Spoilers Star Trek: Picard General Discussion Thread

[NCC-73515]

Yeah it did. Or at the very least it said they were not longer a threat.

Source?
One of the makers said in 2020 that the collective is still out there.

- If Picard was enduring regular assassination attempts, and Beverly suddenly disappeared without explanation, wouldn't he track her down, fearing that she'd been captured or killed? As a fellow Enterprise officer, and a known close friend of his, surely she'd be considered a potential target, too? He just let her go, like a present-day person who gets ghosted by a one-night stand?

- Why exactly did the Borg need Picard's brain? Didn't they already have his DNA on file? What made his brain lobes so much more special than those of the countless other human and humanoid drones they've had access to? (Was it his high midichlorian count?)

- If Shaw's such a by-the-book captain, why does he never once consult with his senior staff for ideas? Vadic gives them an hour to hand over Jack, which is an hour he could be coming up with a plan to attack or flee. Instead, he sits around, doing f***-all apart from making pissy remarks at Picard. How did this numbskull ever get promoted above lieutenant, junior grade?

- After disposing of all of one Changeling, why did Picard, Riker, and Beverly, to say nothing of Shaw, not quarantine any new arrivals to the Titan until a thorough medical examination was done? They let three people on board (Ro Laren and the other two officers), and two of them turned out to be Changelings, which got Ro killed. Great job, idiots!

- Why would Section 31 put a highly unstable mix of Data, the cognitively delayed B4, the psychotic Lore, and the synth supremacist Alton Soong in charge of their outpost's security? Not a great plan.

- Why did Picard and Beverly let Jack escape the Titan? They should have put force fields around him, then beamed him to the brig - like Troi said, there were security protocols prepared for exactly this sort of situation. And Jack's little voyage of self-discovery led directly to the deaths of thousands, probably, but the important thing is, he got to work through his issues himself?

respecting beverly's decision, not forcing things, precisely because he is a target.

is was made clear (if one pays attention) that his temporal lobe had a hidden receiver in it, which the changelings extracted to then put that genetic code into the transporters. (one of the story highlights since it's a new and creative idea)

it was obvious for anyone watching how affected he was from wolf 359 ptsd. he explained why he won't risk his whole ship to save a random criminal. if badmirals can become admirals, bad captains (see also tos, sfs, etc) can be captains.

same reason the borg in fc waited until the enterprise could follow them to open the vortex instead of going back in time long before any resistance shows up.

which of 31s plans were great? what makes you think this wasn't soong's idea and he convinced them, especially since 31 trusted another AI before?

he was held by security and confined to that room, following those protocols. no one "let" him escape willingly. do you mean he was left alone for that year to work through his issues? that was not even implied in the show.

 

[Tuskin38]

Source

The Borg were described as crippled in Season 1

 

[The Wormhole]

As for the sunglasses, she's actually part Reman.

Chabon explained the sunglasses as an intimidation tactic.

 

[NCC-73515]

The Borg were described as crippled in Season 1

In contrast to the original claim:
the Borg were gone, and just a marginalized group of refugees

 

[Gaith]

is was made clear (if one pays attention) that his temporal lobe had a hidden receiver in it, which the changelings extracted to then put that genetic code into the transporters. (one of the story highlights since it's a new and creative idea)

If it can be coded as genes, why weren't those genes stored in the Borg database?

There comes a point at which an explanation is so stupid and arbitrary that it's basically the same as no explanation.

 

[NCC-73515]

If it can be coded as genes, why weren't those genes stored in the Borg database?

There comes a point at which an explanation is so stupid and arbitrary that it's basically the same as no explanation.

name some of your favorite episodes or movies that you do not find awful, full of holes, with no idiots, with only great plans, no mind-boggling stupid totality, and devoid of melodrama juice. I'm curious if they can really not be picked apart the same way, if there even are any, and I'd like to try.

(btw: in bobw, his DNA was being rewritten, and the hive lost him before it was done. the endgame virus also destroyed things, part of which could be that information. easy.)

 

[flandry84]

Yeah,remember that Starfleet is an organisation that has fought a devastating war against a race of shapeshifters who can literally assume the form of anything they want.Yet time and again we see the upper echelons of Starfleet infiltrated by moles and sleeper agents.
Burger King seems to have better employee vetting systems.
This infiltrator trope drops me right out of the show every time.

 

[fireproof78]

If it can be coded as genes, why weren't those genes stored in the Borg database?

There comes a point at which an explanation is so stupid and arbitrary that it's basically the same as no explanation.

But, if you like it there is always a justification.

 

[Campe]

But, if you like it there is always a justification.

And that’s 100% fair. We tend to overlook the flaws in the things that we enjoy. It doesn’t mean the flaws aren’t there. I acknowledge that there are many flaws in things I love. I also believe that there are opinions that some flaws are overly inflated because it’s not what they want. I don’t want to mention specific things because damn, if they haven’t been litigated a billion times on the internet and the lines are deeply drawn there.

 

[fireproof78]

And that’s 100% fair. We tend to overlook the flaws in the things that we enjoy. It doesn’t mean the flaws aren’t there. I acknowledge that there are many flaws in things I love. I also believe that there are opinions that some flaws are overly inflated because it’s not what they want. I don’t want to mention specific things because damn, if they haven’t been litigated a billion times on the internet and the lines are deeply drawn there.

No kidding, but I'm also not going to call something flawless just because it's moderately entertaining.

 

[Gaith]

But, if you like it there is always a justification.

Nope. I really like Generations, but there's no justification for the sunlight on Veridian III disappearing moments after Soran's rocket reaches the star. I love T2, but there's no justification for it walking menacingly after John Connor in the mall, rather than running full-tilt at him the moment he's in view. I love ESB, but Darth Vader should be able to yank the lightsaber out of Luke's hand, instantly disarming him. I love Avengers: Endgame, but the scarcity of Pym particles shouldn't be a problem, because Scott should be able to travel back to a time they were abundant, and retrieve as many as they liked. Etc.

One can always poke holes in stories where tech that's basically magic is commonplace. Two questions, therefore, take precedence: one, does the core story pass a basic sniff test, and two, are the characters generally well-written? As I've argued above, the answer to the latter question is no.

(btw: in bobw, his DNA was being rewritten, and the hive lost him before it was done. the endgame virus also destroyed things, part of which could be that information. easy.)

So of all the billions of Borg drones throughout history, the rewriting of Picard's DNA that continued when he got back to the D contained resulted in a particular development that had never occurred before, which required the present-day Borg to retrieve his body.

No. That doesn't pass a basic sniff test.

I never said one couldn't head-canon answers to these questions. I'm saying that all these answers, however, are really dumb.

 

[Campe]

No kidding, but I'm also not going to call something flawless just because it's moderately entertaining.

Oh absolutely. Enjoying something and finding something perfect are two very different things. I’ve yet to encounter a lot of perfection in entertainment. The percentage for Star Trek is far less for finding perfection than most fiction. I still love it.

 

[fireproof78]

One can always poke holes in stories where tech that's basically magic is commonplace. Two questions, therefore, take precedence: one, does the core story pass a basic sniff test, and two, are the characters generally well-written? As I've argued above, the answer to the latter question is no.

I'm not disagreeing.

Oh absolutely. Enjoying something and finding something perfect are two very different things. I’ve yet to encounter a lot of perfection in entertainment. The percentage for Star Trek is far less for finding perfection than most fiction. I still love it.

Agreed 100% and that's why I find the Season 3 as a 10 hard to swallow. It's fine and dandy to like it but I am appreciating the analysis as well.

 

[Firebird]

Oh absolutely. Enjoying something and finding something perfect are two very different things. I’ve yet to encounter a lot of perfection in entertainment. The percentage for Star Trek is far less for finding perfection than most fiction. I still love it.

I've finally realized that it's the flaws that make me appreciate the films and TV I love even more. If something is perfect, where's the fun in that?

 

[mattman8907]

I would love to know if they were able to rebuild the utopia pantila shipyards after the attack on mars cause if not how were they able to build all those ships post the attack?

 

[fireproof78]

Other shipyards, like Luna, or other bases.

Utopia Planitia being the only shipyard is absurdity.

 

[Tuskin38]

yeah, Starfleet has more than one Shipyard,

https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Federation_shipyards

I'm guessing (based off how they talk about it), Utopia Planitia was their primary one.

 

[Quantum21]

I don’t see Shaw as a coward.
I do see him as one of those people who bitch and grumble constantly about “management” but never,ever do anything other than bitch and grumble.
Shaw went about his career as a “safe pair of hands” never rocking the boat.Maybe that does qualify as a certain kind of cowardice but I dunno.

He's not a coward he has been put into command in a mentally compromised state. He is not fit for command. Anyone this unhealed after 30 years, post-trauma should have been flagged and sidelined for counseling.

He almost allowed a young man to be captured against Starfleet rules to render aid. It's borderline criminal.

Shaw is a poorly conceived, badly planned character with some entertaining dialogue and a good performance that lift it into "fan favorite" territory.

 

[flandry84]

If...if Legacy were to go to series...(unlikely).
I would love to see Shaw as the Emergency Engineering Hologram.

Or a snarky talk-show like sideman on the bridge.

 

[NCC-73515]

So of all the billions of Borg drones throughout history, the rewriting of Picard's DNA that continued when he got back to the D contained resulted in a particular development that had never occurred before, which required the present-day Borg to retrieve his body.

No. That doesn't pass a basic sniff test.

I never said one couldn't head-canon answers to these questions. I'm saying that all these answers, however, are really dumb.

maybe familiarize yourself with the backstory again: locutus was unique. see BoBW. see FC. the collective was crippled between locutus leaving the hive and PIC S3. see VOY endgame.
and why would anyone judge a 10 episode season on a single exchange that lasted a few seconds, doesn't contradict anything, and can be dismissed if your personal sniffing test says it's dumb?
if you take out the element that his corpse was stolen, does the season somehow become much better for you?