The Superman and Lois TV show was pulling in $5 million per episode. The first season was 15 episodes, seasons 2 and 3 were 13 episodes each, and the 4th and final season was 10 episodes. Still, the production and CGI looked good compared to other The CW TV shows. Maybe Star Trek TV shows should do the same, with budgets between 50 and 75 million dollars and again with a small number of episodes, companies and people who make 'cinema films' CGI should be given the job. which is what they are already doing.
What are your controversial Star Trek opinions?
- Thread starter Amasov
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Indeed. S31 is getting a lot of flak, but it is mainly problems that have always been there all throughout the current Kurtzman era .
It wasn't great, but no worse than an average episode of Discovery or Picard IMO
Much worse. Much much worse.
yeah, i'm expecting them to announce SNW season 4 as the last. I'm hoping for at least 5, but i wouldnt put it past them.
Section 31 really is worse. Much worse. I'm doing a rewatch of Picard right now and I'm three episodes into season 2, so I know how bad they are by comparison.
But yeah, Section 31 seems to have been built out of the flaws of other shows (mostly Discovery), with all of the Star Trek carefully stripped away. There's nothing there that's shocking to anyone who's been watching the other series, but it's so pure and concentrated now, without a hint of anything that could redeem it. The hilarious flame jets, the immature dialogue, the entirely unimpressive fight on a vehicle zipping down a tunnel, the contemporary language, the rejection of Star Trek's ideology, the absurdly huge stakes, the unpleasant cinematography, the villain who by pure chance is personally connected to the hero, the camera doing backflips everywhere... it's like they were working from a checklist.
It follows the basic formula of Discovery.
- Serialized story centered around a threat to destroy the galaxy as we know it.
- The action is focused on the main lead, every other character is a satellite that revolves around her and only defined by their role on the team, being a foil, or a person to die to move the plot along.
- The action sequences care about visuals more than logic (e.g., the hover platform sequence has an impossibly long tunnel that makes as much sense as Discovery's impossibly long turbolifts).
- The story begins as a mystery box that eventually devolves into a personal connection to the star character's love life and family.
But enough about Picard Season 3
I would like to see characters like Dr. McCoy and Sulu come. I would also like the Pike accident to be addressed. But of course, if they shoot the 4th season with reshoots, it will be difficult for the finale to be what I said. I hope the 5th season gets approval. I think SFA will last 2 or 3 seasons.
I know many love it, but this is the thread for controversial opinions and… sorry, but I think PRO is weak.
Most of the characters fell flat for me. The story became less and less interesting the more it leant into being a VOY sequel rather than its own thing. I also found the animation itself to veer between passable and janky.
By the end I was forcing myself through it and as a result ended up dropping it entirely about 6-7 episodes before the end of S02. I can see why it was cancelled and understand why it failed to pick up the audience that it hoped to capture.
As I said, I’m aware many love it. The opinion is mine and mine alone I guess, but this is the thread for it.
Most of the characters fell flat for me. The story became less and less interesting the more it leant into being a VOY sequel rather than its own thing. I also found the animation itself to veer between passable and janky.
By the end I was forcing myself through it and as a result ended up dropping it entirely about 6-7 episodes before the end of S02. I can see why it was cancelled and understand why it failed to pick up the audience that it hoped to capture.
As I said, I’m aware many love it. The opinion is mine and mine alone I guess, but this is the thread for it.
Not entirely alone. This is the only Trek I’ve not watched fully through since I began TOS in 1973. Made it through two episodes. I’m fine with that. I’m not the target audience for it (though I still revisit TAS on rare occasions, so it’s not only that).
PRO is one of those shows that is far better than its detractors would have you think. But it probably isn't as good as its supporters think it is.
I think the first season is stronger because the first season stays farther away from Star Trek so the Star Trek parts can be better displayed. It's like you dropped Star Trek into another show and let the Star Trek flavor the other thing.
Season two is set more centrally to Star Trek but it gets its "otherness" from being a ridiculously fun timey-wimey romp. But this tears at the central Star Trek setting more than the first season does.
I think the first season is stronger because the first season stays farther away from Star Trek so the Star Trek parts can be better displayed. It's like you dropped Star Trek into another show and let the Star Trek flavor the other thing.
Season two is set more centrally to Star Trek but it gets its "otherness" from being a ridiculously fun timey-wimey romp. But this tears at the central Star Trek setting more than the first season does.
Cannot agree more with this. Your assertion is backed up by data too - Look at the Rotten Tomatoes ratings for DSC and it averages out to something like 27% audience score. Now S31 is lower at 18%, but it exemplifies the worst elements of DSC IMHO.
The disparity with the critics scores is that most critics are rating just a couple of episodes of the show - usually the premiers plus 1 or 2 episodes.
PRO is the only series I didn't watch all the way through. I rationalize that by assuming I'm not the target audience...
I didn't hate it, it was just...meh. I watched maybe the first 15 episodes and then just sort of stopped.
I like Prodigy, I thought it was a very good version of what it was, but that's not entirely what I'm into. It's definitely aimed at a younger audience than most of what I watch, and I watch Batman and Star Wars cartoons so that's saying something.
Though I have that problem with all the shows to some degree. Discovery is too absurd to be taken seriously, Picard is too grimdark, Strange New Worlds has too much hijinx, and Lower Decks is an actual comedy. I just want one of them to be a serious science fiction show for adults with a reasonably light tone and the comedy coming from natural character interaction. The Doomsday Machine, Wrath of Khan, Undiscovered Country, Measure of a Man, Improbable Cause... can we have more of that please?
Though I have that problem with all the shows to some degree. Discovery is too absurd to be taken seriously, Picard is too grimdark, Strange New Worlds has too much hijinx, and Lower Decks is an actual comedy. I just want one of them to be a serious science fiction show for adults with a reasonably light tone and the comedy coming from natural character interaction. The Doomsday Machine, Wrath of Khan, Undiscovered Country, Measure of a Man, Improbable Cause... can we have more of that please?
I think this nails it pretty much.
I wouldn’t say I’m a detractor. The show has its merits.
I just don’t think, as you say, that it’s quite as good as its supporters say.
Ultimately it comes down to characters for me. Dal is annoying, Rok is just loud and the plummy ‘British’ Zero irks me.
Throwing Chakotay into the mix and expecting me to care doesn’t help and neither does a sanitized version of the EMH.
Or Wesley Crusher/The Outrageous Okona for that matter.
Come Season 2 and I felt like it became an exercise in VOY fanwank. I quite liked the Diviner but all of that just disappeared, only to be replaced by generic time-monsters.
1) I thought they hit it out of the park with Wes. They embraced all of the lunatic implications of his Traveler-ness.
2) I also loved that Okona was never in ANY way a good guy.
I really like Wil Wheaton as a person, but… eh. I’ll shut up now.
The show just wasn’t for me I guess. I’m glad that many like it though.
PRO is a solid second on my list of streaming Trek series, behind only SNW.
I am curious if we'll ever see more of it. Netflix's revenue stream seems to be booming lately. Perhaps that might give it new life. If they foot most or all of the bill, the risk-benefit ratio impact to Paramount may be considered "minimal" and greenlight it.
Wishful thinking anyways...
Wishful thinking anyways...
I think Netflix probably bagged the streaming rights to PRO for a decent price that made sense economically. I doubt, given it's continued lack of impact, that it would be viable for them to make more. We'd have heard something on the wind by now I think if the show had done the numbers.
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