United Federation of Planets, the first 250 years

[Shawnster]

As a follow up to a previous discussion, how did the United Federation of Planets grow and change from it's founding to the end of the Picard era?

We've had interesting comments and thoughts on a lot of parts of this, but how does all this fit together? For example (but not an exclusive list) :

UESPA. It looks like the United Earth Space Probe Agency was a separate entity that Kirk's Enterprise operated under. At some point this goes away in favor, apparently, of a more unified and less Earth-centric approach.

Federation membership. As mentioned in another topic, the structure of the Federation appears to change from a loose union of very independent members that exchange ambassadors with each other and have embassies on other member worlds (like the UN or EU) to a more unified structure with a single, consolidated jurisdiction.

Starfleet's role as the military. There seems to be a philosophical shift in how Starfleet self-identifies. Kirk is a soldier, nit a diplomat. The Genesis project scientists are compared to pawns of the military. The 23rd century Starfleet is proud to claim to be a military. By the 24th century this changes. Emphasis is placed on exploration. Picard almost refused to partake in war games training. Like Japan after WWII the idea of being thought of as having a military is taboo. Like Japan, Starfleet is a defense force. It's a peace keeping armada.

Money. Scotty bought a boat. Starfleet invested over 22,000 credits in Spock's career. Jake had no money to buy a baseball card and Picard said accumulating wealth was replaced with the idea of self-betterment.

Prime Directive. The definition was "No identification of self or mission. No references to space, or the fact that there are other worlds, or more advanced civilisations." Kirk was directed to stop the asteroid from hitting Mirananee's planet. Picard was willing to stand aside as Sarjanka's planet burned to a cinder. What happened to make saving a culture taboo?

Previous discussion: https://www.trekbbs.com/threads/the-united-federation-of-planets-centennial-2161-2261.315760/

 

[knightgrace]

Writer's stupidity at not understanding the Prime Directive.

A species, that is going to stop existing, because of a planetary disaster, or Stellar Disaster, the Prime Directive does not apply too

Why?

Because the PEOPLE are the CULTURE, not the culture is the people.

PEOPLE ARE INFINITELY IMPORTANT!!!

 

[Tenacity]

Starfleet's role as the military.

When the Federation goes to war, it's Starfleet that fights the war. Starfleet's ships carry heavy weapons. Torpedoes have antimatter warheads, weapons of mass destruction. Sisko was able to poison an entire planet with what he had onboard.

The idea that Starfleet isn't a military is a joke.

 

[Uxi]

Starfleet's role as the military. There seems to be a philosophical shift in how Starfleet self-identifies. Kirk is a soldier, nit a diplomat.

They use military rank and naval tradition.

The Genesis project scientists are compared to pawns of the military.

That was David Marcus' hippies perspective, though and Carol didn't agree. They were being funded by the Federation (thus Carol's pitch). It was clearly dangerous so Starfleet was involved in at least scouting for a location (likely isolated as well as without life to be destroyed or contaminate the project).

The 23rd century Starfleet is proud to claim to be a military. By the 24th century this changes. Emphasis is placed on exploration. Picard almost refused to partake in war games training. Like Japan after WWII the idea of being thought of as having a military is taboo. Like Japan, Starfleet is a defense force. It's a peace keeping armada.

Which proved to be a really bad idea given the Borg and Dominion threats later discovered that Starfleet was unprepared for. Japan is facing the same issue with Red China.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Which proved to be a really bad idea given the Borg and Dominion threats later discovered that Starfleet was unprepared for. Japan is facing the same issue with Red China.

The entire world is facing the same issue.

The entire Western Military aparatus doesn't have enough ships compared to China right now.

it's a huge problem.

 

[at Quark's]

Because the PEOPLE are the CULTURE, not the culture is the people.

PEOPLE ARE INFINITELY IMPORTANT!!!

Or, at the very least, Soylent Green.

 

[Disposable_Ensign]

UESPA. It looks like the United Earth Space Probe Agency was a separate entity that Kirk's Enterprise operated under. At some point this goes away in favor, apparently, of a more unified and less Earth-centric approach.

I view the Federation like NATO or the UN peacekeepers in that individual member planets still have their own local governments in a way, and that UESPA is just Earth's local space command, so they could have supervised the Enterprise project or such.

Starfleet's role as the military. There seems to be a philosophical shift in how Starfleet self-identifies. Kirk is a soldier, nit a diplomat. The Genesis project scientists are compared to pawns of the military. The 23rd century Starfleet is proud to claim to be a military. By the 24th century this changes. Emphasis is placed on exploration. Picard almost refused to partake in war games training. Like Japan after WWII the idea of being thought of as having a military is taboo. Like Japan, Starfleet is a defense force. It's a peace keeping armada.

Perhaps the end of (cold and hot) war with the Klingons could have shifted this emphasis away?

 

[Tenacity]

The entire Western Military aparatus doesn't have enough ships compared to China right now.

Thankfully the Chinese haven't fought an actual war in 45 years, and today have no practical experience doing so. Drills and simulations only get personnel so far. most of their naval vessels are the size of patrol boats.

 

[Henoch]

Thankfully the Chinese haven't fought an actual war in 45 years, and today have no practical experience doing so. Drills and simulations only get personnel so far. most of their naval vessels are the size of patrol boats.

I think the best comparison for the Romulans is a smaller and outdated (though they don't know it, yet) Roman Empire. It's even in its name.

The Romulans are well practiced in actual war as said by their Commander:

COMMANDER: Danger and I are old companions.
CENTURION: We've seen a hundred campaigns together, and still I do not understand you.
COMMANDER: I think you do. No need to tell you what happens when we reach home with proof of the Earthmen's weakness. And we will have proof. The Earth commander will follow. He must. When he attacks, we will destroy him. Our gift to the homeland, another war.
CENTURION: If we are the strong, isn't this the signal for war?
COMMANDER: Must it always be so? How many comrades have we lost in this way?
CENTURION: Our portion, Commander, is obedience.
COMMANDER: Obedience. Duty. Death and more death. Soon even enough for the Praetor's taste. Centurion, I find myself wishing for destruction before we can return. Worry not. Like you, I am too well-trained in my duty to permit it. Continue evasive manoeuvres. Now, back to the first course.

The "wars" could be either internal conflicts to maintain control of their territory or battles on the other side of their empire to expand its territory, or both.

Compared to United Earth Starships, Romulan ships appear smaller in size and power (slow speed, simple impulse energy generation and limited endurance, no shields). The ship in Balance of Terror is supposed to their flagship which represents their most powerful ship in the fleet. The ship is build for stealth and one big plasma shot; it's good for destroying fixed and slowly moving targets. Even with the cloaking system and its big gun, the Enterprise outclassed it.

 

[Tenacity]

CENTURION: We've seen a hundred campaigns together

Klingons maybe.

 

[Shawnster]

Klingons maybe.

Before they established enough of an alliance to exchange technology by season 3?

 

[Henoch]

Before they established enough of an alliance to exchange technology by season 3?

Old Romulan Saying: The enemy of my enemy is my friend.

 

[Tenacity]

Before they established enough of an alliance to exchange technology by season 3?

Was the tech exchange with the Empire, or just one of the larger Klingon houses?

and Picard said accumulating wealth was replaced with the idea of self-betterment.

Or that was Picard advocating a personal philosophy that while not unique, is hardly ubiquitous within the Federation.

 

[Shawnster]

Was the tech exchange with the Empire, or just one of the larger Klingon houses?

Can a foreign government be friendly/amicable with a Klingon house but not the Empire? Interesting thought

Or that was Picard advocating a personal philosophy that while not unique, is hardly ubiquitous within the Federation.

DS9 "In the Cards" is pretty explicit that it's more than a personal philosophy of Picard's.

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

DS9 "In the Cards" is pretty explicit that it's more than a personal philosophy of Picard's.

YMMV, that only proves that you don't need liquid assets to be happy/healthy* in the Federation (it's worth noting that Picard despite declaming "personal wealth" is almost certainly significantly wealthy by modern standards, particularly by PIC), as there is certainly no prohibition on having wealth and systems exist to interact with wealth-based economies.

* Jake is essentially a part-time blogger with no real "audience" living with his dad on the "federal government bill", a job that wouldn't have much "wealth" IRL anyway.