Spoilers ST Discovery - Starships and Technology Season Four Discussion

[Mike McDevitt]

- Vulcans have houses made of bricks and mortar now.

- You'd think that phasers 930+ years hence would be better at vaporizing scary monsters. Here they're as useless as the plot demands, but even in the 23rd century you could evaporate people in an instant. Heck, last season people had more destructive hand weapons. I guess the scary monsters were just scary resistant to phasers.

Mark

-Isolationist the Ni’Var may be, but human brickwork and Ardanan Hovering Science Pavillions are still logical on This Old House.

-Tilly’s order to shut down the equipment to make them more invisible to the Pinky Tuscadero may have included using the more dramatic short burst phaser bullets because they emit less trackable EM signatures?

 

[Mike McDevitt]

Wondering if "Theta Helios" was originally intended to have some other name...?

Has kind of a parallel reality Vulcan system's Delta Vega quality to it? Or Canada, with less Pyrosomes?

 

[fireproof78]

But I wasn't looking THAT closely, but are cadet combadges different?

Yes.

 

[Mike McDevitt]

We see a new shuttle design, I think. It was really hard to see the shuttles in the last season.

And the Noble returns for a brief cameo and we learn a little more about the Armstrong.

I thought I saw a Stargate Atlantis puddlejumper.

 

[DEWLine]

I'm thinking that "Delta Vega" is Trek's version of "Springfield": every sector has a planet with that name.

As for "Theta Helios" and the two moons we learned about, was there an expedition with Greek involvement that passed through that system? Or just someone obsessed with Greek mythology aboard?

 

[XCV330]

I'm thinking that "Delta Vega" is Trek's version of "Springfield": every sector has a planet with that name.

As for "Theta Helios" and the two moons we learned about, was there an expedition with Greek involvement that passed through that system? Or just someone obsessed with Greek mythology aboard?

Susanne Vega was vital in bringing the Federation together. Every fourth planet is named in her honor.

 

[fireproof78]

I'm thinking that "Delta Vega" is Trek's version of "Springfield": every sector has a planet with that name.

As for "Theta Helios" and the two moons we learned about, was there an expedition with Greek involvement that passed through that system? Or just someone obsessed with Greek mythology aboard?

Greek nomenclature in space naming conventions is not new.

 

[XCV330]

Greek nomenclature in space naming conventions is not new.

Earth has gotten WAY more creative at naming asteroids:
https://www.universetoday.com/100449/top-9-weird-asteroid-names-and-1-awesome-asteroid-moon-name/

though how they will handle the Mr Spock 2309 (1971 QX1)) asteroid if it ever comes up in series..

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

-Tilly’s order to shut down the equipment to make them more invisible to the Pinky Tuscadero may have included using the more dramatic short burst phaser bullets because they emit less trackable EM signatures?

I've always preferred Phaser Bolts, similar to bullets, over the continuous Phaser Beams when it came to battles between people, CQB or otherwise.

For Person vs Person, not having to stand and hold the phaser still for that split second to aim your beam is a life saver.

Every fraction of a second counts in a fire fight, don't just stand there, shoot and scoot.

Being a still target is how you get yourself killed IRL with bullets, and having to stand there to stabilize your phaser beams isn't helpful.

Commander Ransom died in the Holodeck simulation because of it.

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Mariner with a Gatling Phaser was able to provide more suppressive fire.

When it comes to vessel vs vessel or ship vs fighters, then use continuous beams or bolts or streaks are fine depending on the application.

There's a time and place for each when it comes to Vehicle/Vessel battles.

 

[DEWLine]

A planet named "Theta Helios" suggests that one of the names of the Sun got repurposed into a constellation name, doesn't it?

 

[Deks]

I've always preferred Phaser Bolts, similar to bullets, over the continuous Phaser Beams when it came to battles between people, CQB or otherwise.

For Person vs Person, not having to stand and hold the phaser still for that split second to aim your beam is a life saver.

Every fraction of a second counts in a fire fight, don't just stand there, shoot and scoot.

Being a still target is how you get yourself killed IRL with bullets, and having to stand there to stabilize your phaser beams isn't helpful.

Commander Ransom died in the Holodeck simulation because of it.

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Mariner with a Gatling Phaser was able to provide more suppressive fire.

When it comes to vessel vs vessel or ship vs fighters, then use continuous beams or bolts or streaks are fine depending on the application.

There's a time and place for each when it comes to Vehicle/Vessel battles.

Would Mariner's Gatling Phaser be seen as anything other than a fictional weapon though in Trek though?
It WAS created to be part of a 'movie' in the holodeck , and as they all said, 'everything is possible in movies'.

Though to be fair, I think SF could effectively make such a Gatling Phaser... it would basically be what... 5 x Type II phasers rolled into one bigger weapon... no reason why the handles couldn't be straightened out and merged into one... removing that casing would probably free up space to interconnect them all... so from a practicality point of view, that thing might actually be doable (especially when you look at how much thinner/smaller the handheld phasers are in ST: Nemesis - and Lower Decks takes place years later).

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Would Mariner's Gatling Phaser be seen as anything other than a fictional weapon though in Trek though?
It WAS created to be part of a 'movie' in the holodeck , and as they all said, 'everything is possible in movies'.

Though to be fair, I think SF could effectively make such a Gatling Phaser... it would basically be what... 5 x Type II phasers rolled into one bigger weapon... no reason why the handles couldn't be straightened out and merged into one... removing that casing would probably free up space to interconnect them all... so from a practicality point of view, that thing might actually be doable (especially when you look at how much thinner/smaller the handheld phasers are in ST: Nemesis - and Lower Decks takes place years later).

It seems very do-able. She only uses 4x of the 5x emitters.

The center emitter is never used for whatever reason.

So you might as well drop the center 5x emitter and make it a bit smaller.

But her Gatling Phaser Pistol seems more like a spray and pray type weapon instead of a precision weapon.

When you're firing that many shots, you're banking on the computer to do alot of the targeting.

And her weapon seems like the size of modern Nerf Pistols which are HUGE compared to IRL pistols.

The main issue is how heavy will it need to be, because you have 4x the emitters. That means to maintain equal capacity to a standard Type 2x Phaser, you need 4x the battery capacity.

That just adds weight / mass.

I don't know if you have ever held a real pistol, but heavy pistols have their place, but many people prefer the lighters ones, especially those that are < 1 kg if possible.

 

[Deks]

It seems very do-able. She only uses 4x of the 5x emitters.

The center emitter is never used for whatever reason.

So you might as well drop the center 5x emitter and make it a bit smaller.

But her Gatling Phaser Pistol seems more like a spray and pray type weapon instead of a precision weapon.

When you're firing that many shots, you're banking on the computer to do alot of the targeting.

And her weapon seems like the size of modern Nerf Pistols which are HUGE compared to IRL pistols.

The main issue is how heavy will it need to be, because you have 4x the emitters. That means to maintain equal capacity to a standard Type 2x Phaser, you need 4x the battery capacity.

That just adds weight / mass.

I don't know if you have ever held a real pistol, but heavy pistols have their place, but many people prefer the lighters ones, especially those that are < 1 kg if possible.

Yeah, but Phasers would be made from superior synthetic materials (batteries too)... it stands to reason that weight wouldn't be a factor here.
A typical Type II phaser from say ST: Nemesis is small and very light... I don't think carrying 4 or 5 of them in one hand would be an issue weight-wise.

As for the central emitter not being used... maybe its not an emitter, but rather an exhaust vent for the heat... or its just that she didn't have to use it.

In all honesty, if a Type 3 phaser doesn't overload, then I doubt having 4 or 5 of Type 2's (or even 1's) rolled into one would present an issue... those things would be passively cooled... or basically, the excess heat (if any is produced) would be captured and harvested back into the power cells.

In fact, is there a reason to think Type I phasers couldn't vaporize people?
I don't think so... and we've seen how small a Type 1 is... (smaller even than Type 2)... so having 5 of those rolled into one seems perfectly doable.

 

[valkyrie013]

Well.. Look at the plasma repeater weapons that the Kull warriors on stargate use. They fire lower power but higher fire rates from 1 muzzle.
Could do that with a phaser. Low power bolts but an automatic high rate of fire. There no recoil from energy weapons so you could literally be a 1 man cover fire machine.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Yeah, but Phasers would be made from superior synthetic materials (batteries too)... it stands to reason that weight wouldn't be a factor here.
A typical Type II phaser from say ST: Nemesis is small and very light... I don't think carrying 4 or 5 of them in one hand would be an issue weight-wise.

As for the central emitter not being used... maybe its not an emitter, but rather an exhaust vent for the heat... or its just that she didn't have to use it.

In all honesty, if a Type 3 phaser doesn't overload, then I doubt having 4 or 5 of Type 2's (or even 1's) rolled into one would present an issue... those things would be passively cooled... or basically, the excess heat (if any is produced) would be captured and harvested back into the power cells.

In fact, is there a reason to think Type I phasers couldn't vaporize people?
I don't think so... and we've seen how small a Type 1 is... (smaller even than Type 2)... so having 5 of those rolled into one seems perfectly doable.

We'll see, it's all based on people's preference.

I'm not too worried about heat, they usually figure that out at the design & engineering level.

It's more of a size, weight, ergonomics, & balance issue, but some people like big pistols, & others have liked heavier pistols.

So it's really personal preference at the end of the day.

As for Type 1's not being able to vaporize people?
Probably Battery Output limitations and it's stated that Type-1's had 1x Pre-Fire chamber to accumulate energy before release through the emitter crystal.
Type-2's had 4x Pre-Fire chambers linearly connected, right before the emitter crystal.

Type-1's had 8x power Settings while Type-2's had 16x power settings.
On Type-1's Setting 8 was the Maximum Power Output.

Type-1's are about the size of a modern day car alarm remote control.

Type-1's had power levels of (stun to up towards 1.55x10^6 Joules of energy discharge for 0.28 seconds) according to my TNG illustrated tech manual.

The EM Nuclear Disruption Force ratio was 1:40.

For reference, it would take 3.0 ×10^9 J of energy to totally vaporize a human body, including skeleton (break all atomic bonds). That's 717 kg of TNT to accomplish the same thing.

So assuming Type-1's Level 8 setting is the same as Type-2 Phaser's and Type-3 Phaser's.

At Level 8, factoring a 1:40 advantage multiplier due to the inherent nature of "Nadions" that you're firing upon the target, you would need to apply ~ 13.548 seconds of Level 8 energy to a target before it vaporizes.

Obviously if you increase the power settings on a Type-2 or Type-3 to level 16, you'll be able to emit more energy faster.

But that's the data I can scrounge up.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Well.. Look at the plasma repeater weapons that the Kull warriors on stargate use. They fire lower power but higher fire rates from 1 muzzle.
Could do that with a phaser. Low power bolts but an automatic high rate of fire. There no recoil from energy weapons so you could literally be a 1 man cover fire machine.

If you want to be a 1-man cover fire machine, you need a different form factor.

Take the classic Bow & Arrow.

Chuck away the arrow aspect and mount MANY Beam Emitters across the Bow's Fore-end to face the opponent and have the string angle the bow limb's arc so you can control how wide of a firing arc you have.

Then have the computer help auto target everything on the field and you can potentially fire dozens of bolts or beam volleys at one given time or do alternating emitter multi-fire.

1x Person could easily cover dozens of people simultaneously and if you have a wired energy link to a backpack that houses a large battery, then you can potentially keep a squad busy for quite a while by yourself while your allies flank their position.

Add in Personal Shields, you're a mobile turret on the battle field that can do REAL suppressive fire.

 

[fireproof78]

Should be a hologram.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

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[Mark_Nguyen]

USS Janeway! NSS T'Pau!

I'd like to think that the show was heading in this direction, given that it started with naming ships after 20th century aviators, that they evolved to name their ships now after 22nd century political figures or 24th century explorers.

Also, I guess the 32nd century Voyager isn't "Janeway class" after all..?

Also also, this?

Mark

 

[Mike McDevitt]

USS Janeway! NSS T'Pau!

I'd like to think that the show was heading in this direction, given that it started with naming ships after 20th century aviators, that they evolved to name their ships now after 22nd and 24th century explorers.

Also, I guess the 32nd century Voyager isn't "Janeway class" after all..?

Also also, this?

Mark

NSS = Ni’Var Star Ship, maybe? Will they have the DOTS repaint that N into a U if the treaties work out?
Memory Alpha claims the Voyager-J is Intrepid-class.