneva and Risa just to name a few of the planets destroyed and massive damage is done to Vulcan, Andor, Qo'nos and several other planets. and once again this event takes place in the prime timeline

 

[Augustus]

I like what was said before. How do we know that the surviving vulcans, which could perhaps number in the millions or billions, depending on how many got off in time...could set up shop on a different world and be alright in the organizational sense within the Federation. Sure it would be a huge blow, but not the end of the universe.

Besides, this is a cool idea. How many villians have tried to go back in time in Trek and change things only to get this close but in the end fail and everything is reset.

Nero is different. He travels back accidently and immediately destroys the Kelvin, and then goes to work on other worlds and ships. So he partially succeeds. He is able to change the timeline to some degree. If time travel were possible, someone would eventually change the timeline. I don't know why this is so horrible to accept.

I still wouldn't agree with, but could understand some fan's sentiments if they changed everything without even trying to give an explanation.
This movie looks like it is going to be fun!!!

 

[Jefferies]

Ha s anyone here actually read the Destiny Trilogy by David Mack which is set in the Prime Trek universe becuase it kind craps on your arugments.

Maybe you would like to elaborate further?

Well

Spoiler: Spoilers for Destiny

A massive Borg invasion occures resulting in the destruction of Deneva and Risa just to name a few of the planets destroyed and massive damage is done to Vulcan, Andor, Qo'nos and several other planets. and once again this event takes place in the prime timeline

To that I would argue its only a novel not a major movie, and,

Spoiler: test

second, neither Deneva, which I have to confess does not ring a bell with me nor Risa are as important as Vulcan and that all the major plantes as you say are not destroyed. Also the story manages without timetravel shenanigans giving it a little bit more credibility on paper. But I must agree the plot does seem unusually grimm, more so than what was ever shown on screen.

 

[crucifixion]

God what the hell....the first 5 pages of this thread were great, spoilers galore!!!
Someone explain to me how the next 7 pages were all about super-hardcore-fans-that-wont-give-any-leeway-to-change vs. normal people.

 

[Hartzilla2007]

Maybe you would like to elaborate further?

Well

Spoiler: Spoilers for Destiny

A massive Borg invasion occures resulting in the destruction of Deneva and Risa just to name a few of the planets destroyed and massive damage is donds of years in the paste to Vulcan, Andor, Qo'nos and several other planets. and once again this event takes place in the prime timeline

To that I would its only a novel not a major movie and,

Yeah um about the time travel

Spoiler: Destiny spoilers

The Borg are aparently created by a groupof humans fromthe 22nd century and members of an advanced race getting traped thousands of years in the past, also Spock's hometown is completely vaporized.

 

[Jefferies]

God what the hell....the first 5 pages of this thread were great, spoilers galore!!!
Someone explain to me how the next 7 pages were all about super-hardcore-fans-that-wont-give-any-leeway-to-change vs. normal people.

Well, this is a Star Trek board and we were specifically instructed not to spill any of the spoilers about the movie into other threads so we have to discuss it here. Maybe you should try a forum that is not geared to the Star Trek fan base?

 

[Neftoon]

Okay just have to jump in with my 2 cents, I went to the premiere last night in Sydney, took my dad who is 65 years old and watched TOS in it's first screenings in Australia. I would reaaally recommend people fight the urge to read spoilers, but pretty much everyone here has. These events should be seen in context within in the film, they work, all of the actors do a fine job of bringing back the characters I love from the original series, This film is about Kirk & Spock it is not about mindless action, it has emotional impact, simply this film works and it does it without dishonouring what came before. So hate it all you want without actually having seen the film but I strongly recommend you see it at least once, with an open mind.

 

[Uncle Tobias]

After reading the spoilers about Romulus, I'm a bit confused as to what universe Star Trek: Online will take place in. They have the same uniforms as "Countdown" and thier site had alot of material such as describing Data being ressurected, which fit with the comic. But thier site also mentions the Romulan Empire as if it survives?

 

[indranee]

Okay just have to jump in with my 2 cents, I went to the premiere last night in Sydney, took my dad who is 65 years old and watched TOS in it's first screenings in Australia. I would reaaally recommend people fight the urge to read spoilers, but pretty much everyone here has. These events should be seen in context within in the film, they work, all of the actors do a fine job of bringing back the characters I love from the original series, This film is about Kirk & Spock it is not about mindless action, it has emotional impact, simply this film works and it does it without dishonouring what came before. So hate it all you want without actually having seen the film but I strongly recommend you see it at least once, with an open mind.

Thank you for posting, Neftoon. Did your dad like it? I am taking my dad to see it in May. he's also a TOS-er... he's excited and a bit apprehensive at the same time.

 

[Captain_Amasov]

After reading the spoilers about Romulus, I'm a bit confused as to what universe Star Trek: Online will take place in. They have the same uniforms as "Countdown" and thier site had alot of material such as describing Data being ressurected, which fit with the comic. But thier site also mentions the Romulan Empire as if it survives?

The current timeline "Path to 2409" updates they've done hasn't yet reached the point where Romulus has been destroyed, it is interesting to note that Remus has been evacuated due to over mining and the Remans themselves have re-located to a new world. Also even though Romulus itself may get destroyed doesn't mean that the empire itself will just vanish.

 

[Franklin]

I like what was said before. How do we know that the surviving vulcans, which could perhaps number in the millions or billions, depending on how many got off in time...could set up shop on a different world and be alright in the organizational sense within the Federation. Sure it would be a huge blow, but not the end of the universe.

Besides, this is a cool idea. How many villians have tried to go back in time in Trek and change things only to get this close but in the end fail and everything is reset.

Nero is different. He travels back accidently and immediately destroys the Kelvin, and then goes to work on other worlds and ships. So he partially succeeds. He is able to change the timeline to some degree. If time travel were possible, someone would eventually change the timeline. I don't know why this is so horrible to accept.

I still wouldn't agree with, but could understand some fan's sentiments if they changed everything without even trying to give an explanation.
This movie looks like it is going to be fun!!!

It isn't that he changed things. Nero destroys 47 Klingon ships (and alters God knows how many futures) as well as changing the one life of James T. Kirk. That's quite a bit, right there.

But destroying Vulcan as part of the story? Why? To what end? First, it means Nero succeeded. He wins. You take Romulus, I take Vulcan. Second, Kirk's first mission as a leader is a failure. He couldn't stop several billion people from being killed. (Sorry, I can't buy the idea that the planet could be evacuated of too many people on such short notice, only a few hundred or thousand at most may make it.) Third, wouldn't such a loss drive Spock insane? People who lose one loved one, or lose house to a tornado or fire can be changed forever, and usually not for the good. Spock shrugs this off? The loss of HIS ENTIRE HOMEWORLD? Or, has the character been rewritten?

What if Picard and Kirk had stopped Soran, but not before he had destroyed a planet of two billion people? What if V-Ger had been stopped after it destroyed Earth? What would that have said about our heroes? Is it because Kirk at least saves Earth that all is OK?

Further, how should Kirk feel about his first mission? Mixed results at best. Looking back on it, what would he think about it? No guilt every time he looks at Spock? No sense of great loss? No playing back in his mind over and over again what could've been done to save an ENTIRE PLANET OF PEOPLE?

I don't care if it's a reboot. Never really have. And, I want to enjoy the movie. But Nero destroying Vulcan makes it FAIL for our heroes, to me, anyway. They figured out the incredible V-Ger and saved Earth. They figured out the mysterious probe in TVH and saved Earth. But they couldn't stop a 24th century miner before he committed the most heinous act in the galaxy.

Thanks for the rant.

 

[Brent]

Maybe we should just wait until we see the movie to see how it all works out in context eh

 

[darkwing_duck1]

is this still star trek, or do we really have to forget "all we knew" just like the tagline told us to?

Presumedly, we still have the novels.

where is the connection to the star trek universe we cared about for decades (except for spock prime...)?

the future/past that will never happen, and will likely never again be visited on screen

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Okay, so we now know Vulcan's fate. What about Earth? We see Nero's spacedrill firing at San Francisco as well. Is SF destroyed? What about Earth in general?

And about Kirk being "on suspension" from Starfleet. I get that too. But did they say what rank he held before that? He wasn't a cadet, was he? (you know about all the 'cadet to captain' rumors, eh?) I'm guessing he was suspended because of his Kobayashi Maru cheating. But that's a cadet test...

where is the connection to the star trek universe we cared about for decades (except for spock prime...)?

the future/past that will never happen, and will likely never again be visited on screen

I don't know how this is possible this time around (since in all previous instances of time travel, it overwrites the old timeline) but the 'prime' Trek timeline hasn't been overwritten. It will still happen as well. Agreed, though, we probably won't ever see it onSCREEN, only in the novels.

 

[Captain_Amasov]

I like what was said before. How do we know that the surviving vulcans, which could perhaps number in the millions or billions, depending on how many got off in time...could set up shop on a different world and be alright in the organizational sense within the Federation. Sure it would be a huge blow, but not the end of the universe.

Besides, this is a cool idea. How many villians have tried to go back in time in Trek and change things only to get this close but in the end fail and everything is reset.

Nero is different. He travels back accidently and immediately destroys the Kelvin, and then goes to work on other worlds and ships. So he partially succeeds. He is able to change the timeline to some degree. If time travel were possible, someone would eventually change the timeline. I don't know why this is so horrible to accept.

I still wouldn't agree with, but could understand some fan's sentiments if they changed everything without even trying to give an explanation.
This movie looks like it is going to be fun!!!

It isn't that he changed things. Nero destroys 47 Klingon ships (and alters God knows how many futures) as well as changing the one life of James T. Kirk. That's quite a bit, right there.

But destroying Vulcan as part of the story? Why? To what end? First, it means Nero succeeded. He wins. You take Romulus, I take Vulcan. Second, Kirk's first mission as a leader is a failure. He couldn't stop several billion people from being killed. (Sorry, I can't buy the idea that the planet could be evacuated of too many people on such short notice, only a few hundred or thousand at most may make it.) Third, wouldn't such a loss drive Spock insane? People who lose one loved one, or lose house to a tornado or fire can be changed forever, and usually not for the good. Spock shrugs this off? The loss of HIS ENTIRE HOMEWORLD? Or, has the character been rewritten?

What if Picard and Kirk had stopped Soran, but not before he had destroyed a planet of two billion people? What if V-Ger had been stopped after it destroyed Earth? What would that have said about our heroes? Is it because Kirk at least saves Earth that all is OK?

Further, how should Kirk feel about his first mission? Mixed results at best. Looking back on it, what would he think about it? No guilt every time he looks at Spock? No sense of great loss? No playing back in his mind over and over again what could've been done to save an ENTIRE PLANET OF PEOPLE?

I don't care if it's a reboot. Never really have. And, I want to enjoy the movie. But Nero destroying Vulcan makes it FAIL for our heroes, to me, anyway. They figured out the incredible V-Ger and saved Earth. They figured out the mysterious probe in TVH and saved Earth. But they couldn't stop a 24th century miner before he committed the most heinous act in the galaxy.

Thanks for the rant.

But as you pointed out, the old Kirk and crew stopped those events from happening, not the already substantially altered people you'll see here. As Nero states in one of the trailers: "James T Kirk was a great man, but that was another life." The original Kirk in those situations already had great experience with both his crew, ship and the dangers and threats out there in space as well.

 

[Cheebo]

In life sometimes the bad guy wins the battle.

 

[Brent]

Anyone else happy about seeing the kobayashi maru thing with Kirk? I am very glad and happy they are showing this!

 

[Franklin]

Maybe we should just wait until we see the movie to see how it all works out in context eh

Eh. We know Vulcan is destroyed by Nero. Of all his targets, that was probably his sweetest. Maybe there was nothing that could be done to stop him. Total surprise. Dumb luck. Maybe lessons learned from trying to stop him there saved Earth. True, we don't know. Still, it's a hell of a thing to have happen. Compared to V-Ger or the probe, it's a helluva thing our heroes couldn't stop. Makes them a little less heroic. Probably billions of people dying all at once. A planet erased. Given what happened to Spock when the Intrepid was destroyed, I wonder if he'll feel the death of those billions.