Shaw's recent art/research projects
- Thread starter Shaw
- Start date
I always have issues seeing them on desktop on my end.
They'll show as broken pics because Trekbbs is defaulted to https and Shaw's server where he hosts his images is http. Most modern browsers will block showing the http images on a https site.
Yep. Same thing happens with my schematics site. Never felt the need to use https.
I thought this might be the appropriate place to ask:
I recently watched Requiem for Methuselah and probably the best part of the episode was seeing the 33-inch Enterprise model in scale.
I was looking at shaws drawings posted to cygnus-X-1 and thought: is Polar lights 1/350 model equivalant in size to the 33inch model?
I recently watched Requiem for Methuselah and probably the best part of the episode was seeing the 33-inch Enterprise model in scale.
I was looking at shaws drawings posted to cygnus-X-1 and thought: is Polar lights 1/350 model equivalant in size to the 33inch model?
Close. 32.5" long built.
Yeah... what he said. That's why I include both images and links, even for smaller images that I didn't used to.
All my stuff is falling behind the times. My old systems are unable to even see many forums I used to post to, and I can only see this one with a work around (which could end with the next update to TrekBBS' software). I'm not online enough that not being able to see most sites on the internet is worth the expense of getting an up-to-date system.
I haven't seen a 1/350 model in person, but I would guest that my 33.75" model and the 32.5" models would appear the same size to most people unless right next to each other.
Of course my obsession with the Enterprise on the table in that episode is why I scratch built my studio scale model (and chose to detail it as it looked at that time). After updating my two-thirds studio scale study model (22.5"), it looks great in images now... but the studio scale model is still the one I find myself staring at from across the room.
While we had a string of good weather (for working on models) over the last couple weeks, I was personally under the weather and couldn't take advantage of it.
I did put this model together for my doctor last month...
My appointment happen to be on the 48th anniversary of the first flight of the Enterprise.
On a different subject, I came across a video a while back by someone in the Navy pointing out all the "errors" he noticed in Star Trek. Having grown up with the Navy all around me, I was nodding along with what he was saying. But the longer I pondered the subject, the more I questioned my position. Not everyone has had a close association with the Navy, not even the people behind Star Trek over the years.
This made me reconsider The Cage. The two most influential people in that production were Roddenberry and Jefferies... both of whom served in the Army Air Corp. Then, while watching Gamera (Gammera- The Invivcible, 1965) I noticed that some of the Air Force personnel had a dark band on their sleeve while others didn't... so I looked into it and looked at The Cage uniforms again (from a non-Navy point of view).
This is what I came up with...
I should point out that even when they moved towards something more like the Navy, they still stumbled a bit
The real issue for Trek has been trying to avoid dealing with members of the audience not understanding the difference between the rank of Captain and the position of Captain. Neither Pike nor Kirk really needed to hold the rank of Captain to command the Enterprise in TOS (though the rank is more justified for Picard commanding the Enterprise D in TNG).
I think they could have believed in their audience more. After all, the film Ice Station Zebra (1968) didn't worry about Rock Hudson's character being the Captain of his sub while having a rank of Commander.
The real problem (for me at least) shows up in TMP. Kirk assume command of the Enterprise, takes the rank of Captain, and demoted Decker to Commander.
Those familiar with our navy know that it is quite common for the CO and XO of a ship to hold the same rank, so in later movies having Kirk, Spock and even Scott hold the rank of Captain isn't that odd. And in TWoK Kirk takes command of the Enterprise without demoting himself or Spock.
All that makes Kirk's actions in TMP seem rather bad. He could have stayed an Admiral or assumed the rank of Captain without demoting Decker from the rank of Captain. It only seems justified if you think the rank and position are the same... but if you know they aren't, Kirk comes off looking like a jerk in that movie.
Also (while not as bad), Riker could have kept the rank of Captain from the fourth season on while still serving as XO on the Enterprise D. For a lot of the history of our last Enterprise (CVN-65), the CO and XO both held the rank of Captain.
At any rate, this view of The Cage uniforms also explains Roddenberry's statement that everyone on the Enterprise is an officer.
I had hoped to have some cool stuff ready by the time I could get online again, but I didn't finish it in time. In the meantime, here is some retro SNW promotional art I threw together...
And the first one without the title...
And the first one without the title...
Thanks! That was exactly what I was going for.
So, one of my bucket list projects has been a technical manual for the Phase II Enterprise. And one of the hurdles I knew I'd eventually have to tackle was drawing diagrams of the bridge chairs that were actually going to have been used in Star Trek II... and here is my progress on that front.
I'll try to polish-up my work on the engine room as integrated into the Phase II Enterprise plans and post that soon.
As a departing note from occupied territory, please consider reading the poem "First They Came".
@Shaw - we have copies of the Phase II Engineering Room and Warp Core set blueprints on my archive if it is of help
Archive Phase II Engineering folder: http://archive.frogland.co.uk/Set Blueprints/Phase II/Phase II Engineering/index.html
I am very interested in Phase II bridge chairs, and until now thought the version drawn on the Bridge console blueprint was going to be used.
From the look of your diagram, it looks a lot like the chairs on the Klingon bridge, which were Hunsaker Big Boy Pro Poly Racing Bucket Seat
Klingon Blueprint: http://archive.frogland.co.uk/Set B...P/index.html#img=(ST-I) Klingon Bridge 12.jpg
There is one in Riker's room in TNG "Haven"
Archive Phase II Engineering folder: http://archive.frogland.co.uk/Set Blueprints/Phase II/Phase II Engineering/index.html
I am very interested in Phase II bridge chairs, and until now thought the version drawn on the Bridge console blueprint was going to be used.
From the look of your diagram, it looks a lot like the chairs on the Klingon bridge, which were Hunsaker Big Boy Pro Poly Racing Bucket Seat
Klingon Blueprint: http://archive.frogland.co.uk/Set B...P/index.html#img=(ST-I) Klingon Bridge 12.jpg
There is one in Riker's room in TNG "Haven"
Do either of you have plans or concept art for the Phase II corridors? They were redressed for TMP but presumably were much closer to TOS originally.
@aridas sofia - Unfortunately I have no concept art or corridor structure blueprints for the Phase II corridors - They are something I would really like to find.
However I do have some information about the corridors.
There are a few photos
Not sure why the wall flats were initially put up without doors - based on where the photographs were taken, there should have been doors.
When the doorways were added, they would have ultimately the same dimensions as TMP and early TNG -> 3'0" x 7'0" and 2 1/4" deep with square corners.
Gap between corridor door frame and room wall frame (for sliding door to move through) is 1 1/2"
The Phase II and TMP doors were custom and very thin. They were apparently very expensive, so TNG doors were made from commercially available blanks instead and later altered in season 2.
The Phase II curved corridor is slightly wider than the final TMP/TNG corridors (which were built inside the Phase II corridor). You can see the TMP corridor built inside the Phase II in this TMP blueprint, which still has the lines from Phase II.
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This is why the extra framing around the TNG junior quarters door is so deep. (Which can be seen at the far left of this picture). The Junior Quarters door is at the Phase II position.
My view is that with the TNG curved corridor being 8'0" wide, its possible that the Phase II curved corridor may be 8'4" wide. However this number is not yet confirmed.
The Phase II transporter corridor was not narrowed for TMP (walls remained in place - they just added arches and panels), so the Phase II transporter corridor width would have been 8'0"
As for Phase II corridor wall height, we can see it in this photo of the TNG sets being reworked into Voyager set. Being the transporter corridor, we know these walls originally came from Phase II (and it seems the writing on them probably dated from Phase II as well).
From what I can tell, the wall stops at the top beam of the TMP K-arches (reused for TNG).
Fortunately I have drawn up a blueprint of these arches, which have an Arch height of 11'0.
Personally I would say that the Phase II wall height is about 10' 6 1/2" (stopping at the arch top beam)
The overhead units in the Phase II corridor seem to be one per wall flat (so 1 per curve segment).
A varient also seem to have been reused in the Phase II briefing room
[Phase II briefing room arches were reused in the TMP cargo bay docking port. The blueprint for this is in the archive http://archive.frogland.co.uk/Set Blueprints/Enterprise Refit/Cargo hold/index.html#img=Cargo hold airlock.png ]
This really low res blueprint of the Phase II corridor layout shows there must have been at least 8 segments (and an intersection) to the curved corridor, each with their own overhead unit.
We can also see that the turbolift was at the end of the curved corridor. Phase II turbolifts were ikely converted into TMP ones.
There is also something on the end of the transporter corridor, but I'm not sure what it is.
I hope this information is helpful regarding the Phase II corridors.
However I do have some information about the corridors.
There are a few photos
Not sure why the wall flats were initially put up without doors - based on where the photographs were taken, there should have been doors.
When the doorways were added, they would have ultimately the same dimensions as TMP and early TNG -> 3'0" x 7'0" and 2 1/4" deep with square corners.
Gap between corridor door frame and room wall frame (for sliding door to move through) is 1 1/2"
The Phase II and TMP doors were custom and very thin. They were apparently very expensive, so TNG doors were made from commercially available blanks instead and later altered in season 2.
The Phase II curved corridor is slightly wider than the final TMP/TNG corridors (which were built inside the Phase II corridor). You can see the TMP corridor built inside the Phase II in this TMP blueprint, which still has the lines from Phase II.
This is why the extra framing around the TNG junior quarters door is so deep. (Which can be seen at the far left of this picture). The Junior Quarters door is at the Phase II position.
My view is that with the TNG curved corridor being 8'0" wide, its possible that the Phase II curved corridor may be 8'4" wide. However this number is not yet confirmed.
The Phase II transporter corridor was not narrowed for TMP (walls remained in place - they just added arches and panels), so the Phase II transporter corridor width would have been 8'0"
As for Phase II corridor wall height, we can see it in this photo of the TNG sets being reworked into Voyager set. Being the transporter corridor, we know these walls originally came from Phase II (and it seems the writing on them probably dated from Phase II as well).
From what I can tell, the wall stops at the top beam of the TMP K-arches (reused for TNG).
Fortunately I have drawn up a blueprint of these arches, which have an Arch height of 11'0.
Personally I would say that the Phase II wall height is about 10' 6 1/2" (stopping at the arch top beam)
The overhead units in the Phase II corridor seem to be one per wall flat (so 1 per curve segment).
A varient also seem to have been reused in the Phase II briefing room
[Phase II briefing room arches were reused in the TMP cargo bay docking port. The blueprint for this is in the archive http://archive.frogland.co.uk/Set Blueprints/Enterprise Refit/Cargo hold/index.html#img=Cargo hold airlock.png ]
This really low res blueprint of the Phase II corridor layout shows there must have been at least 8 segments (and an intersection) to the curved corridor, each with their own overhead unit.
We can also see that the turbolift was at the end of the curved corridor. Phase II turbolifts were ikely converted into TMP ones.
There is also something on the end of the transporter corridor, but I'm not sure what it is.
I hope this information is helpful regarding the Phase II corridors.
Whoa. I see the note on the plans, but did they cut holes in the tops?
This was more information than I have ever seen about those corridors, going back to my first exposure to the P2 concept art in the early 80s. Great detective work piecing together the various bits. Thank you. A skilled 3d artist could probably recreate them with some level of accuracy from this information.@aridas sofia - Unfortunately I have no concept art or corridor structure blueprints for the Phase II corridors - They are something I would really like to find.
However I do have some information about the corridors.
There are a few photos
Not sure why the wall flats were initially put up without doors - based on where the photographs were taken, there should have been doors.
When the doorways were added, they would have ultimately the same dimensions as TMP and early TNG -> 3'0" x 7'0" and 2 1/4" deep with square corners.
Gap between corridor door frame and room wall frame (for sliding door to move through) is 1 1/2"
The Phase II and TMP doors were custom and very thin. They were apparently very expensive, so TNG doors were made from commercially available blanks instead and later altered in season 2.
The Phase II curved corridor is slightly wider than the final TMP/TNG corridors (which were built inside the Phase II corridor). You can see the TMP corridor built inside the Phase II in this TMP blueprint, which still has the lines from Phase II.
This is why the extra framing around the TNG junior quarters door is so deep. (Which can be seen at the far left of this picture). The Junior Quarters door is at the Phase II position.
My view is that with the TNG curved corridor being 8'0" wide, its possible that the Phase II curved corridor may be 8'4" wide. However this number is not yet confirmed.
The Phase II transporter corridor was not narrowed for TMP (walls remained in place - they just added arches and panels), so the Phase II transporter corridor width would have been 8'0"
As for Phase II corridor wall height, we can see it in this photo of the TNG sets being reworked into Voyager set. Being the transporter corridor, we know these walls originally came from Phase II (and it seems the writing on them probably dated from Phase II as well).
From what I can tell, the wall stops at the top beam of the TMP K-arches (reused for TNG).
Fortunately I have drawn up a blueprint of these arches, which have an Arch height of 11'0.
Personally I would say that the Phase II wall height is about 10' 6 1/2" (stopping at the arch top beam)
The overhead units in the Phase II corridor seem to be one per wall flat (so 1 per curve segment).
A varient also seem to have been reused in the Phase II briefing room
[Phase II briefing room arches were reused in the TMP cargo bay docking port. The blueprint for this is in the archive http://archive.frogland.co.uk/Set Blueprints/Enterprise Refit/Cargo hold/index.html#img=Cargo hold airlock.png ]
This really low res blueprint of the Phase II corridor layout shows there must have been at least 8 segments (and an intersection) to the curved corridor, each with their own overhead unit.
We can also see that the turbolift was at the end of the curved corridor. Phase II turbolifts were ikely converted into TMP ones.
There is also something on the end of the transporter corridor, but I'm not sure what it is.
I hope this information is helpful regarding the Phase II corridors.
Many things about that photo are blowing my mind. The re-use of the briefing room. How much of it is built as a single set. The fact that the turbo lift tubes are real. Although they're covered up with FX elements in the final shot --- Yes?!?
Did they film the scene with Kirk, Scott, and Yeoman Danny up in that corner? Or was that a separate set? I'm going to guess separate because Kirk has to walk into the turbolift. (Just noticed that Admiral Kirk calls Yeoman Danny "sir". After 47 years.)
Has anyone else ever depicted the refit's turbo lifts as egg shaped in keeping with this scene?
(I hope this isn't getting too far afield from Shaw's thread.)
I do like the "modern" crossbeams on the Phase II corridors. I always love it when people are able to take more abstract designs and then say "This is what they would look like if they were 'real' (and we had more time and money".
Did they film the scene with Kirk, Scott, and Yeoman Danny up in that corner? Or was that a separate set? I'm going to guess separate because Kirk has to walk into the turbolift. (Just noticed that Admiral Kirk calls Yeoman Danny "sir". After 47 years.)
Has anyone else ever depicted the refit's turbo lifts as egg shaped in keeping with this scene?
(I hope this isn't getting too far afield from Shaw's thread.)
I do like the "modern" crossbeams on the Phase II corridors. I always love it when people are able to take more abstract designs and then say "This is what they would look like if they were 'real' (and we had more time and money".
We know form this photo that Kirk was up on the gantry, but this may have been for an unused shot (such as either looking up to Kirk or looking over Kirk's shoulder down to the cargo bay)
Also the gantry was in use during the cargo filming - the Yeoman is walking to what would be the airlock. There was a masking sheet to obscure part of the extended gantry and replace with the matte painting
When it comes to the shots with Kirk entering the turbolift from the gantry, my view is that this section was dismantled and reassembled on another stage. This blueprint list the cargo bay on stage 18. However there is a note "Spocks Air lock Stage 17" which implies at least some relocation.
Also the gantry was in use during the cargo filming - the Yeoman is walking to what would be the airlock. There was a masking sheet to obscure part of the extended gantry and replace with the matte painting
When it comes to the shots with Kirk entering the turbolift from the gantry, my view is that this section was dismantled and reassembled on another stage. This blueprint list the cargo bay on stage 18. However there is a note "Spocks Air lock Stage 17" which implies at least some relocation.
Yeah, I got that part. That's part of what blew my mind. I assumed that the gantry and the lower cargo area were different elements.
But it also makes the most sense as being the simplest approach. You'd have to get that far away from Yeoman Danny anyway (and that far under him). Why not do it on an actual set where the dimensions already match?
It's amazing how all of the black levels match so that the live action bits don't "jump out".
@Tallguy Here's a shot of the TMP cargo bay with the Phase II briefing room arches in the top right corner. They cut a quite large hole into each - an alteration not present in the Phase II configuration.
Something I just noticed: Comparing the actual set (top photo) to the matted scene (bottom photo), the actual set had cargo containers built two high, but in the matted scene, it is only one high.Also the gantry was in use during the cargo filming - the Yeoman is walking to what would be the airlock. There was a masking sheet to obscure part of the extended gantry and replace with the matte painting
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