The disappeared Dominion fleet

[broberfett]

I hated that. It was lame. Deus ex Machina supreme. So I think they should have at least done something with them. So I was thinking it would have been cool if they had reappeared in the Voyager quadrant. We could have had some decent bad guys and it would have revealed where they went.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Here's what I hope happened to all those ships:

Spoiler: unfortunately we'll never know

transported to the Mirror Universe where the Terran Rebellion could get ahold of them.

 

[Smiley]

We do find out a little more about those ships in one of the books:

Spoiler: Book Title

DS9: Unity

As for the ending of "Sacrifice of Angels," it may fit the literal definition of deus ex machina, but the Prophets are in the very first show. They aren't exactly coming out of nowhere. I do wonder what might have happened if Sisko had talked to the Prophets before "In Purgatory's Shadow" about the issue. The war might have gone a little better for the Alpha Quadrant powers.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

We do find out a little more about those ships in one of the books:

Actually, we don't find out what happened to the actual *ships*...only their crews.

 

[Hofner]

They were transported to the Star Wars universe where they proceeded to kick the Empire's ass. Star Trek franchise wins!

Robert

 

[Sisko4Life]

I didn't mind the ending of SOA actually. It basically showed how Sisko saved the Alpha Quadrant. But in all honesty, the Prophets and Sisko are credited 100% for effectively "ending" the war right there. The Dominion didn't do shit afterwards. The tension, desperation, and prospect of Cardassian and Dominion ships overruning the Alpha Quadrant is what makes the end of Season 5 and beginning of Season 6 so great in my opinion. After that the war was kind of... meh.

 

[Navaros]

This is definitely one of the very worst series fubars. It makes me so mad that I wish at the end of WYLB they just rematerialized, came right on through the wormhole and then blew up the DS9 station before anyone had a chance to evacuate. That would have been a suitable penance.

 

[Turbo]

See, I think it made perfect sense.

Sisko was the Prophets' chosen Emissary. He was the one that they themselves had created (though Sarah Sisko). Only Sisko could have convinced the Prophets to do this, and as he pointed out, it's not even close to the first time they've been involved in "linear" affairs.

And with the Prophets' nonlinear nature, it's highly possible that it was Sisko himself who ultimately stopped the fleet. In fact, when I saw this episode again after WYLB, that's what I thought - Sisko the mortal appealed to the Prophets, but Sisko the Prophet was the one who did the deed.

 

[DS9forever]

It never bothered me. I thought it was pretty clever really. Ira Behr said the following in the Companion:

"I felt it was the perfect next step in the evolution of the relationship between Sisko and the Prophets that began in the pilot. Hearing people refer to it as some dopey deus ex machina is really annoying because I would think they'd give us more credit for being on the ball. We didn't have to end it like that, we chose to end it like that. Because we wanted to say that there was something going on here. And ultimately, that would lead to our finding out that Sisko is part-Prophet. They wouldn't have done this for just anyone. This was the man going out into the wilderness and demanding God to interfere, to do something for crying out loud. The corporeal characters had done so much in the episode; surely they'd earned the help of the gods."

 

[Apogeal Alpha01]

It was interesting that Sisko was able to goad these, normally, extremely passive aliens into acting. I wondered for 6 years how they could be "of Bajor," and allow their followers to be decimated over the last half century or so.

The look on Dukat's face was priceless.

 

[cultcross]

It never bothered me. I thought it was pretty clever really. Ira Behr said the following in the Companion:

"I felt it was the perfect next step in the evolution of the relationship between Sisko and the Prophets that began in the pilot. Hearing people refer to it as some dopey deus ex machina is really annoying because I would think they'd give us more credit for being on the ball. We didn't have to end it like that, we chose to end it like that. Because we wanted to say that there was something going on here. And ultimately, that would lead to our finding out that Sisko is part-Prophet. They wouldn't have done this for just anyone. This was the man going out into the wilderness and demanding God to interfere, to do something for crying out loud. The corporeal characters had done so much in the episode; surely they'd earned the help of the gods."

I happen to agree with him. The DS9 writers have never been one for the easy deus ex machina - they'll go for the big flourish and sort out the consequences later. That they used a literal act of God(s) here was clearly a deliberate choice, to say something about Sisko's growing relationship with the Prophets and his growing 'faith' in them which is a storyline that has been growing since Accession and Rapture and continues into The Reckoning, Tears of the Prophets, Shadows & Symbols, and Til Death Do Us Part before finally becoming a true partnership in WYLB. A literal act of a deity it may be but it's certianly no idle writer's crutch which sprang out of nowhere.

 

[Damask]

A literal act of a deity it may be but it's certianly no idle writer's crutch which sprang out of nowhere.

Indeed. When you consider that it DS9's first episode it Sisko who persuades the Prophets to keep the wormhole open when they want to close it, I don't see a problem with him wanting to "close" the wormhole.

 

[All Seeing Eye]

Everyone remember the episode with the solar sail ship that the prophets sent into the future?

Well i've always liked the idea that the prophets didn't wipe out the Dominion fleet but instead just gave the Alpha Quadrant more time to defeat the Dominion. I like to think that all they did was bring the fleet forward through time like they did with the solar sail ship and that sometime in the future, maybe a hundred years later those Dominion ships exit the wormhole.
The Dominion war has been over for 100 years but this fleet of Dominion ships arn't aware they've been transported into the future and exit the wormhole still thinking they're at war and they attack the Federation.

 

[NKemp3]

I hated that. It was lame. Deus ex Machina supreme. So I think they should have at least done something with them. So I was thinking it would have been cool if they had reappeared in the Voyager quadrant. We could have had some decent bad guys and it would have revealed where they went.

Don't think it was lame they disappeared but I do think it would make an interesting story down the line about what happened to them. Having them on VOY would have been a waste and the VOY folks didn't care about DS9 anyway (too busy dropping TNG references). But maybe in the future if another Trek show makes it to TV TPTB can use that lost fleet to tell a fascinating tale. Of course since the higherups ignore almost all DS9 references that's doubtful.

 

[Brutal Strudel]

It never bothered me. I thought it was pretty clever really. Ira Behr said the following in the Companion:

"I felt it was the perfect next step in the evolution of the relationship between Sisko and the Prophets that began in the pilot. Hearing people refer to it as some dopey deus ex machina is really annoying because I would think they'd give us more credit for being on the ball. We didn't have to end it like that, we chose to end it like that. Because we wanted to say that there was something going on here. And ultimately, that would lead to our finding out that Sisko is part-Prophet. They wouldn't have done this for just anyone. This was the man going out into the wilderness and demanding God to interfere, to do something for crying out loud. The corporeal characters had done so much in the episode; surely they'd earned the help of the gods."

I agree. When you add godlike characters to the mix, you demand godlike actions and this one worked--sweaty palms and white knuckles and all. What did not work was the way WYLB handled the end of the war of the gods and its a shame, since it could have easily piggybacked on this moment. What if Dukat had access to those ships? As he and Sisko duke it out (perhaps across realities, one of which including Benny Russell's), we are aware that, if Sisko loses, the Dominion floods the Alpha Quadrant and everything goes to hell. That way we get one huge battle that ends both conflicts rather than a really cool end of he Dominion War followed by a really lame end of the Prophet's War and even lamer use of flashbacks.

 

[NKemp3]

Forgot to mention that the Prophets were about as important to the DS9 series as the Vorlons were to B5. The Prophets were there from the very beginning and I had no problem with their intereference because of the relationship with Sisko. Also it was the only way for the AQ to defeat the Dominion. The Dominion wins that war if the the fleet gets through or even if the wormhole had just remained opened. Which proves how badass the Dominion was. Last of all the wormhole is where the Prophets are truly powerful. If the fleet had not been inside the wormhole then they could not have done anything to those ships. The Prophets essentially just took away the Dominion's right to fly through their territory. Worked for me.

 

[RobertScorpio]

We do find out a little more about those ships in one of the books:

Spoiler: Book Title

DS9: Unity

As for the ending of "Sacrifice of Angels," it may fit the literal definition of deus ex machina, but the Prophets are in the very first show. They aren't exactly coming out of nowhere. I do wonder what might have happened if Sisko had talked to the Prophets before "In Purgatory's Shadow" about the issue. The war might have gone a little better for the Alpha Quadrant powers.

Yep...far from the Deus Ex machina that has been assigned to that scene over the years. Some people are selective in their memory..

Rob
Scorpio

 

[Brutal Strudel]

One more thing I'd like to add about having Sisko and Dukat face off across the realities: it would have given DS9 a chance to have Louise Fletcher play an evil psychiatric prodfessor again--she could be assigned to Benny Russell. How cool would that have been? Insread, all we got was a couple of weak nods to "Where No Man..." from TOS.

 

[All Seeing Eye]

I guess my idea sucks then.

 

[jealousblues]

It never bothered me. I thought it was pretty clever really. Ira Behr said the following in the Companion:

"I felt it was the perfect next step in the evolution of the relationship between Sisko and the Prophets that began in the pilot. Hearing people refer to it as some dopey deus ex machina is really annoying because I would think they'd give us more credit for being on the ball. We didn't have to end it like that, we chose to end it like that. Because we wanted to say that there was something going on here. And ultimately, that would lead to our finding out that Sisko is part-Prophet. They wouldn't have done this for just anyone. This was the man going out into the wilderness and demanding God to interfere, to do something for crying out loud. The corporeal characters had done so much in the episode; surely they'd earned the help of the gods."

I agree. When you add godlike characters to the mix, you demand godlike actions and this one worked--sweaty palms and white knuckles and all. What did not work was the way WYLB handled the end of the war of the gods and its a shame, since it could have easily piggybacked on this moment. What if Dukat had access to those ships? As he and Sisko duke it out (perhaps across realities, one of which including Benny Russell's), we are aware that, if Sisko loses, the Dominion floods the Alpha Quadrant and everything goes to hell. That way we get one huge battle that ends both conflicts rather than a really cool end of he Dominion War followed by a really lame end of the Prophet's War and even lamer use of flashbacks.

i liked the last episode...

but I do like your idea better.
I also think the idea of him and Dukat fighting and bouncing b/t realities is a really cool one (even one where the Dukat the cop is beating him and he is fighting back in Bennys time).