Spoilers Does it feel to anyone else that SNW is cynically mining Trek's past glories?

[tafkats]

TOS copied itself more than SNW copies other series.

An incomprehensibly powerful alien waylays the ship and starts fucking with the crew (a trope Roddenberry loved so much that he insisted on resurrecting it for the TNG pilot) ... a population is in thrall to a powerful computer ... the crew discovers a mysteriously earthlike civilization where something has gone horribly wrong ... the hero logics a computer into killing itself.

Some of those stories weren't quite as common as pop culture makes them out to be, but still, TOS did a striking amount of plot-recycling when you consider there were only 79 episodes total.

 

[Noname Given]

For that matter, a lot of TOS episodes were pastiches of popular culture. "Balance of Terror" was a pastiche of the 1957 film The Enemy Below. "The Enemy Within" is a pastiche of Strange Case of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. "The Conscience of the King" wears its Shakespearean influences on its sleeve -- it's a sci-fi pastiche of Hamlet. "Court Martial" is a pastiche of every naval trial story ever told. "A Piece of the Action" is a pastiche of 1930s gangster films. "The Cage" is a pastiche of Forbidden Planet, which is itself a pastiche of The Tempest. "Elaan of Troyius" is a mash-up of The Taming of the Shrew and Pygmalion/My Fair Lady.

And The Corbomite Manuver was influenced by and has elements taken from the film, The Bedford Incident.

 

[Rahul]

TOS copied itself more than SNW copies other series.

An incomprehensibly powerful alien waylays the ship and starts fucking with the crew (a trope Roddenberry loved so much that he insisted on resurrecting it for the TNG pilot) ... a population is in thrall to a powerful computer ... the crew discovers a mysteriously earthlike civilization where something has gone horribly wrong ... the hero logics a computer into killing itself.

Some of those stories weren't quite as common as pop culture makes them out to be, but still, TOS did a striking amount of plot-recycling when you consider there were only 79 episodes total.

There's a difference between having recurring themes (Computers taking over society, perfect illusions, and suffering for the entertaining of higher beings were recurring ideas on TOS) - and straight up "re-doing" the same plot (TOS did that, too). Honourable mention also to TOS/TNGs "Naked now/time".

I cut the old shows some slack, because doing 25 stories a year is pretty difficult, and shows weren't rewatched at home back then. SNW is now at 13 episodes in total, and has considerable more "retreating of known ground". Again, I'm grateful that SNW also usually tries to find a good, new spin on old things. And it's so much better than stretching only plot over an entire season.

Guess what I'm saying is I want more than 10 episodes per season. Around 15-20 would be nice.

 

[Noname Given]

I cut the old shows some slack, because doing 25 stories a year is pretty difficult, and shows weren't rewatched at home back then.

Yes because there were no VCRs in 1987 (when TNG was doing 26 eps. a season, and every 3rd one was Data related...and nobody (including me), recorded them...oh, wait...

 

[herofhyrule]

Plus, they had reruns back then.

 

[cooleddie74]

Lots of them.

 

[Voodoowoman2]

I don't mind connection but so far we have.
Pelia-Another Guinan or Q
La'an another tormented tough girl" Saavik, Tasha Yar
Ortegas-Helmsperson, bridge wisecracker=Chekov
A lot of the things they do seem very tongue in cheek, like making sure they get as many easter eggs as they can. Time for creativity writing staff.

 

[Oddish]

Remember that SNW was created because it was revealed that people wanted a return to old-school Trek, a la TOS and TNG. Episodic, tongue in cheek, and focused on beloved characters. So if it returns to form in some areas, that should be expected and appreciated.

 

[Nerys Myk]

A lot of the things they do seem very tongue in cheek, like making sure they get as many easter eggs as they can. Time for creativity writing staff.

But enough about Picard Season 3

 

[Nerys Myk]

La'an another tormented tough girl" Saavik, Tasha Yar

Saavik????

 

[JonnyQuest037]

If anything a part of me appreciated the irony of Spock being the first one to steal the Enterprise, only for his shipmates to do the same in twenty-odd years, but for him.

I personally don't think we needed that in the S2 premiere of SNW, as "The Menagerie" already existed. But YMMV.

As early as "The Menagerie, Part I" in 1967 Trek was mining its past. And it had the cojones to mine a past that nobody outside NBC executives had yet seen!

Well, that wasn't so much about TOS mining its past as it was trying to stay under budget and meet their airdates. Using the original pilot footage did both. Hell, Gilligan's Island did the same thing.

Nah, that would be Picard season 3. It completely relied on TNG’s past glories as nostalgia bait.

YUP. I honestly don't feel there was much to PIC S3 besides the fan service. I liked bits of it, but overall it got tiresome.

 

[fireproof78]

Time for creativity writing staff.

No. That's not desired. Safe, familiar, banking towards TOS and its touchstones.

 

[MikHutch]

I don't mind connection but so far we have.
Pelia-Another Guinan or Q
La'an another tormented tough girl" Saavik, Tasha Yar
Ortegas-Helmsperson, bridge wisecracker=Chekov
A lot of the things they do seem very tongue in cheek, like making sure they get as many easter eggs as they can. Time for creativity writing staff.

Those are some real reaches. Chekhov always came off more goofy to me in TOS. Saavik wasn't though and Yar basically did nothing (which is why the actress left)

Pelia does seem similar to an El Aurian so they coudlve just made her into one

 

[of-bajor]

Rehashing old episodes is a core part of Trek. It seems like some people forget that TNG's second episode was just the Naked Time but hornier.

 

[cooleddie74]

Hell, the first two seasons of ENT have often been called reheated leftovers of VOY, DS9 and TNG episodes and...that's not totally incorrect. Even episodes during the Xindi Arc like "E2" were just "Children of Time(DS9)" but set over 200 years earlier.

 

[MikHutch]

Yeah but people just like bashing new stuff. Same with every fandom nowadays sadly.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Yeah but people just like bashing new stuff. Same with every fandom nowadays sadly.

I'm sure someone in Ancient Greece read Homer's account of the Trojan War and thought some earlier version was better.

 

[cooleddie74]

Things were better before the Archimedean Screw. The hipsters knew it.

 

[MikHutch]

I'm sure someone in Ancient Greece read Homer's account of the Trojan War and thought some earlier version was better.

Things were better before the Archimedean Screw. The hipsters knew it.

Lol. I get annoyed wirh unnecessary change as much as anyone but I didn't expect the ST fandom to be so nostalgia centric

 

[JonnyQuest037]

Lol. I get annoyed with unnecessary change as much as anyone but I didn't expect the ST fandom to be so nostalgia centric

Why wouldn't we be? ST fandom started from fans watching the same 79 episodes over and over and over again. Star Trek is about the comfort of the familiar as much as it is about boldly going where no one has gone before.