Spoilers Star Trek: Picard 3x01 - "The Next Generation"

[cooleddie74]

A Frontier Day trinket replica of the TOS Enterprise alongside too many TNG Enterprises. Customers clearly don't want "the fat one."

 

[Commander K]

At this point William Riker pretty much IS Jonathan Frakes playing himself in a way similar to how later Roger Moore 007 movies were just Roger playing himself.

Expecting him to turn to the camera and say...."is it fact or fiction?"

 

[Sci]

I've found the idea of hating victims of the Borg somewhat forced at times, though I do understand humans are irrational beings especially when dealing with traumatic loss. And maybe it's the same thing, just less directly stated, but I always thought, were I in the situation of a survivor of Locutus/Wolf 359, it wouldn't be Picard having been enslaved and forced to murder his comrades that would make me hate him. It would be that he survived, while thousands of others died. That somehow, despite the fact that anyone else would have marked Picard as basically dead when he was assimilated, that Enterprise and its crew, and its then-captain, Riker, somehow managed to destroy that ship and rescue Picard, and yet my loved one(s) couldn't be saved. Not that that would be rational either, but less hating someone for being a fellow victim, but whose special status exempted them from so many others' fate.

I mean, just look at the way people treat refugees from wars and natural disasters. Look at the way we treat rape victims. It is extremely, extremely common for victims of brutality and oppression to be "Other"-ized and subjected to further oppression.

It was better introduced through Sisko because at least you saw him lose his wife and presumably many friends on the Saratoga. Unless there's some Instagram post or comic or something, I have no idea why Shaw is a jackass.

Like, even if you hate the Picard, he literally just saved the Galaxy again working with the Borg in S2... so what the hell?

Sure, but on the other hand the guy shows up unannounced on your ship, is clearly lying to you and trying to manipulate you into violating your orders, and he won't even tell you what he's up to. What the hell?

If I heard one more character use the word "hubris" with the F word attached i was going to tear my hair out. Lol

Unknown. This comes from either Terry Matalas' first interview with Robert Meyer Burnett or the Inglorious Treksperts.

Hold on. Terry Matalas has actually said that studio executives didn't want the Laris character to go back to the 21st Century in S2?

 

[Uhura's Song]

Commenting before reading the thread, so forgive me if I post something that has already been discussed.

I thiught that was VERY good. 9. Coukd have been a 10 if not a cliffhanger.

I loved the opening scene with Beverly kicking butt. I loved that Laris & Picard are together. And that she agrees he has to go. And I loved that Picard was about new adventures rather than old memories. I love that Raffi bent but did not break when Seven left her. No major relapse/unraveling & still working. Loved the Yesterday's Enterprise/Red Lady callback & the flute from "Inner Light." Was the shuttle Saavik? Seemed a nice way to honor Kirstie Alley. And I loved the For Annie dedication.

The son has to be Picard's, right? No other reason for her to suddenly break contact with everyone, right?

Wasn't there a Commander Shaw in one of the Next Gen episodes?

 

[TRON JA307020]

A Frontier Day trinket replica of the TOS Enterprise alongside too many TNG Enterprises. Customers clearly don't want "the fat one."

It was so dark I could barely make it out. I dont think it's the Enterprise though. It has 3 nacelles.

 

[thribs]

A Frontier Day trinket replica of the TOS Enterprise alongside too many TNG Enterprises. Customers clearly don't want "the fat one."

I love how lazy the props department is. Those are just Eaglemoss models. Could have at least altered the stands.

 

[ToddCam]

I mean, just look at the way people treat refugees from wars and natural disasters. Look at the way we treat rape victims. It is extremely, extremely common for victims of brutality and oppression to be "Other"-ized and subjected to further oppression.

True, though in this case I'd think of the haters we've seen (basically just Sisko and assuming Shaw) as a fellow refugee or rape victim, or relative of one.

 

[Timofnine]

A Frontier Day trinket replica of the TOS Enterprise alongside too many TNG Enterprises. Customers clearly don't want "the fat one."

Well, at least we know who bought up all of the Eaglemoss stock after the bankruptcy.

Re: Shaw:

So apparently it’s being set up for the audience to not like him because of the way he treats the ‘heroes.’ This screams Jellico, a character created for the exact same reason. Except, just like Jellico, this is unwarranted because he’s actually a good officer. Personal bias on his part aside, his ship is being illegally appropriated by Riker and Picard, and another member of his crew whom he doesn’t seem to care for is helping them. He has every right to be angry. And who wants to bet that he’s gonna wind up dead because of all this? But it’s ok because he was mean to Seven, Riker and Picard. I find that just a bit annoying.

I think that Shaw is being built up this way for an eventual redemption as part of his characters journey, this is only the start of his two dime mentionable character arc. This would all eventually make him a three dime mentionable character if the writers pad it all out.

 

[Sci]

The son has to be Picard's, right? No other reason for her to suddenly break contact with everyone, right?

Unclear! But why would having Jean-Luc's child be reason to break contact with everyone?

I love how lazy the props department is. Those are just Eaglemoss models. Could have at least altered the stands.

Star Trek has a long and proud history of using its tie-in merchandise onscreen without much modification. I'll never forget watching "Scorpion, Part I" age age 11 and noticing that all the dead and dismembered Borg looked identical to my Star Trek: First Contact Borg drone action figure.

True, though in this case I'd think of the haters we've seen (basically just Sisko and assuming Shaw) as a fellow refugee or rape victim, or relative of one.

Sure, but that is also a thing that happens in real life. Some of the most vicious perpetrators of white supremacist violence against African Americans in the late 19th and early 20th Centuries were Italian and Irish Americans who themselves faced racist discrimination.

 

[KennyB]

I love how lazy the props department is. Those are just Eaglemoss models. Could have at least altered the stands.

I actually thought that was cool……..

 

[Uhura's Song]

- Speaking of the Titan, why was so much dialogue hinting that this used to be Riker's Titan when it's not the Luna Class he was canonically the captain of? This is the Titan-A and clearly an entirely new ship. Why would Shaw have to clear out Riker's old files when he took command? They really should have just made it the same Titan as Riker's and have it be a Luna-class...or...drop the Titan name altogether and name it something else. This was one of those "Ehhh..." moments.
- Riker kind of came off as a jerk/moron by publicly embarrassing Sydney LaForge like that.
- Why was Seven so uncomfortable piloting the Titan out of spacedock? Seemed a little shoehorned in just to capture another TWOK callback. Also...damn Crash LaForge almost did it a third time with how close the Titan got to those doors. She gave Scotty a run for his money.

I believe Shaw has been commander of the Titan for a number of years, he mentioned a number of missions. He likely took command of the old Titan and also has command of the new one. That happense all the time with Enterprise.

I believe Seven's unease was a callback to Riker's unease when Picard made him manually reconnect the saucer section in "Encounter at Farpoint."

Riker us just giving the cadet some good-natured ribbing.

 

[Sisko_is_my_captain]

I could see Beverly being concerned that Picard's lifestyle would potentially endanger his son, but I will be disappointed if the reality is that simplistic. She saw firsthand the pain Wesley experienced in growing up without a father, and I cannot imagine she would be willing to do it again on purpose.

Not to mention, did she get pregnant on purpose? I cannot accept that it is easy to become pregnant without intending to in the 25th century. She's a doctor for crying out loud. That nonsense about Sisko forgetting his monthly birth control shot was so silly. How would a computer not be keeping up with their medication schedule.

 

[Uhura's Song]

If you're running into the problem I ran into, I found a trick around that.

I watched TNG Seasons 2-7 first, then swung around and went back to TNG Season 1. Getting used to the characters again made a difference.

And S1 is the worst of the bunch, by a good distance.

 

[James Cole]

Hold on. Terry Matalas has actually said that studio executives didn't want the Laris character to go back to the 21st Century in S2?

I have an Android, but all Android people know how to backwards engineer an Apple podcast link, so....
75% chance it's here

If not it's a two part podcast he did with Trek Central, Trek Core, Trek Culture, or Trek Movie around June 2022. I remember listening to it during a train journey in the Czech Republic, so it'd be too early for RMB's interview.

 

[Lt Mo]

I am curious about the writing of Crusher (or lack thereof) across Picard seasons. After the C/P relationship was a significant theme in TNG, it was completely ignored in the movies, then Crusher was the only TNG character not even mentioned in Picard S 1&2.
Was there always going to be a Pic Season 3? I know the writers changed but I’m unclear if the timeline of when the different seasons were written and what changed when.I’m wondering if, by not even mentioning her, the original writers were either always building up to a Crusher storyline, or were heading down the path of continuing to ignore her character.

 

[Uhura's Song]

Overall, great start! I've been way too into every little pre-release tease there is, and a consequence of that is always that my first actual watch feels more focused on the letdowns, but that's just part of my journey with Trek.

I was shocked Shaw has been teased as a character we'll love. For sure it could happen, but if it does it'll be the most implausible swing in opinion since Damar. It wasn't the amount of contempt Shaw had for our heroes, it was how it was expressed, there was no subtlety to that writing. A career focused guy who's all about proper procedure can get his point across without needing to be as nakedly aggressive and disrespectful to superior officers as Shaw was here. He didn't feel even a little like a person, but he felt a lot like a carefully constructed plot obstacle.

I also didn't buy Seven in this situation. I simply don't believe the character we know submits to things like being forced to use a name she doesn't identify with and all that.

It's funny, both are problems of working too hard to put our heroes on their heels. Obviously drama demands things be difficult, but this far into the narrative, we've seen them earn so much status. I wish they had found cleverer ways to work that in, rather than pushing to make them underdogs at every level.

As someone who thinks the features are generally Trek's weakest link, I was surprised at how much I loved the movie vibe. It felt so rich and lush, you just want to sink into this world. The score especially I thought was gorgeous. I would buy this score.

I was pleasantly surprised how well-written Laris was and how well it honored their season 2 story. It made me wish she was coming along for the whole season -- there's some Garak-like potential in this character that was barely touched.

As teased, it was awesome to see Beverly in this new light. Can't wait to see more from her.


That was odd, especially given how explicitly they've been discussed as season 3 regulars in the lead-up.


AGREED. It felt wrong and kind of disappointing to use that fanfare for a non-Enterprise ship.

DS9, Voyager, and Discovery say hello.

 

[thribs]

Star Trek has a long and proud history of using its tie-in merchandise onscreen without much modification. I'll never forget watching "Scorpion, Part I" age age 11 and noticing that all the dead and dismembered Borg looked identical to my Star Trek: First Contact Borg drone action figure.

That's a bit different since that was using an existing product for something else. Like in DS9 of using Hallmark bird of preys as actual ships in the wide shots.
I just think by the 25th century, they would use anti-gravity generators for stands. The Eaglemoss plastic stands look rather primitive there.

 

[Sci]

I could see Beverly being concerned that Picard's lifestyle would potentially endanger his son, but I will be disappointed if the reality is that simplistic. She saw firsthand the pain Wesley experienced in growing up without a father, and I cannot imagine she would be willing to do it again on purpose.

I mean, growing up without one parent or the other is not intrinsically harmful. It's growing up with the knowledge that someone out there ought to be there in a parental role for you but isn't that is harmful.

The issue with Wesley was not, "No father," it was, "Dead father." The issue with this fellow, if he is Picard's son, is not "No father," but, "The fact that he had a son was deliberately kept from Jean-Luc for twenty years."

If it's his son.

I have an Android, but all Android people know how to backwards engineer an Apple podcast link, so....
75% chance it's here

If not it's a two part podcast he did with Trek Central, Trek Core, Trek Culture, or Trek Movie around June 2022. I remember listening to it during a train journey in the Czech Republic, so it'd be too early for RMB's interview.

I don't really have the time to listen through a podcast interview. Does Terry Matalas claim that studio executives objected to the character of Laris joining Picard and company in the past in S2?

 

[KennyB]

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

Screen Crush listing off all the fun stuff……

 

[valkyrie013]

Not reading 26 pages so.. If its been said, so be it.

In general I liked it , have hope for a good season.
First
Cons:
1. You don't Refit into a new class of ship that looks nothing like the old one.. ... Still pissed it's not a Luna class
2. Not digging the music honestly.. I like it using the Jerry themes but is just a regurgitation.. Like some remix tape..
3. Still pissed it's not the Luna..
4. Ships interiors are to dark and grungy..
5. Still pissed its not the Luna..
6. God I hope he isn't Picard son.. That's to cheap and I F×+%* hate that trope of a non existent father like Kirk.. WORSE! Kirk knew of David..
Pros:
You can actually SEE the damn ships! Hallelujah! Praise the octo god someone listened. Hope they keep it up.. Though it still looks to take and so wish they'd take out the "atmosphere " from space.
Love the bad guy ship alot! Not that big though since its profiled against a 75 meter long ship.

Looks like Picard is having a memory problem.. He may need to restart his widows 4056 system.

In all good. Not a complete nostalgia fest..