Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 5x10 - "Life, Itself"

[Mr Awe]

But the more I think about it, especially with the Breen season arc that ultimately felt pointless in the end

The Breen became jokes by the end, being led by the petulant teen. Moll kind of faded a way there and her closing with Book was weak. Most of the stuff they built up throughout the season kind of faded away by the end.

Surprisingly, I enjoyed the story greatly. Great ST themes. But when you really think about the stuff they built up, a lot of it falls apart at the end.

 

[Elaise]

I'm terribly sorry, but to me, this finale was as pointless and meaningless as most of the series.
They had so many chances to let great ideas evolve, and approaches of what could have been, but it always ended up being disappointing.
So, there were always good ideas right from the inception of this show since 2017, but it always resulted in bad writing and being not boldly. It is the most superficial series in any Trek, and to this day I don't even know every name of the characters.
One thing that was consistent over all these years, was this artificially kind of causing emotions. Everything had to be soooooo emotionally. There is nothing wrong with being emotionally, but the way they did it seemed so wrong and out of place all the time.
I'm thankful it is over.

Yeah its always been a show for people who do not want to think about what they are watching. I wanted them dig deep but it just never happened.

 

[fireproof78]

Yeah its always been a show for people who do not want to think about what they are watching.

Offensive.

 

[Tuskin38]

The scout ship chasing Saru’s shuttle looked more like a classic breen ship

 

[Tiberius Jim]

That had to be the most anti-climactic ending to a "search for a hidden treasure/relic" story of all time. At least the Arc of the Covenant killed some Nazis before they unceremoniously stuffed it into a warehouse.

 

[Fateor]

That had to be the most anti-climactic ending to a "search for a hidden treasure/relic" story of all time. At least the Arc of the Covenant killed some Nazis before they unceremoniously stuffed it into a warehouse.

The Arc of the Covenant killing the Nazi's was used to establish that the Arc was actually dangerous.

A lesson the Discovery writers really should have taken.

Because this entire season they never actually established that the Progenitor technology was a threat.

 

[Tuskin38]

Yeah its always been a show for people who do not want to think about what they are watching. I wanted them dig deep but it just never happened.

Wrong.

 

[Yistaan]

Because this entire season they never actually established that the Progenitor technology was a threat.

Burnham was suffering from Janeway syndrome, infamously exhibited during Voyagers destruction of the caretakers array

 

[fireproof78]

That had to be the most anti-climactic ending to a "search for a hidden treasure/relic" story of all time. At least the Arc of the Covenant killed some Nazis before they unceremoniously stuffed it into a warehouse.

That's what Trek needs! More Nazi killing!
Kill them all and let someone else sort it out. That's the Star Trek way.

 

[Fateor]

Burnham was suffering from Janeway syndrome, infamously exhibited during Voyagers destruction of the caretakers array

No, they established the Array was a threat when they had it almost destroy Voyager from 70,000 light years away.

 

[eschaton]

That's what Trek needs! More Nazi killing!
Kill them all and let someone else sort it out. That's the Star Trek way.

One of my big issues with this season structurally is the Breen, despite seeming belligerent, never killed a single person (not even a background casualty on the Discovery crew roster), while the Disco crew slaughtered them by the hundreds.

Not that the Breen seemed "good" mind you. It's just it seemed like a massively unfair fight.

 

[Galaxy]

That's what Trek needs! More Nazi killing!
Kill them all and let someone else sort it out. That's the Star Trek way.

Well they killed a lot of Breen in this episode in those fighters, and the Breen are kinda naziisch so...

 

[Yistaan]

One of my big issues with this season structurally is the Breen, despite seeming belligerent, never killed a single person (not even a background casualty on the Discovery crew roster), while the Disco crew slaughtered them by the hundreds.

Not that the Breen seemed "good" mind you. It's just it seemed like a massively unfair fight.

Didn't they wipe out raynors home planet or something

 

[Tuskin38]

Leto (Burnham and Book's son), says his next mission is to Crepuscula, the planet we see Michael and Georgiou on in the series premier.

Also, according to TrekCore "The Starfleet officer who notifies Admiral Burnham that her shuttle is about to land
is voiced by Star Trek: Discovery showrunner Michelle Paradise."

Didn't they wipe out raynors home planet or something

They occupied it, they didn't wipe it out. Did kill his family and a lot of his people though.

 

[fireproof78]

One of my big issues with this season structurally is the Breen, despite seeming belligerent, never killed a single person (not even a background casualty on the Discovery crew roster), while the Disco crew slaughtered them by the hundreds.

Not that the Breen seemed "good" mind you. It's just it seemed like a massively unfair fight.

Yes,but they were bad.

 

[Tuskin38]

The Shuttle Burnham took to Discovery in the epilogue was 'UFP-47'. Coincidence?

 

[Deks]

The focus of my question is the "7" part. 7 is slightly above average for me. It's good, but not great.

In order for Discovery to actually be bad to me it would have to routinely score 3 to 5.
To illustrate my point:

This is actually accurate.
In Scotland Universities, if you score 70% or above, that's considered an 'A' really. It's actually EXTREMELY difficult to get over 75% (trust me, I know - even after meeting and going well beyond the brief's parameters, the best I could get was 78% - that was in just 1 module). I think only 2 students at my university (Glasgow Caledonian Uni) scored above 95% in a single module... and that was basically in the last decade.

If you graduate with a score of 70% or above, you'd graduate 1st in class.

And also yes, if governments and industries are 70%-75% competent and effective (and sticking to what they actually promise), heck things might actually be different for the better.

Disco on the other hand is a different matter - its subject to personal preference, not academic review as such - so its not as clear cut comparison here.

Back to the subject of the finale and S5 in general... how come the bad guys always have these massive ships at their disposal that are vastly superior to anything the UFP has?
I mean, with that kind of firepower, the Breen could have easily destroyed the HQ and all ships stationed there a few episodes before if they wanted to.

They have massive amount of firepower on their dreadnoughts and it seems that NONE of the ships in UFP in 32nd century are a match for them (each dreadnought would need multiple ships to stand a chance). Sure, Disco was able to employ some tactics against a dreadnought but the Breen ship recovered fairly quickly and released 40 'fighters' (which seemed comparable to standard starships in size rather than anything else).

If you told me the UFP's weapons were at least more formidable/advanced than the Breen's then things would make sense (you don't need huge size to get more powerful weapons in a universe ruled by technical efficiency)... so how is it the UFP manages to survive and continue against these kinds of odds?

I mean, its ridiculously easy pickings... the Breen wouldn't have even NEEDED the Progenitor tech for anything with what they have to conquer the Federation if they wanted.

The Scimitar back in the late 24th century at least on some level made sense, but that was only 1 ship... and no indication the Romulans made more of them after Insurrection (or that they had the ability because the Supernova happened somewhat shortly after the movie in question).

The ENT-J on the other hand was shown to be MASSIVE... but that's a 26th century vessel.

The only potential contender to the Dreadnought would be the HQ itself... and we don't know if even THAT is able to withstand its firepower.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Does any good lip-reader know what Owo was saying in her and Detmer's cameo?

Actually, I don't want to know. That'll let me keep believing she said "married".

"I know it was you Fredo"

 

[Tuskin38]

According to Michelle Paradise on The Ready Room, the idea to use the Progenitors had been on their minds since Season 4, they were going to come up some how during the 10-C arc, but they decided that was too much of a story to confine to a single story.

Also she claims they came up with using 'Progenitors' for their name, but I believe the novels used that name first? It's entirely possible they did come up with it without knowing about the novels using it. It's pretty descriptive word of what they are.

The Progenitor program, or whatever it was, said they went extinct billions of years ago, so that really cuts them off from also being the Preservers from TOS, as the Preservers were active pretty recently (reletively speaking) since they transplanted native americans from earth.

Some fans seemed to think that they were connected, and the old Star Trek Online Breen story arc connected them as well.

 

[Borgminister]

Well, there goes any brand new Star Trek for a half a year or more, and from that standpoint, I was severely bummed at he end of the finale. I thought the epilogue was much too Burnham centered, I mean she and Book had a son? Big whoop, a development which truly leads nowhere, as it looks right now. The device itself was pretty nicely rendered in special effects and concepts, and I was a bit surprised that the Progenitors were not the actual inventors of the thing. But it was probably the worst mcguffin of a plot given the "we've already got what it creates" kind of abandonment of the device at the end, even though it fits the Roddenberry view of theism, I guess. I liked the disappointment so effectively emoted by Stamets though. The action scenes were obligatory, but well done, but the resolution to the L'ak resurrection angle was also unsatisfying, although retrospectively predictable given how Spock was brought back a blank slate... the question is, why not still bring L'ak back and have him fall in love all over again? The triangle puzzle was simple, yet elegant IMO, and Trekkian once again, between the many, one. I enjoyed Saru's reminder to the female Breen leader that he was a predator and ready to fight if he had to. The saucer separation to banish the Breen to the Galactic Barrier was a nice touch, I will admit. Once again, the introduction of Burnham's son was completely unnecessary, and the short-shrift hug-fest at the end too short and shallow. Oh yes, and the throwaway aspect of Kovich being Daniels was momentarily surprising and interesting, but only prompted a shoulder shrug, since neither he nor Burnham's son will be seen again, so why? Anyway, I'll give it an A for effort and execution of the material available, but the episode only squeaks out a 9 from me for anticipatory nostalgic reasons. I'll miss the show, warts and all.