But early Mickey WAS an idiot.
Russell T. Davies Returns to Doctor Who as New Showrunner
- Thread starter Allyn Gibson
- Start date
But early Mickey WAS an idiot.
So we just ignore what we saw on screen with the 3 Doctors & 5 Doctors which to my mind made it clear that they were the only Doctors not to mention those times in the 80s when JNT would have a scene where one of the Doctor's old foes would probe his memory and only the Doctors we'd seen on TV would appear?
Yes.
The Division wipes The Doctor's mind and all obscures all memory of them pre-Hartnell incarnation from The Matrix (Ascension of the Cybermen/The Timeless Child). I dunno, maybe they gave Dr Strange a fiver or something.
Probing their memory is only going to go back as far as the memory wipe anyway, so the second point answers itself. There's nothing for the probe to bring back, pre-Hartnell, as it's all in the fob watch from The Vanquishers.
In other, simple words: The showrunners after Hinchcliffe/Holmes retconned those Morbius Doctors, and Chibnall decided to retcon them into continuity. Incredibly simple.
Just because none of the Showrunners from Williams to Moffat followed up on the Morbius Doctors doesn't mean that said Doctors were retconned out of the show's lore.
Hopefully RTD will restore the pre-Chibnall continuity, which would be easy enough. Just say it was all a ploy by The Master to mess with The Doctor, and literally everything will be fixed. That is pretty much the only way I'll ever really enjoy Doctor Who ever again. Even if RTD new stuff is good in general, if they don't retcon Chibnall's shit out of existence, its never really going to be Doctor Who to me. It will just be some new show created by an idiot using the Doctor Who branding.
But they absolutely did when Williams-onwards stuck on the pre-Hinchcliffe assumption that the First Doctor really was the first Doctor. That's exactly the point and meaning of a retcon.
What I'm actually hoping is, if he doesn't just outright say TTC is false (he won't do that), that at least he elaborates on it in a way that is actual fruitful and enjoyable and fitting for the show and what's happened before. I despise the arc and the entire revelation for relegating the Doctor to a victim of his bad handling, but I trust RTD making lemonade out of lemons.
I apologize i'm jumping into this in mid conversation but if we want RTD to retcon the timeless child stuff shouldn't "The War Doctor" and Ruth doctor be fair game?
Not sure where does the War Doctor fit into the TC mess, when Ruth Doctor does, but... if you mean generally, I understand the sentiment, but the War Doctor, while a retcon that was created out of Eccleston's displeasure with the BBC regarding him working on the show years ago (really, its almost as if he co-created the character in that way, lol), it was still a change that was met mostly with praise and positivity, even with the ocassional remark about his existence was the result of off-screen chenanigans, but mostly it didn't bother the history of the show or the character in such a profound way like the Timeless Crap did.
And even then, I'm sure even the harshest critics of the TC (and I count myself as a critic of this mess) would agree Jo Martin's Doctor was the best thing out of this whole mess. I would not want her to be retconned out of the show by any means.
Ideally we want RTD to keep the good bits.
No.
At most, every Showrunner from Williams to Moffat merely ignored the existence of the Morbius Doctors and left them unexplained.
Ignoring parts of a series' established lore is not retconning said lore out of existence or relevance; it's just ignoring it and not choosing to expand on or follow up on it.
Just about anything was better than Kill the Moon.. I started to lose interest in Who after decades from that, and it hasn't been until recently that I really started watching again. I realized that many DID like it and that there was an irrevocable gulf between that segment of fans and me.
Red Dwarf is marginally more stable on the continuity front. And it has a man with two appendixes instead of hearts, so you still get your double organ fix
LOL, if you says so.
That is the essence of a retcon. When the First Doctor becomes the FIRST Doctor again by on-screen evidence, automatically that means whatever implications there existed of previous Doctors to that is therefore non-applicable. It's not hard science, and only the hardcore nerd belief of some fans who wanted these Doctors to count out of some misplaced loyalty to Holmes and Hinchcliffe's regeneration theory.
It doesn't have to be explicit a retcon in order to be one. Just like the Morbius Doctor retcon was in itself an implicit retcon, so is the fact that the Doctor never ever mentioned them when he was referring to his past selves in any way. It's quite a reach to imply that no, the Morbius Doctors were always canon when the overwhelming showcase of Who between The Brain of Morbius and The Timeless Children clearly suggests otherwise.
But hey, Doctor Who fans want to argue ceaselessly about minutia like the actually non-relevant Time Lords issue, so anyway.
