PIC Season 3 compared to other Late Sequels

[Lord Garth]

See, that's funny to me. It's amazing the variety of opinions on this season from all corners of the fandom. I dunno where this ranks for me, but if I were to really give it thought, I can't imagine it would even crack the top 10. I mean, without ranking them..... in no particular order...
TOS seasons 1-2
SNW season 1
TNG seasons 3-5
DS9 seasons 5-6
VOY season 4
ENT seasons 3-4
PRO season 1
LD seasons 1-3
DIS seasons 1-2

I'd put them all above Picard S3
But that's me.

My favorite seasons and films are:

TOS (yes, even Season 3)
TOS Movies (2-4 and 6)
TNG Seasons 3-4
DS9 Seasons 4-7
VOY Season 4
FC
DSC (especially Seasons 1 and 4)
PRO
PIC Seasons 1 and 3

I'm very impressed with TMP's production values and I love the soundtrack, but that's not enough by itself to make it a favorite. It's still hard to watch it in one sitting.

 

[TRON JA307020]

Divisive =\= bad. I don't want consensus in my fandom.

I'm sure you'll get exactly what you want. And I hope you enjoy it.

And to be clear, the value I see in the ST is that things moved. This feels very much a repeat. That doesn't feel respectful at all. It feels...stuck. It feels like the only way for these characters to have value is for them to be exactly in the same positions as they were 25 years ago. And that's not healthy to me.

So healthy would have been what?

 

[fireproof78]

So healthy would have been what?

Acknowledgement of the new, moving past old things and recognizing the temporary nature of the relationship.

 

[Ovation]

STD betrayed what Star Trek is all about, and abused canon by changing things that did not need changing.

No.

Yes.

Ironic you show that image in trying to prove the point you are making. Luke was misunderstood and badly written in that debacle.

No.

Nope. He changed over 30 years, just like real people do.

Yes.

Strange then that Mark Hamill disagreed with nearly everything that was written for Luke Skywalker in that movie, but still was a professional and did his job.

As he should (be professional).

Mark Hamill is allowed to have an opinion.

Yes.

The point is he knows Luke better than anyone else. And he realized the writing sucked and fans would revolt. And they did.

All of them? No.

He just didn't understand it during filming. He did change it mind later after watching the finished film.

Why yes, he did at that. Much easier to appreciate something complete than piecemeal.

Yes you are correct on this, but during filming he said it was not Luke.

And? Which opinion are we supposed to give most weight, an early one based on incomplete knowledge and experience, or a later, revised one based on the completed work? (Hint: almost always the latter—positive or negative.)

No one told me. However, I did attend the protests against Lucas for raping childhoods and messing up Anakin's character.

You too? Sorry I missed you.

Luke's arc in TLJ is one of the few things carried over from Lucas' sequel ideas fwiw.
It's also totally in character, makes sense with how it was set up in 7 and pays off with him becoming the mythic hero at the end everyone wanted to see, inspiring the galaxy.

I have my issues with the sequel films (i think 7 and 9 are pretty awful) but Luke's arc was one of the best parts and Hamill killed it acting wise!

He certainly did. Among his finest work.

 

[TRON JA307020]

Q

Acknowledgement of the new, moving past old things and recognizing the temporary nature of the relationship.

So like Star Wars. Make the older characters look like fools or failures and have the young characters be pretty flawless and get things done. Basically older aged characters are useless and have no value and are only there to show how great the new characters are. No thanks. Been there done that. I'll take the TNGs experience over youth anyday. Most have been missing from starfleet for years. It's their time to shine once again just as the D is back. I'm sorry you don't like it but it is what it is and its more popular than the first 2 terrible seasons.

 

[Tuskin38]

So like Star Wars. Make the older characters look like fools or failures and have the young characters be pretty flawless and get things done. Basically older aged characters are useless and have no value and are only there to show how great the new characters are.

Luke helped save the day in TLJ. Han and Leia were never shown to be useless in the sequels, neither was R2D2, Chewbacca, or C-3PO, well no more unless than normal for C-3PO, and he played an important part in TROS. Lando was useful in TROS.

 

[fireproof78]

Make the older characters look like fools or failures and have the young characters be pretty flawless and get things done.

Nope. Not what I said at all.

I'm sorry you don't like it but it is what it is and its more popular than the first 2 terrible seasons.

Why should I care about what's popular?

 

[Ronin'sCreamyCandle]

Nope. Not what I said at all.

Why should I care about what's popular?

I took it the way Pubert said as well.. can you clarify what you said.

 

[gvn2fly]

See, that's funny to me. It's amazing the variety of opinions on this season from all corners of the fandom. I dunno where this ranks for me, but if I were to really give it thought, I can't imagine it would even crack the top 10. I mean, without ranking them..... in no particular order...
TOS seasons 1-2
SNW season 1
TNG seasons 3-5
DS9 seasons 5-6
VOY season 4
ENT seasons 3-4
PRO season 1
LD seasons 1-3
DIS seasons 1-2

I'd put them all above Picard S3
But that's me.

Agree with you on the TOS, TNG, DS9 seasons (and maybe even throw in season 7), and VOY S4 and mayyyyybe SNW season 1 but I need to think about it. I feel like that and Prodigy are stronger for me because they didn't fall apart towards the end of the seasons for me like the other shows did. LD didn't either but since it's more of a comedy I just can't compare it even though I really enjoyed it.

 

[TRON JA307020]

Luke helped save the day in TLJ. Han and Leia were never shown to be useless in the sequels, neither was R2D2, Chewbacca, or C-3PO, well no more unless than normal for C-3PO, and he played an important part in TROS. Lando was useful in TROS.

Yeah he saved the day all right. There were about 20 people out of 450 left by the time Luke decided to intervene. Rey begged him to come back and help and he wouldn't.

 

[fireproof78]

I took it the way Pubert said as well.. can you clarify what you said.

Sure, point by point:

Acknowledgement of the new, moving past old things and recognizing the temporary nature of the relationship.

Acknowledgement of the new-these characters are not in the same place as they were 30 years ago. Acknowledge that. Show they changed, show that they have grown and that their new experiences will support their current adventure.
Moving past the old-"Captain Picard" oh ha, ha it's a demotion. No, it's not. It's a position. Acknowledge that it's been some time and you are not use to this old role.
Recognizing the temporary nature-"We're the crew of the Enterprise." Really? So afterwards you'll all stay together? Maybe yes, maybe no, but at least acknowledge that for this one time, temporarily, you are. Acknowledge changes, and how your new strengths can support you as you utilize past experiences for success.

And before anyone says "Well, they did with..." they were. Until the bridge scene. Then it felt like "We're just the Enterprise crew and nothing has changed." That's not healthy to me.

Mileage will vary.

Luke helped save the day in TLJ. Han and Leia were never shown to be useless in the sequels, neither was R2D2, Chewbacca, or C-3PO, well no more unless than normal for C-3PO, and he played an important part in TROS. Lando was useful in TROS.

Yup. The characters just happened to be in different stages of life, rather than in the old and familiar. It happens.

 

[The Old Mixer]

Star Wars | The Trek BBS
[cue opening fanfare]

 

[Elias Vaughn]

It's obviously no iCarly sequel.

 

[Greg Cox]

Not on par with a Twin Peaks: The Return or Top Gun Maverick or Mad Max Fury Road or a Creed (the peak examples of legacy sequels). .

PSYCHO II (released in 1983, twenty-three years after the original 1960 movie) is another contender.

 

[Cortez]

I remember reading a headline just before this season of Picard started, a headline that stated something along the lines of this season being to Star Trek what The Rise of Skywalker had been to Star Wars. Makes alot of sense now.

Anyway, to the topic on hand, agree with many of the films already commented on. Few random ones..... only six years between them but have to mention Evil Dead 2, Before Sunset (I love that trilogy) and actually Rambo 2008 or 2009 (absolute carnage).

 

[dinzy]

Trek was more important to me growing up than Star Wars, but Star Wars was pretty big. So far Pic S3 is the best late sequel because it gave all the characters something good to do and was respectful of that.

I liked the Star Wars Sequels until the last one and that kind of ruined the whole thing. I still haven't watched it again. The thing that pissed me off is that it was not really consistent with the film that preceded it. The sequel movie with Rey might fix it. I just thought that showing the kid with force powers at the end of TLJ was a hopeful ending that suggested a better path for the final movie. If they have Rey training some of those kids not to be douchebag dogmatic Jedis but badass Jedis then maybe it can undo some of the damage.

Is Trials and Tribulations a late sequel? I still love that episode.

 

[voyager1]

If PIC Season 3 is really a super-long TNG Movie, then the question must be asked: How do you think it's fared as a Late Sequel, compared to late sequels in other franchises?

I'm going to define a "late sequel" as a sequel that came out 15 years or more after the previous sequel.

I have always been a Star Trek fan, I like Star Wars, BSG, SG, Expanse. But I am a Trekkie first. I was so excited about Discovery when it was announced. I waited till it completely broadcast and then watched. Liked it. But it has some issues. When Picard was announced I was a little worried because Stewart is probably not the best creative for developing the Picard character. Discovery Season 2 dropped (a notch down) and then Picard Season 1 . I loved that first ep, then the second was okay, by the third it was meh. By the end of season 1 I was
just embarrassed for the franchise. Seriously flowers in space? Romulan swordsmen
like Lord Of The Rings. Then we got season 2. I didn’t think it could be worse, but well they somehow managed it. During that time Disney was knocking it out of the park with Mandelorian and then we got that masterpiece (IMHO) Obi-Wan. So when season 3 teasers starting showing up last year, I was not that interested. I just wasn’t ready. It looked kind of cool, but Paramount had tricked me before. Then we got this Season of Picard. It is truly awesome. I was emotional seeing the ole D make that turn out of the museum. And the soundtrack. Awesome. Where was this 2 years ago. I know the answer, there is no way Stewart would have done this show back then.

Just for disclosure. I love SNW. I thought season 3 of Disco was the dumbest thing. Season 4 was actually pretty good. I haven’t gotten into Lower Decks. I haven’t tried Prodigy. I also think The Force Awakens was incredible movie, the ones after it meh.

 

[God's Starship]

PSYCHO II (released in 1983, twenty-three years after the original 1960 movie) is another contender.

Oooh good pick, one of those sequels that's genuinely great and no one will believe you when you tell them ha.