TOS had the first interracial kiss on network RV in the states a black eoman on the bridge, an Asian, and a Russian on the bridge. Heady stuff for the 1960s.
You just have no idea what the times were like, methinks. How old are you, if I may ask?
Why is Star Trek so bad with women characters?
- Thread starter Whizkid
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TOS had the first interracial kiss on network RV in the states a black eoman on the bridge, an Asian, and a Russian on the bridge. Heady stuff for the 1960s.
You just have no idea what the times were like, methinks. How old are you, if I may ask?
Commercial Sci-Fi (for lack of a better term) has always had "Rule of Hot" for female characters - regardless of how intelligent, strong, talented they are written - with it being especially noticeable (to me at least - may have been equally prevalent at other times but this coincides with my favourite sci-fi shows being on TV and in greater numbers concurrently than I am aware of there previously being...certainly in the UK)
SG-1 feels like the exception as for most of its run the two main female characters were Carter (multiple doctorates and could kick a Goa'uld's arse but never overly sexualised (pretending the awful introduction line from the first film didn't happen) and Dr Fraser who was simply an excellent doctor. Now both women were very attractive but that was rarely focussed on, although the Carter/O'Neil will they won't they felt a bit like they couldn't not have them hook up as every show needs its Ross and Rachel).
It did still fall into "Evil Women are Hot" and obviously Vala and Adria were played in more sexual ways (Vala overtly, Adria through costuming).
Andromeda then has Romy, and in season 5 Doyle, the sexing up of Trance in season 3 (I think), and Beka to an extent but also had Harper who was an absolute perv but was written in such a way that clearly he was the problem as opposed to being rewarded for being lecharous.
What they did do here though was have Dylan, Tyr, Rhade and many more men as eye candy
Farscape and BSG did the same thing - Aeryn Sun could just as quickly kick your arse across 3 parsecs as she could titillate, as could Starbuck but you then have characters like Commandant Grayza (although could be argued it was the classic trope of woman in a man's world subverts things by using men's attraction to her advantage) and Number 6
It was, to my mind, the 90's mentality around gender equality mixed with good old capitalism - the vast majority of viewers were ready (or even loudly advocating) strong, competent, equal women but only if they could also double as a pin up alongside recognition that female viewers were increasingly important as target demos so they made sure that the characters who were in the credits were competent first, sexy second so as not to drive away viewers and then (because TV producer logic) got the male leads tops off and oiled up often enough so they could argue "Look, we have them both being sexualised - equality innit"
SG-1 feels like the exception as for most of its run the two main female characters were Carter (multiple doctorates and could kick a Goa'uld's arse but never overly sexualised (pretending the awful introduction line from the first film didn't happen) and Dr Fraser who was simply an excellent doctor. Now both women were very attractive but that was rarely focussed on, although the Carter/O'Neil will they won't they felt a bit like they couldn't not have them hook up as every show needs its Ross and Rachel).
It did still fall into "Evil Women are Hot" and obviously Vala and Adria were played in more sexual ways (Vala overtly, Adria through costuming).
Andromeda then has Romy, and in season 5 Doyle, the sexing up of Trance in season 3 (I think), and Beka to an extent but also had Harper who was an absolute perv but was written in such a way that clearly he was the problem as opposed to being rewarded for being lecharous.
What they did do here though was have Dylan, Tyr, Rhade and many more men as eye candy
Farscape and BSG did the same thing - Aeryn Sun could just as quickly kick your arse across 3 parsecs as she could titillate, as could Starbuck but you then have characters like Commandant Grayza (although could be argued it was the classic trope of woman in a man's world subverts things by using men's attraction to her advantage) and Number 6
It was, to my mind, the 90's mentality around gender equality mixed with good old capitalism - the vast majority of viewers were ready (or even loudly advocating) strong, competent, equal women but only if they could also double as a pin up alongside recognition that female viewers were increasingly important as target demos so they made sure that the characters who were in the credits were competent first, sexy second so as not to drive away viewers and then (because TV producer logic) got the male leads tops off and oiled up often enough so they could argue "Look, we have them both being sexualised - equality innit"
Well it has an almost kiss. And "interracial" is a bit nebulous. As mentioned Kirk was smooching on an Asian woman in "Elaan of Troyius" Lucy and Ricky kissed all the time in "I Love Lucy", Nancy Sinatra kissed Sammy Davis, Jr on her special "Moving With Nancy" in 1967, a year prior to "Plato's Stepchildren",
Star Trek wasn't alone in including POC in their casts. "Hogan's Heroes" (1965) had Kinchloe. "Mission Impossible" (1966) had Barney. "Mannix" (1967) had Peggy. "Julia" (1968) starred Diahann Carroll. "I Spy" (1965) costarred Bill Cosby, The directive to include more POC came from suits in advertising of all places Illya Kuryakin from the "Man from U.N.C.L.E." (1965) was America's favorite Russian years before Chekov hit the small screen.
Full disclosure. I was born in 1959 and watched all those shows first run
Most of what was wrong with VOY had little to do with character gender. Seven's outfit was a giant step backward for woman kind, though
The shows are always a reflection of the times. I think they've gradually gotten better and more realistic as the years have passed. They also had to balance trying to please the young male demo that used to watch. It was the standard formula to have the sex-symbol female character.
Today [Nov 22, 2020] is the 52nd anniversary of the 1st airing of "Plato's Stepchilden" and we all know what that's debatably famous for. Today on Twitter TrekMovie bucked the party line (link), and they're right...mostly. We replied, but here's what we said:
While there were concerns the "kiss" would be controversial there's no evidence of much of a reaction at all. Even Nichelle Nichols has said the mail received was largely positive.In 1968 the US was way behind the curve in terms of showing affection between blacks and whites. There were a number of "interracial" kisses aired in Europe in the decade that preceded "Plato's Stepchildren".
The big problem with the "Plato's Stepchildren" kiss is that it ISN'T a kiss; Kirk & Uhura are forced to press lips together. That's not a smooch: that's BATTERY. And Dave Kaufman's (aka "Daku") Variety review rightly and smartly called it out on that count:
But six weeks after the Kirk-Uhura facecrush, Robert Wagner gave Denise Nicholas a quick non-forced kiss at the end of an episode of It Takes a Thief. We give that the nod over the fake-o "Plato's" kiss. Sorry, Star Trek.
...and we know of a kiss on US TV that predates both, but we're still doing research on the topic so we're saving that little bombshell for a different date.
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