Hot take: Andor is an excellent piece of work, but I’m not crazy about the fact that per this series plus earlier hints elsewhere, terrorism was an important part of the early Rebellion. I know that’s realistic, but it puts a pall over the idealistic fantasy series I’ve followed since I was eight.
Spoilers Andor - Season 2
- Thread starter Fuddles
- Start date
I always knew that the rebellion had to get it hands dirtly even as a child.
Its good your fantasty got shattered. Ine should not have idealized views about war even in fiction.
War is not pretty.
War sucks and people die.
Starwars is a franchise about war, it says so in the name.
If showing diffrent aspects or war makes you uncomfortable then this is the wrong franchise for you. May I suggest series 1 and 2 of TNG would be more your own cup of tea.
As a result of the truncated seasons and the cramming together of SO much story, what should have been a couple of very key moments in the plot happen entirely after the fact, with just a mention.
We should have SEEN Dedra actually continuing to dig about Axis and finally getting a piece of intel that let her put things together/led her to Luthen. Instead, it gets buried in a quick throw away line.
And, similarly, we needed to SEE Dedra back at work, obsessively chasing Axis and plowing through "Imperial norms" and bending the rules, skulking and "scavenging" to get her to that point while simultaneously giving the ISB enough rope to hang her on.
Those are very significant developments that, sure, we can take on faith, given what we know of Dedra, but it feels sloppy that it's all just expositioned away.
We should have SEEN Dedra actually continuing to dig about Axis and finally getting a piece of intel that let her put things together/led her to Luthen. Instead, it gets buried in a quick throw away line.
And, similarly, we needed to SEE Dedra back at work, obsessively chasing Axis and plowing through "Imperial norms" and bending the rules, skulking and "scavenging" to get her to that point while simultaneously giving the ISB enough rope to hang her on.
Those are very significant developments that, sure, we can take on faith, given what we know of Dedra, but it feels sloppy that it's all just expositioned away.
Where does the Rebellion commit terrorist acts?
It's not hyperbole to say it's a masterpiece nor that it's the best Star Wars.Yes, because you're totally unfamiliar with hyperbole.
It was VERY controversial when that concept was introduced with all the killings by Andor and Draven in Rogue One honestly, I think people forgot that now. At the time the movie aired, Star Wars fans were still accustomed to the much cleaner formation of the Rebellion portrayed in Legends and even the Force Unleashed game.
I don't disagree.
Exactly. Case in point, Kira Nerys.
That's true.
That's false.
What Dedra pitched was the idea of Ghorman rebels to generate sympathy for the Empire so that there would be public approval for a crackdown on Ghorman. Partagaz confirmed to her that that had worked.
When Dedra asked Partagaz for clarity on what exactly she was to do once the mining equipment was being set up and the armory barricading had begun, Partagaz told her that she did not need to concern herself and that Captain Kaido would handle matters at his discretion. Dedra did not know who Kaido was, she was not told in advance that he was coming, nor did she have knowledge of his operational plans. They were quite specific about these points on numerous occasions. All Dedra was to do was give Kaido the order to proceed, and once she did that, everything would be handled by Kaido.
It would have been consistent with what Dedra pitched to Krennic for the Ghorman rebels to rise up and kill Imperials.
However, there was never any evidence presented at any time that having Imperial special snipers shoot regular Imperial troops was Dedra's idea, nor was there any evidence that she approved of this action. Once Dedra saw the set-up, when the time came for her to relay the order for Kaido to put his plan into motion, she hesitated, although as I've opined before, she had no practical alternative except to rubber-stamp the operation, as was expected of her.
What happened in the plaza was neither planned nor proposed by Dedra.
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Moff Jerjerrod: Lord Vader. This is an unexpected pleasure. We are honored by your presence.
Darth Vader: You may dispense with the pleasantries, Commander. I am here to put you back on schedule.
Jerjerrod: I assure you, Lord Vader, Dedra Meero is working as fast as she can.
Vader: Perhaps I can find new ways to motivate her.
Darth Vader: You may dispense with the pleasantries, Commander. I am here to put you back on schedule.
Jerjerrod: I assure you, Lord Vader, Dedra Meero is working as fast as she can.
Vader: Perhaps I can find new ways to motivate her.
I'm sure even George Washington was a terrorist by 1770s and 1780s standards.
Well, Washington arguably fits today's concept of terrorist, as defined by law.
However, according to Wikipedia [link]:
The term "terrorism" itself was originally used to describe the actions of the Jacobin Club during the "Reign of Terror" in the French Revolution.
So, apparently, the term did not exist at the time of the American Revolution. Also, it's questionable whether Washington's actions were extreme enough to have been considered comparable to what occurred during the Reign of Terror, with its enormous number of death sentences. I think it's doubtful that contemporaries of the French Revolution would have used that term to describe Washington retrospectively. But I'll concede it's possible.
But you’re not 8 anymore and this series takes a look at the story through the eye of an adult. I say take it in for all its worth. It’s pretty great.
You had me till the crack at TNG S1&2. You’re comparing apples and oranges with that one, and as much as I love Love LOVED Andor, I will not watch it anywhere near as many times as TNG S1&2 or hope for us to reach such a world.
I would love for Tony Gilroy or someone similar to take a crack at Star Trek, for them to do an adult prestige version of it, and I’d absolutely adore for someone to do all that in a visionary aspirational way that only Trek seems capable of approaching.
It drove me nuts that they kept calling her a "terrorist" in the show. Her homeland was literally under a hostile foreign occupation. In no way, shape, or form does that make someone trying to repel that invading force a "terrorist."
The only distinction is that Kaido fired the first shot because the Ghormans didn't take the bait.
But Dedra did everything she could for years to radicalize the Ghormans. The end result was always going to be the same.
The only difference is that Kaido fired first which, fair enough, wasn't Dedra's idea, per se.
But everything that happened was the natural end result of what Dedra initially pitched and was planned from the start.
I don't know if it's a hot take, it's just how you feel. I've said this earlier here but i tend to separate general Star Wars and Andor, i.e. Andor is the mature and realistic version of the Star Wars universe. It digs much deeper, is much more gray whereas general Star Wars aims to put characters in either the evil or good category to simplify matters.
See it this way.. if you had the fortune to see the OT as a kid you grew up alongside all the movies but one the Prequels rolled around you were an adult and your worldview and experience has expanded tenfold. Now add another 25 years more to get to today and you are bitching about the simplicity of Star Wars, about Jar Jar and all the other merchandiseable stuff they cram into the movies and shows nowadays.
And then comes Andor and shows you what it's really like and you make a decision - stay with safe Star Wars or be challenged by Andor.
Disagree. What would that have accomplished storywise to show Dedra doing grunt work again? We have seen her do this in season one, we know she's capable and has an eye for detail and can make connections that others overlook. We know how she operates already, this would have been just needlessly retreading ground that was already covered and would have taken up screentime that could have been used to push the storyline along.
All we need to know is that she was successful in finding Luthen and that led to the story moving along.
Finally watched Rogue One in 3D. The 3D isn’t the best but it does the job. It’s funny how fast paced the movie is compared to the show. I imagine it would have taken 4 episodes to rescue Jyn if it was also a TV show.
The battle at the end is very well done but it did seem rather excessive. Probably done to justify the movie budget. The ending is good but it’s not very inconsistent with what they say in episode IV. Probably could have fixed that issue with another rewrite and it would fit perfectly.
The battle at the end is very well done but it did seem rather excessive. Probably done to justify the movie budget. The ending is good but it’s not very inconsistent with what they say in episode IV. Probably could have fixed that issue with another rewrite and it would fit perfectly.
You don't think that, after chasing someone for 5 years, it's not interesting and germane and relevant to actually see that person finally crack the case?
My favorite Sherlock Holmes story is the one where he doesn't explain at all his methodology or how he arrived at his conclusions. He just says "You're guilty" and we accept it on faith.
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