Old Star Trek fans: don't you sometimes get happy just because there are new series?

[The Wormhole]

And yet, they eventually did listen to the outcry and gave us a movie.

That was actually Universal that gave us the movie, not Fox.

 

[Commander Troi]

Ah! I stand (or sit) corrected. Thank you.

 

[Ray Hardgrit]

With the exception of Ron Moore, all those writers/producers were already established and had successful shows under their belts before they were hired by their respective franchises. And RTD and Moffat were demonized by Doctor Who fandom during their times running the show.

Yes, hire successful, experienced and talented fans! And then get ready for their inevitable fall from grace, which may take 15 years (Filoni) or happen almost immediately (Chibnall) depending on a multitude of factors, including how good they are at the job, how burned out they are, and how tired people are of their idiosyncrasies. If they are actually talented creators (Moffat) many of those same fans will cheer for their eventual return and celebrate their new stories... the ones worth watching anyway.

Also when you have a Picard s3 situation, where fans suddenly like something that's doing the same things they complained about in earlier seasons or other shows, you gotta look at how it's doing them. Season 3 does have a season arc like Discovery, but it's much better at setting up satisfying resolutions that happen every 3-4 episodes. It doesn't do anything with its bridge crew, but that's fine as there's no focus on anyone except Sydney, who gets a bigger role over time as we start to like her. And so on.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Which one was Sydney again?

 

[fireproof78]

Which one was Sydney again?

Geordi's Daughter.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Geordi's Daughter.

You'll have to be more specific.

 

[fireproof78]

You'll have to be more specific.

If I recall correctly, the one who called Seven "Seven" and was impersonated by a Changeling and shot by Seven seven times.

 

[BillJ]

Which one was Sydney again?

Wasn't she the helmsman?

 

[Nerys Myk]

Wasn't she the helmsman?

That was Mavis Tellweather.

 

[Frontis]

They should always listen to the fans and I'm fairly sure they always have. They probably have all kinds of stats and charts and reports. The tricky part with any kind of market research or user feedback is figure out how to best use the data to improve the product. Fans can only make educated guesses at what will make them happy and their requests can be misinterpreted. Like if a fan wants "something new", does that mean they want to reboot the universe or new adventures that push the timeline forward instead of endless prequels? Do they want a new take on Kirk and Spock or new characters entirely? Does it even matter when the fan next to them wants the exact opposite?

And the loudest unhappy voices might not be worth listening to at all.

Personally I think that the best results come from hiring fans like Ronald D. Moore, Mike McMahan, Aaron Waltke etc. Fans like Steven Moffat and Russell T Davies on Doctor Who, Dave Filoni on Star Wars, and Beau DeMayo on X-Men 97. Actual talented writers and producers who already have a deep knowledge of what will resonate with viewers and what to steer clear of, and don't need to guess what people want.

Listening to fans?
They never asked me before making a new Trek.

 

[StarTrek1701]

Guess my days of not taking you seriously have reached a middle.

But seriously, Matalas did not "listen to the fans" and deliver the answer to their prayers simply because as everyone has noted ad nauseam, fandom is not a monolith. One fan's garbage is another fan's gold. But regardless, the whole idea that Matalas was in the trenches with the fans, enduring the crap Kurtzman was shoveling them and said "No More. I will give you the Trek you deserve. A Trek that will make the ghost of Gene Roddenberry smile upon us for a thousand years" is completely wrong. It was Paramount who wanted Picard's third season to be a TNG reunion, which they mandated Kurtzman to make. It was then Kurtzman who hired Matalas for that purpose. You want to thank anyone for Picard S3, thank Paramount. Kurtzman and Matalas were simply doing what they were told to do.

And make no mistake, even if the gods smile upon your sect of the fandom and Legacy gets greenlit with Matalas at the helm, it will not be the divine gift you all think it will. It's been said before that Picard S3 is not that different from the first two season or any of Disco's seasons, just everyone seems more accepting of it because it's the Big TNG Reunion and seeing Riker, Worf, Data, Geordi, Deanna and Crusher again on the bridge of the Enterprise D made everyone overlook the fact the season had the same flaws they complain about the other modern shows having, like a padded story arc that takes too long to go anywhere or a superfluous bridge crew. Legacy you're not going to have your childhood heroes on a recreation of their bridge from thirty years ago. You're going to have mostly new characters on a dimly lit set with the same kind of storyline and tropes you've seen everywhere else in the franchise since 2017 and you're all going to realize how empty Matalas's writing is when he's not distracting you with a reunion on Memory Lane.

With the exception of Ron Moore, all those writers/producers were already established and had successful shows under their belts before they were hired by their respective franchises. And RTD and Moffat were demonized by Doctor Who fandom during their times running the show.

Broheim I don't care if you take me seriously or not I am just saying what I have observed.
First two seasons of Picard were a ratings disaster and turned off a bunch of fans but yes you're completely right in pointing fandom isn't a monolith.
What is a monolith however are TV ratings and how many eyballs tuned in to the series and seasons.
And PIC S1/S2 were the worst, not just my personal opinion but most ppl I know said so themselves.

 

[fireproof78]

Listening to fans?
They never asked me before making a new Trek.

Me either.

Man, I miss all the meetings!

 

[The Wormhole]

First two seasons of Picard were a ratings disaster and turned off a bunch of fans but yes you're completely right in pointing fandom isn't a monolith.
What is a monolith however are TV ratings and how many eyballs tuned in to the series and seasons.
And PIC S1/S2 were the worst, not just my personal opinion but most ppl I know said so themselves.

You do realize your blessed Lord Terry was also responsible for Picard S2, and that S3 was filmed immediately after S2 finished filming, meaning they could not be influenced by the reaction S2 got when producing S3, right?

 

[HotRod]

First two seasons of Picard were a ratings disaster

The ratings for the first two seasons were never reported. Picard season 3 was the first season of any of the newer series to have their numbers made public.

 

[Richard S. Ta]

What is a monolith however are TV ratings and how many eyballs tuned in to the series and seasons.
And PIC S1/S2 were the worst, not just my personal opinion but most ppl I know said so themselves.

I’m afraid that ‘most ppl I know’ falls incredibly short in terms of being evidence.

Your personal anecdotes don’t mean anything as far as talking about wider trends or objective data.

Also, it seems you’re not very clear about how TV ratings work in a modern context.

 

[StarTrek1701]

I’m afraid that ‘most ppl I know’ falls incredibly short in terms of being evidence.

Your personal anecdotes don’t mean anything as far as talking about wider trends or objective data.

Also, it seems you’re not very clear about how TV ratings work in a modern context.

I am well aware how TV ratings work, that's why most Whatever+ shows get the chop after one or two seasons.

 

[Daedalus]

Judging by most comments here, it's PIC S2 that gets the most flack from most people. S1 fans vs S3 fans is closer to equal.

This is just from me eyeing the threads, I haven't conducted a detailed analysis or anything. Picard, in general, seems to get brought up a lot in non-Picard sections.

Beyond this place, it all depends on where you are looking.

 

[Dukhat]

Did the fans want a show set ten years before TOS but looks nothing like TOS? I don't think so.

Did the fans want a show about Pike on the Enterprise seven or so years before TOS? No, not until they brought him, Spock, and the NCC-1701 (that looks completely different from TOS) into DSC.

Did the fans want a show about Picard twenty years after we last saw him? Nope.

Did the fans want an animated comedy show about constant memberberries shoved in their faces and loud, fast-talking annoying characters? Nope.

Did the fans want an animated CGI show ostensibly for kids about a group of alien teens stealing a ship? Nope.

Did the fans want a show about Starfleet Academy in the year 3100? Nope.

Did the fans want a show movie about Section 31 and some bloodthirsty psycho on some sort of path to redemption? Nope.

Did the fans want a comedy show set on some hotel planet? Nope.


None of the people producing these shows asked the fans if that was what they wanted prior to making them. Nor did the fans give their input about what they wanted to see beforehand to the producers. Because there is no such thing as 'fan consensus,' and there is no such thing as 'we listen to the fans and give them what they want.' That's just a fantasy.

 

[Richard S. Ta]

I am well aware how TV ratings work, that's why most Whatever+ shows get the chop after one or two seasons.

Uh-huh. I'm gonna let you continue on your own little track. If you wanna say stuff that's wrong, then that's totally your business.

Because there is no such thing as 'fan consensus,' and there is no such thing as 'we listen to the fans and give them what they want.' That's just a fantasy.

Exactly.

 

[StarTrek1701]

Because there is no such thing as 'fan consensus,' and there is no such thing as 'we listen to the fans and give them what they want.' That's just a fantasy.

I don't know why people got short memories nowadays, it was just a few years back that Pike's appearance in DSC caused a fan demand for his own show.
And SNW's first ever announcement trailer was saying "You asked. We listened. It's happening."
Don't believe me?

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