Earth Politics

[USS Triumphant]

It's possible, but Jaresh-Inyo is referred to as having been "legitimately elected" in "Paradise Lost." And in "Homefront," his exact words are, "I never sought this job. I was content to simply represent my people on the Federation Council. When they asked me to submit my name for election, I almost said no. Today I wish I had."

So he was probably elected.

Either he was forced to run by popular demand in a regular election, or he still ascended to the Presidency in a Gerald Ford-esque fashion, but never intended to run for formal election until his arm was twisted to keep the post. I'll agree it sounds more like the former, though.

The Federation is a militaristic regime controlled by the Starfleet Junta, more similar to the Klingons than they will like to admit. <snip> I could go on and on here but the point is that the UFP is a sham and is no better than the Klingons and the Romulans, but with good PR and spin-doctors.

Hey, buddy! You're either with us, or against us. Love the Federation, or move somewhere else!

Seriously, though, I'd say you're rant was mostly wrong during the TOS, grew to be increasingly correct through the end of DS9, and would pretty much hit the nail on the head sometime shortly after that, unless there's a major correction. I've worked on fan fiction set in the 26th century that follows the premise that there hasn't been such a correction, and things have gotten really bad, with "the priorities of the fleet" being generally accepted as taking precedence over almost everything else. Not a "Fall of the Federation" scenario, but one where you almost wish it would, at times.

 

[uniderth]

I imagine the the United Earth would be a federal government with most of the governmental power in the local levels. The politcal system would probably be some form of Constitutional Republic. I also think that they would have done away with the politcial class. Meaning that every person can only serve one term in each level of government. After that you are done.

I also don't think nations as we know them now would exist anymore. I think they would be replaced by a level of government I call Unions. Unions would be like what states are to modern nations. A subdivision of the larger government but not sovreign.

 

[Timo]

Meaning that every person can only serve one term in each level of government. After that you are done.

That didn't hold true for President Jaresh-Inyo who, as said, was content with remaining a representative of his people until lured into heading the whole damn show. At least two political offices there. Although admittedly we don't get too many references to people who would be considered "career politicians".

Timo Saloniemi

 

[uniderth]

But Jaresh-Inyo was not President of the United Earth. We are talking about United Earth political structure here not Federation.

 

[Timo]

So a politician could have a federal career but not a "state"/planetary one? Quaint, but workable, I guess.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Myasishchev]

Has the constitution of the Federation Council ever been explored in depth, perhaps in the Decandidonomicon? Maybe just because I'm an American, I've always theorized a bicameral setup; although this has never been spelled out, it would make sense. The Council would therefore be divided into:

An upper house (which we've seen) with two members per world, which likely has its members appointed by the local government (T'Pau refused a seat, according to Amok Time, which is nonsensical, if she was running for election to it);

and a lower house (which we have not seen) elected based on districts of equal population.

 

[Sci]

Has the constitution of the Federation Council ever been explored in depth, perhaps in the Decandidonomicon? Maybe just because I'm an American, I've always theorized a bicameral setup; although this has never been spelled out, it would make sense. The Council would therefore be divided into:

An upper house (which we've seen) with two members per world, which likely has its members appointed by the local government (T'Pau refused a seat, according to Amok Time, which is nonsensical, if she was running for election to it);

and a lower house (which we have not seen) elected based on districts of equal population.

Several of the novels that are set in the common continuity, including A Time to Heal by David Mack, Andor: Paradigm by Heather Jarman, Bajor: Fragments and Omens by J. Noah Kym, and Articles of the Federation have established different ways for Federation Councillors to be elected. The implication, therefore, is that each Federation Member State determines for itself how its Federation Councillor will be chosen.

Heal, for instance, establishes that the Federation Councillor from Betazed is popularly elected, while Paradigm establishes that the Federation Councillor from the Andorian Empire is determined by which Andorian political party holds a majority in the Parliament Andoria (implying that the Federation Councillor holds a position of equal rank to that of a minister in a parliamentary democracy). Fragments features the First Minister of the Republic of Bajor nominating their Federation Councillor with confirmation by the Chamber of Ministers -- except when the Chamber is out of session, at which point the First Minister can make a recess appointment.

Nothing has ever been established in the novels about the length of a Federation Councillor's term, though we can probably infer from the fact that Vulcan Federation Councillor T'Latrek has been serving for around eighty years as of 2380 that Federation Councillors do not have term limits. Articles rather firmly establishes that the Federation Council is a unicameral body, with one Federation Councillor for each Member State.

For more information on what the current continuity of the novels has established, the Federation Council article on Memory Beta is pretty good.

 

[uniderth]

So a politician could have a federal career but not a "state"/planetary one? Quaint, but workable, I guess.

Timo Saloniemi

No a person could serve once on the local level, then only once on the State level, then once on the Union level, then once on the Planetary level. It doesn't matter what job you do on each level you only get one time in each.

 

[Sci]

So a politician could have a federal career but not a "state"/planetary one? Quaint, but workable, I guess.

Timo Saloniemi

No a person could serve once on the local level, then only once on the State level, then once on the Union level, then once on the Planetary level. It doesn't matter what job you do on each level you only get one time in each.

Here in Ohio, we've had term limits for a number of years for the Ohio General Assembly. And let me tell you something -- term limits for a legislature are not all they're cracked up to be.

Term limits in the Ohio General Assembly have damaged institutional memory, making it difficult for Assembly members to develop the kinds of expertise needed to serve as effective committee members. The Assembly members are all very aware of their limited time in office, so all of them are constantly vying to set themselves up for their next job, since they're all out to preserve their careers. The effect of this is the creation of an amateur legislature where large numbers of legislators do not finish their full terms of office and which relies heavily upon the advice of aides, unelected General Assembly support organizations, and lobbyists and special interest groups. It has created a legislature full of people who don't know enough and has actually decreased the democratic accountability of the legislature by strongly empowering lobbyists.

I firmly disagree with your term limits concept for differing levels of governance.

 

[uniderth]

So a politician could have a federal career but not a "state"/planetary one? Quaint, but workable, I guess.

Timo Saloniemi

No a person could serve once on the local level, then only once on the State level, then once on the Union level, then once on the Planetary level. It doesn't matter what job you do on each level you only get one time in each.

Here in Ohio, we've had term limits for a number of years for the Ohio General Assembly. And let me tell you something -- term limits for a legislature are not all they're cracked up to be.

Term limits in the Ohio General Assembly have damaged institutional memory, making it difficult for Assembly members to develop the kinds of expertise needed to serve as effective committee members. The Assembly members are all very aware of their limited time in office, so all of them are constantly vying to set themselves up for their next job, since they're all out to preserve their careers. The effect of this is the creation of an amateur legislature where large numbers of legislators do not finish their full terms of office and which relies heavily upon the advice of aides, unelected General Assembly support organizations, and lobbyists and special interest groups. It has created a legislature full of people who don't know enough and has actually decreased the democratic accountability of the legislature by strongly empowering lobbyists.

I firmly disagree with your term limits concept for differing levels of governance.

So how then do you solve the problem of career politicians?

I'm not saying just doing that alone would fix things there would need to be many other changes that would allow the system to work.

I would also imagine in teh Trek future Earth would have deveolped a system probably of volunteer legilature meaning it's not a job. You don't get paid, well I guess eventually on Trek Earth nobody gets paid. Anyway. Laws would only be created when they are needed. Nobody would sit around all day making new laws.

 

[Timo]

Why would career politicians be a problem?

Salaries of career politicians may be a problem, if they can dictate their own salaries. It's the same thing with CEOs and the like. But that's a singular problem that no doubt has found a futuristic solution in the futuristic economy of Star Trek anyway.

Apart from that, surely an experienced and professional politician is more desirable than an amateurish one?

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Sci]

No a person could serve once on the local level, then only once on the State level, then once on the Union level, then once on the Planetary level. It doesn't matter what job you do on each level you only get one time in each.

Here in Ohio, we've had term limits for a number of years for the Ohio General Assembly. And let me tell you something -- term limits for a legislature are not all they're cracked up to be.

Term limits in the Ohio General Assembly have damaged institutional memory, making it difficult for Assembly members to develop the kinds of expertise needed to serve as effective committee members. The Assembly members are all very aware of their limited time in office, so all of them are constantly vying to set themselves up for their next job, since they're all out to preserve their careers. The effect of this is the creation of an amateur legislature where large numbers of legislators do not finish their full terms of office and which relies heavily upon the advice of aides, unelected General Assembly support organizations, and lobbyists and special interest groups. It has created a legislature full of people who don't know enough and has actually decreased the democratic accountability of the legislature by strongly empowering lobbyists.

I firmly disagree with your term limits concept for differing levels of governance.

So how then do you solve the problem of career politicians?

I don't accept your premise that a career politician is a bad thing. Asking how you solve the "problem" of career politicians is like asking how you would solve the problem of career neurosurgeons. Public service is like any other profession -- it's a complex profession usually requiring years of experience to develop the sots of skills one wants to see in a leader.

I would also imagine in teh Trek future Earth would have deveolped a system probably of volunteer legilature meaning it's not a job. You don't get paid, well I guess eventually on Trek Earth nobody gets paid. Anyway. Laws would only be created when they are needed. Nobody would sit around all day making new laws.

Again, let me put it this way: If you have an amateur legislature, such as what you're describing, then you'll end up with amateur laws. What do I mean? I mean that you'll either end up with poorly thought-out, poorly-written laws that will turn out to be more of a hardship for the polity they apply to, or, you'll have laws that are more the products of the wills of special interest groups seeking to influence inexperienced and unprofessional legislators than are the products of the democratic will of the people or of the people's elected representatives.

You seem to be operating on the presumption that "government = bad." That's an irrational presumption. Government is neither good nor bad by itself -- it is what it does with itself that determines whether or not it is good or bad.

An amateur legislature is one that will never develop the skills necessary to actually know what it's doing. A government such as what you describe will invariably be far more incompetent and therefore far more harmful, than a government comprised of people who have made public service their chosen profession.

As John Adams said, public business will always be conducted. The only question is what kind of person you attract -- a skilled, experienced, competent public servant, or something else.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Has the constitution of the Federation Council ever been explored in depth, perhaps in the Decandidonomicon?

Articles of the Federation does quite well in that regard. It doesn't actually write out the Constitution or anything like that, but it goes into Federation politics fairly deep. In fact I think it's safe to say that most of what we know about these matters comes from novels like this very one (we're certainly never going to learn about such things from onscreen material, so this is all we will ever have, to go on).

"Decandidonomicon"...