Takei's Claims About Shatner

[Richard S. Ta]

No one thought of Sulu as a main character during the entire run of the show because he wasn't one, Takei was a day player and Sulu a minor and easily replaceable character. TOS has a main cast consisting of three actors, Shatner, Nimoy and Kelley.

Exactly this. I recall he disappeared to do other shows for half-season or so and production didn't even flinch. You could not have repeated the same trick with Shatner, Nimoy or Kelley.

He was to TOS what Colm Meaney was to the first few Seasons of TNG.

 

[Warped9]

This topic surfaces every so often along with the same talking points.

Takei has developed (nurtured?) an inflated opinion of his importance within Star Trek. Back in the day he was a secondary character who certainly didn’t rate his name in the opening credits. He’s forgotten that. The show didn’t hinge on him in anyway whatsoever. Nonetheless along the way he convinced himself he was as integral to the show as Shatner, Nimoy and Kelley.

And after the show Takei’s career went nowhere unlike Shatner and Nimoy who worked to maintain their careers. That probably burns Takei as well.

But if Takei, and Koenig and Doohan and Nichols, want someone to blame for not being as prominent in Star Trek I suggest they look to a much more likely villain: Gene Roddenberry. Roddenberry likely talked them up to convince them they were integral to portraying this great diverse and inclusive future. But when it didn’t pan out quite that way it was easier to blame Shatner, the star of the show, than the guy who had sold them on the idea.

TOS wasn’t TNG. It wasn’t an ensemble show, but a star vehicle. It was never intended as an ensemble show. Roddenberry never instructed the writers to feature the secondary characters more despite what he might have pitched to the actors initially.

There is a lot more evidence Roddenberry could be a douche than Shatner being one.

Yeah, it would have been nice to have seen a bit more of each of the secondary characters, but it wouldn’t have changed anything significantly.—they were still supporting characters. But it might have mollified Takei’s ego some.

 

[Ssosmcin]

This topic surfaces every so often along with the same talking points.

Every so often? It's the Trek BBS equivalent of The Thing That Wouldn't Leave.

But if Takei, and Koenig and Doohan and Nichols, want someone to blame for not being as prominent in Star Trek I suggest they look to a much more likely villain: Gene Roddenberry. Roddenberry likely talked them up to convince them they were integral to portraying this great diverse and inclusive future. But when it didn’t pan out quite that way it was easier to blame Shatner, the star of the show, than the guy who had sold them on the idea.

Also, the production staff favored Spock over Sulu for "This Side of Paradise" frankly stating that Takei wasn't a strong enough actor for the story. Additionally, the fans at the convention circuits boosted them constantly. And that's when the stories started as they ran out of new tales the tell and the blooper reels got old.

TOS wasn’t TNG. It wasn’t an ensemble show

I know I read an interview where Nichelle specifically said the series began as an ensemble. And while I found that statement dubious, I can totally feel where she and George may have felt like it was going to feature them more strongly. Even the audience may have thought so based on the initial episodes. "The Man Trap," "Charlie X" and "The Naked Time" featured the supporting cast heavily. But every show is like that. It's not Shatner's fault that his costar, a dude the network asked to put in the background a bit, become the most popular character. What do you do when the audience responds to the breakout? You feature him strongly. And then, to keep your star happy, you feature them both together. Who gets the cut? The day players. It's the nature of the business.

If Star Trek came and went like most TV shows, Takei would have just moved on his with life.

 

[PCz911]

Shatner could be charming and Shatner could be a prick. I don't know the man so can't say why he did some unpleasant things, but I can believe that he did.

Takei, I think, is prone to some exaggeration. It's also probable that the memory has changed a bit over the years. TBH, he should let it go. No use letting someone you personally don't like live rent-free in your head.

so true.

Unless it’s being done deliberately to get attention or sell something. People love drama.

for instance, when Wheaton recently wrote a book and brought up some of bills past (alleged) behavior, the shat asked rhetorically if it was done just to increase attention and sell the book.

 

[Noname Given]

Exactly this. I recall he disappeared to do other shows for half-season or so and production didn't even flinch. You could not have repeated the same trick with Shatner, Nimoy or Kelley.

He was to TOS what Colm Meaney was to the first few Seasons of TNG.

He didn't disappear to 'do other shows' per se; he was offered and accepted the role of "Captain Nim" in the John Wayne film - "The Green Berets"; and the production and filming of it ran longer than expected.

I certainly don't begrudge Takei for taking the role at the time because it was a substantial part and is was a John Wayne film; BUT I do find it funny how Takei always likes to crow how he "...saw the quality and importance of Star Trek from the beginning..." and likes to act like he was there for the whole thing when in fact he missed so many episodes that it gave Walter Koenig (hired to be a Davey Jones look alike in an attempt to bring more teens into the audience) a BIGGER role on the series than originally intended - and it's well known (and confirmed by Water Koenig as well ) that George Takei RESENTED Walter for that too for a long time. (Even though it was all caused by George Takei's decision to take the "Green Beret" role.)

 

[Ssosmcin]

The third season tended to treat the supporting cast better, but I think that was because the budget demanded so many ship bound bottle shows and smaller guest casts, so there were a lot of opportunities for Sulu to be on camera. Just last night, I watched "That Which Survives" which mentions Chekov but brings Sulu. Takei was fine in it, he did his best with some really "first draft" style dialog. His "ooo! ahh! Ouch!" when Losira touched him was pretty giggle-worthy, but he was fine.

 

[BillJ]

But it might have mollified Takei’s ego some.

I really doubt it. He already has an inflated sense of his importance to the show.

 

[Maurice]

The perception may have also been bolstered by actors seeing early "yellow cover" scripts where they had more lines and more to do, which got pared back during revisions to blue cover shooting scripts. For instance, in an early "The Naked Time" draft a recovered Sulu encourages Kirk to keep it together on the way to the bridge, and I'm convinced that was cut because it would be bad for the Kirk character to appear so weak in front of a subordinate, whatever the skill of the actor. Imagine you're a Takei or Nichols and see that kind of stuff happening, then you add in any bad behavior of Shatner on set and it all gets conflated into one big Shat-bash.

 

[BillJ]

I do wonder if some of the bashing Takei does is to keep attention on him and the causes he promotes? He was a lower tier actor and if not for the bashing of Shatner, would anyone be paying attention to the guy?*

*Seriously into benefit of the doubt territory.

 

[Richard S. Ta]

I do wonder if some of the bashing Takei does is to keep attention on him and the causes he promotes? He was a lower tier actor and if not for the bashing of Shatner, would anyone be paying attention to the guy?*

*Seriously into benefit of the doubt territory.

Shatner did say something along the lines of "he only gets press when he shits on me".

 

[Ssosmcin]

Here's my added opinion: Shatner wasn't in the same league as Nimoy, Kelley or Doohan despite the latter two being paid much less.

I would never begrudge your your opinion regardless of how much I absolutely disagree with it.

 

[Methuselah Flint]

I was thinking, and it's interesting to see how many episodes ended with Kirk's dialogue. I have a feeling most of the third season. Not sure if that was as scripted/the natural conclusion, or done deliberately.

 

[Ssosmcin]

Didn't most episodes end on Kirk's dialog? He was the lead, after all.

The series revolved around Kirk, his situations and decisions. This wasn't a later development or a way to undercut George Takei...

 

[Lord Garth]

Takei's claims about Shatner were interesting... 30 years ago.

I get it. William Shatner's an asshole. Having seen more of him on Twitter and heard even more anecdotes about him, I think he's an asshole too. I can see why Leonard Nimoy wanted nothing to do with him during the last five years of his life. I mentally separate William Shatner from Captain Kirk. I have to, or I can't enjoy TOS or the Movies.

After having said what I said in the previous paragraph, I still have to say to George Takei: Move on! Just let it go. Hollywood is filled with egos. Hollywood is filled with assholes. It's not like he killed your family. Move on.

What George Takei has done is turn hating William Shatner into Big Business. He has a mini-career going on devoted to hating William Shatner. No matter how anyone tries to spin it, that's fucked up.

 

[Hofner]

I could be sarcastic and say "This guy Shatner sounds like a real piece of work. Who does he think he is, the star of the show??" but I won't...

Oops, I just did.

Seriously, I don't have an opinion of William Shatner except I've greatly enjoyed his work for decades. But I don't know him. I don't give much creedence to anectdotes about him. If I theorize about him, it sounds like he's a private person and people may not respond very well to that.

Robert

 

[Commishsleer]

I could be sarcastic and say "This guy Shatner sounds like a real piece of work. Who does he think he is, the star of the show??" but I won't...

Oops, I just did.

Seriously, I don't have an opinion of William Shatner except I've greatly enjoyed his work for decades. But I don't know him. I don't give much creedence to anectdotes about him. If I theorize about him, it sounds like he's a private person and people may not respond very well to that.

Robert

You may not have heard but Shatner is on twitter blasting his opinions left and right. I don't think Takei's picking on poor shy and retiring William Shatner.
But even if I don't like what he has to say sometimes Shatners still a legend. At 90 years old still giving everyone crap. Takei too. Good on you!

 

[STEPhon IT]

Takei's claims about Shatner were interesting... 30 years ago.

I get it. William Shatner's an asshole. Having seen more of him on Twitter and heard even more anecdotes about him, I think he's an asshole too. I can see why Leonard Nimoy wanted nothing to do with him during the last five years of his life. I mentally separate William Shatner from Captain Kirk. I have to, or I can't enjoy TOS or the Movies.

After having said what I said in the previous paragraph, I still have to say to George Takei: Move on! Just let it go. Hollywood is filled with egos. Hollywood is filled with assholes. It's not like he killed your family. Move on.

What George Takei has done is turn hating William Shatner into Big Business. He has a mini-career going on devoted to hating William Shatner. No matter how anyone tries to spin it, that's fucked up.

Well, THAT Asshole had more professionalism than those overrated, very over paid, day players where he could've simply told the producers and the directors, "I won't do the movie if those losers returned." William Shatner could've done that stunt for EVERY installment but didn't. Shatner even stood up for Takei when he demanded more money to be a part of TFF but even THAT didn't stop that man from slandering him. These people are so ungrateful and it is disgusting they have the gall to even complain since Shatner's been carrying those losers for most of their relevant careers.

It is really disgusting!

 

[Richard S. Ta]

I don't think it's disgusting, but it is undignified and petty.

 

[Commishsleer]

Well, THAT Asshole had more professionalism than those overrated, very over paid, day players where he could've simply told the producers and the directors, "I won't do the movie if those losers returned." William Shatner could've done that stunt for EVERY installment but didn't. Shatner even stood up for Takei when he demanded more money to be a part of TFF but even THAT didn't stop that man from slandering him. These people are so ungrateful and it is disgusting they have the gall to even complain since Shatner's been carrying those losers for most of their relevant careers.

It is really disgusting!

Were they very overpaid? I didn't hear that. What was the going rate? Was it in movies or in TOS?
Just because Shatner didn't do something very bad, doesn't make him a good guy - free from all criticisms.
Doohan wrote in his autobiography that he rang Shatner to find out about one of the movies and Shatner hung up on him saying "How did you get my number?". Doohan - A World War 2 Veteran who got injured in the War defending his country. I think he deserves more respect than that. Even if Shatner is a great big star and too good for the rest of us. But you're right - Shatner never did anything to really hurt anyone's career significantly - just their feelings.

 

[Ssosmcin]

Let's be fair, nobody here knows Shatner. We don't know if he's a good person or not. We don't know if he really hung up on Doohan (who was known to inflate a few tales himself). We don't know how much of his twitter is really written by him. We don't know how much is persona for the public and the real person. We don't know what happened between Shatner and Nimoy in the last few years. We know what they want us to know.