Enterprise insights

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

Though I've not watched the show, I do contribute to MA using transcripts as references.

Before now, I've noticed that some phrases (non-technobabble) appear in Trek for the first time in Voyager, and multiple times at that, indicating perhaps a writer's commonly used words.

While adding the term "loudmouth" to MA, I noticed that both references were in relation to an incident that happened to Phlox - namely, being accosted by a human in a bar for being an alien - and both times, two different characters refer to the antagonist as a "loudmouth" in a bar. Both episodes being written by Sussman, I guess he just liked that turn of phrase he came up with.

What other little details did you realize about ENT later?

 

[Michael]

Unfortunately I can’t seem to recall a specific example of this, but I remember it being obvious that Enterprise was being written by the exact same group of writers that had previously worked on Voyager. You could especially notice it in the way technobabble was worded (just replace 24th century tech words with 22nd century tech words), but also the way plots were built and getting resolved. I think they really had some kind of formula that they continued from one show to the next.

Although I do think they were able to shake it up in season three and try a new approach. Season three is when the story quality peaked in my view. But in terms of convincing viewers to tune in it seemed to be too little too late.

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

but also the way plots were built and getting resolved.

How so?

 

[Dukhat]

How so?

A ship wandering aimlessly through space, meeting aliens, and then pissing said aliens off?

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

Could it have been amplified by the fact that, like Voyager, there were more first/early contacts depicted than in DS9 or TNG?

 

[Michael]

How so?

Difficult to explain. I’d have to rewatch the show to give a better explanation of what I mean (which I might do at some point soon-ish), but just in general I was referring to the way the authors crafted the stories on both (late) Voyager and then (early) Enterprise.

Starting with the similar ways in which our protagonists were propelled into stories, how plot points would unfurl, come to a climax and then resolve at the end. But also particular kinds of scenes, like two characters walking down the corridor bantering in a specific way while giving an info dump on the storie that’s about to start, the Captain character giving a subordinate character a stern talking-to in the ready room, action scenes on the bridge with one character suddenly figuring out how to [tech] the [tech] with the [tech] to defeat the attacker … Stuff like that.

No single of these aspects in isolation is particularly unique to these shows and you will find them all in other Trek productions or any show, really. But I’m talking about the combination of all things, what I want to call “the formula”, which was very similar on both shows, which isn’t really surprising, since it was the same people in the writers room.

 

[at Quark's]

A ship wandering aimlessly through space, meeting aliens, and then pissing said aliens off?

Space. The final frontier. These are the voyages of the starship Voyager/Enterprise NX-01 (*). Its continuing mission: to wander aimlessly through space, exploring the random strange new world of the week, pissing off God knows how many new alien races and civilizations in the process; and then to hightail it out of there, trying to reach the safety of home - or at least known space.

(*) Please select the one applicable.

Yeah, I suppose that intro might have worked for both series alike. Perhaps even for TNG and TOS as well.

 

[Farscape One]

Unfortunately I can’t seem to recall a specific example of this, but I remember it being obvious that Enterprise was being written by the exact same group of writers that had previously worked on Voyager. You could especially notice it in the way technobabble was worded (just replace 24th century tech words with 22nd century tech words), but also the way plots were built and getting resolved. I think they really had some kind of formula that they continued from one show to the next.

Although I do think they were able to shake it up in season three and try a new approach. Season three is when the story quality peaked in my view. But in terms of convincing viewers to tune in it seemed to be too little too late.

Quite a lot of ENT's first season writers never wrote for the franchise before... Chris Black, Antoinette Stella, Tim Finch, Stephen Beck, Maria and Andre Jacquemetton, and Fred Dekker. (And of these new writers, none returned for season 2 except Chris Black.)

Only Berman, Braga, Mike Sussman, Phyllis Strong, and Andre Bormanis came over from VOY.

But you are right in that the technobabble and the formula, as you call it, was simply moved from VOY to ENT.

 

[Michael]

Quite a lot of ENT's first season writers never wrote for the franchise before... Chris Black, Antoinette Stella, Tim Finch, Stephen Beck, Maria and Andre Jacquemetton, and Fred Dekker. (And of these new writers, none returned for season 2 except Chris Black.)

Only Berman, Braga, Mike Sussman, Phyllis Strong, and Andre Bormanis came over from VOY.

But you are right in that the technobabble and the formula, as you call it, was simply moved from VOY to ENT.

Genuinely, thanks for fact checking me on this! I shouldn’t have just assumed. I guess if anything this underlines the strong influence of the head writers on the overall tone of the show.

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

I think I do recall reading terms that existed on both shows but nowhere else.

 

[aquova]

Unfortunately I can’t seem to recall a specific example of this, but I remember it being obvious that Enterprise was being written by the exact same group of writers that had previously worked on Voyager.

Tom Paris and Trip both being really into crappy 1950s B-movies always felt like some self insert. Someone on that writing staff was way, way into that sort of stuff.

 

[evilchumlee]

Tom Paris and Trip both being really into crappy 1950s B-movies always felt like some self insert. Someone on that writing staff was way, way into that sort of stuff.

I'm sure a part of that is tied to why the tend to listen to classical music alot in Trek in general... they can use it freely/cheaply over other things. A 1950's B-movie probably doesn't much in the way of royalties to pay out. If they used something more recent... that's money. Meanwhile using a Public Domain classical composition over a Rolling Stones recording... money.

ENT remains as like, probably a textbook example to studio executives to... stay away from things and let the creatives handle it? A VAST majority of ENT's issues seem to stem from some executive stepping in and demanding x thing, even though x thing was stupid and the creative staff all knew it.

That extends to much of the "Just make it TNG/VOY again" stuff. The writers didn't REALLY want them to use phasers and photon torpedoes. Executives did, because... I don't know, that's Star Trek? or something. Drexler didn't want to make NX-01 an Akira, Executives did. He did what he could with it and made it an interesting enough design, but it could/should have been something totally different.

ENT was caught in a crossfire to some extent though. Some people were like, "it's too much like other Star Trek!", others were like "It's not enough like other Star Trek!" and it kinda sorta tried to do both? In retrospect, after we got Discovery... my enjoyment of ENT has skyrocketed. I may have, back then, thought "I'd like to see something different." Then we got something... different. Now... "Nope. Give me the damn formula."

 

[fireproof78]

But you are right in that the technobabble and the formula, as you call it, was simply moved from VOY to ENT.

Yup, but unfortunately, with even less warmth in the cast. You had people who really didn't feel like they wanted to be out there.

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

A VAST majority of ENT's issues seem to stem from some executive stepping in and demanding x thing, even though x thing was stupid and the creative staff all knew it.

Like the early appearances of Ferengi and Borg?

 

[HotRod]

Like the early appearances of Ferengi and Borg?

I'll back up that Borg episode. It was actually good and made complete sense.

 

[aquova]

I'll back up that Borg episode. It was actually good and made complete sense.

I agree. Yeah, it was a bit contrived, but it completed the time loop in an interesting way.

 

[Takeru]

I'll back up that Borg episode. It was actually good and made complete sense.

Except for the part where Phlox found a cure for assimilation. Had they not done that and declared that everyone assimilated is lost and all they can do is blow them up the episode would have been great.

 

[evilchumlee]

Like the early appearances of Ferengi and Borg?

I didn't mind either of those.

The Borg episode was actually pretty good, and was a nice tie in to First Contact.

The Ferengi episode was fine too, and really didn't cause any continuity problems. Data had information on the Ferengi in "The Last Outpost", he just didn't have much. The information he DID have... pretty much aligned with the experiences of NX-01.

But... yes... those are examples, they're just examples that worked better than others. the inherent prequel problem. "Make a prequel to tug on nostalgia and stuff. But... also just keep making the thing we were making."

 

[valkyrie013]

Voyager and Enterprise, as a concept were excellent, the execution was mostly terrible.

 

[fireproof78]

Like the early appearances of Ferengi and Borg?

That was unfortunate inclusion of species I didn't think was needed.

But, I think more it was a lack of really warm characters and good chemistry of exploration rather than feeling like people didn't want to be on the ship.