Kes, Possibly the Worst Lead Character of the Berman Era? Maybe Kim? Mayweather? Troi? Other?

[Ghouleddie74]

I guess technically it was *in* 1990 rather than *before* 1990, but "Remember Me" is a favorite Beverly episode of mine as well. I thought McFadden did really well with that one.

And a Season 4, so after the writers started giving her much better and more consistently good script material! Just about everyone shone in Season 4. I think every lead character on the show comes off better in 1990-91 than they did the previous year, and Wesley even leaves the series partway through Season 4, so Wil Wheaton got to give a few of his better Wesley performances during the year.

 

[Ragitsu]

I will take the space pixie any day of the week over the bubbleheads and pufftas of newer Trek; when Lien was good, she made the show memorable.

 

[Ovation]

I will take the space pixie any day of the week over the bubbleheads and pufftas of newer Trek

Well this is certainly…a collection of words…mostly.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Kim. The answer is always Harry Kim. Clarinet? C'mon. Just go ahead and tell me he's a virgin. Kes? They were striving for something different but failed in the most bland and unimaginative manner possible.

In Non Sequitur (S02e05) regular Kim is switched out with a mirror universe Kim, who had just finished sex with Libby. So regular virgin Kim may not have had full intercourse per se, but he was probably awkwardly splashing about in the wet spot reticently like a world class sex expert.

 

[Fire(BOO!)]

I will take the space pixie any day of the week over the bubbleheads and pufftas of newer Trek; when Lien was good, she made the show memorable.

Well, newer Trek wasn’t the point of the topic, was it?

“Pufftas” is rather close to a certain UK derogatory term, I’d perhaps rethink your usage.

 

[Richard S. Ta]

Definitely Kes.

A misbegotten concept for a character paired with an incredibly wooden and soulless performance.

Getting rid of her was the second best thing Voyager ever did. Replacing her with Seven was the first best thing. Good riddance.

 

[Ragitsu]

In Non Sequitur (S02e05) regular Kim is switched out with a mirror universe Kim, who had just finished sex with Libby. So regular virgin Kim may not have had full intercourse per se, but he was probably awkwardly splashing bout in the wet spot reticently like a world class sex expert.

Have you ever considered recording an alternative commentary for Voyager episodes? I say this in all sincerity. You add a whole new dimension to the Tour de Delta experience.

Replacing her with Seven was the first best thing. Good riddance.

She was a double-edged nanite: worthwhile performances from Ryan, yes, but, like Picardo's EMH, those performances increasingly took up screentime that could have been used with other characters (*coughChakotaycough*). Some folk don't mind The Seven and Doctor Show that later seasons became (slight exaggeration), but I found it a shame.

 

[Starflight]

Has anyone ever investigated how much screentime each character gets after Seven arrives? It'd be interesting to see if the Seven and EMH domination thing holds up; I've been watching season six recently and there's still a lot of stuff for Janeway, Paris, and others. Only Chakotay ends up seriously backgrounded.

 

[Ghouleddie74]

Which was fine with Beltran. He longed for the days off when he didn't have to turn up on the set.

 

[Ragitsu]

Which was fine with Beltran. He longed for the days off when he didn't have to turn up on the set.

Because the writers didn't give him much in the way of material; there was an interview where Robert Beltran cheekily expressed his frustration on this topic. Tuvok was another relatively squandered opportunity, considering that he was around one century old.

 

[Ghouleddie74]

Once Jeri Taylor departed he thought most of the scripts were bad. He clocked in and did the work asked of him, but largely stopped caring.

 

[Tosk]

As so many of us do with our jobs.

Has anyone ever investigated how much screentime each character gets after Seven arrives? It'd be interesting to see if the Seven and EMH domination thing holds up; I've been watching season six recently and there's still a lot of stuff for Janeway, Paris, and others. Only Chakotay ends up seriously backgrounded.

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Funny and telling...Seven overtakes Neelix by season six, and ultimately beats Kim, Tom, Torres, and Neelix by the end of the show.

Whereas Worf, who joined DS9 at the same juncture that Seven did, doesn't even overtake Jake (who skipped over 100 episodes of the series!) until the last half of the final season.

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[Ghouleddie74]

My people have a saying....

 

[Guy Gardener]

Has anyone ever investigated how much screentime each character gets after Seven arrives? It'd be interesting to see if the Seven and EMH domination thing holds up; I've been watching season six recently and there's still a lot of stuff for Janeway, Paris, and others. Only Chakotay ends up seriously backgrounded.

Chakoteya's transcript site has a page which says how many lines each character had per episode, so if you plug that into an excel spread sheet, you can work out all sorts of fun stuff.

Line Count Seasons 1-3

Line Count Seasons 4 - 7

Note, Wang has two episodes where he has zero lines because that well adjusted diva pissed off the producers, just before they started thinking about hiring Jeri Ryan.

 

[Crazyewok]

Kes was a lame character played by a mediocre actress.

Voyager was better without her.

 

[Frightscape One]

And a Season 4, so after the writers started giving her much better and more consistently good script material! Just about everyone shone in Season 4. I think every lead character on the show comes off better in 1990-91 than they did the previous year, and Wesley even leaves the series partway through Season 4, so Wil Wheaton got to give a few of his better Wesley performances during the year.

I think season 4 was TNG's best season. A pattern I've noticed with all shows in the franchise: a series hitting 4 or more seasons, their 4th seems to be the best. With the exception of DISCO, but even in that case, their 4th season finale was the best one and the only one that actually stuck the landing.

Definitely Kes.

A misbegotten concept for a character paired with an incredibly wooden and soulless performance.

Getting rid of her was the second best thing Voyager ever did. Replacing her with Seven was the first best thing. Good riddance.

Considering the trading up we got with Seven, I have to agree.

If I can add a third best thing VOY did?

Creating the Vidiians. I'll always maintain they were the best race that show created.

 

[Mage]

It's gotta be a toss up between Kes or Mayweather for me. Both characters had a decent base that could have let somewhere, but nothing was done.

Decent runner ups are Chakotay, Reed and as mentioned earlier before, seasons 1-2 Troi. She got a lot better when better material was given to Sirtis. I could add Beverly Crusher, but she wasn't bad. Just a bland character really.

So, is it me, or does DS9 basically have no bad/boring characters?

 

[F. King Daniel]

Kes got "Warlord", where Jennifer Lien got to fire on all cylinders.

Mayweather got... to sit on the bridge and stare forward.

That said, I vote for Chakotay. The Inanimate Carbon Rod of the Star Trek franchise.

 

[Mage]

Kes got "Warlord", where Jennifer Lien got to fire on all cylinders.

Mayweather got... to sit on the bridge and stare forward.

That said, I vote for Chakotay. The Inanimate Carbon Rod of the Star Trek franchise.

Fact. Warlord was amazing.

I understand Chakotay, but Beltran did pretty good at first. The fact the producers got a fake advisor for Native American culture and the writers just did nothing after a while.

We needed a BSG situation. What if, after Equinox, the ship survived and Chakotay took command of it? Give him more to do. That could have been interesting.

 

[CovePhanTom]

Chakotay was a decent character, and I like Robert Beltran, but it's yet another case of the Voyager writers just abandoning their premise. It started out that Chakotay, being Maquis, could provide some -- *gasp* -- conflict among the command crew.

But unlike DS9, who embraced the conflict between Sisko and Kira and let their bond and respect come organically over time, Voyager basically had Janeway and Chakotay as best buds within a couple episodes.

Honestly, I think going to UPN may have been the worst thing to ever happen to Trek.