The James Bond Film Discussion Thread (With Bonus Lazenby!)

[The Old Mixer]

And it's amusing how the campiest and most fun-loving Bond became arguably the most popular Bond with movie audiences. Moviegoers in the 1970s and '80s wanted a Bond who could kick a lot of ass but also knew how to quip, joke and lighten the mood with human behavior that put viewers at ease in the middle of a film about world domination, nuclear blackmail or an espionage battle. "Hey, Roger is joking and smiling and he's making funny quips. We're gonna be alright."

Roger Moore may be the least Bond of cinematic Bonds in some respects but he gave audiences what they wanted even when his films didn't.

I think a key ingredient of that "It" factor is charisma. Sir Roger had boatloads of it. And as good a thespian as Dalton may be, it's arguably the area in which he's most lacking. I daresay that even Lazenby had more onscreen charisma in his own way (earnest charm?) than Dalton did.

 

[cooleddie74]

Dalton was mediocre at best at being funny. "Salt corrosion" from TLD is an example of a line that Sir Roger would have delivered perfectly with a twinkle in his eye. Dalton just couldn't do comedy until perhaps Hot Fuzz.

 

[cooleddie74]

While it wasn't tender, he had a great emotional breakdown at the very end of THE HILL. And he worked with Sidney Lumet five or six times more.

Bond directors failed to get it out of him then, or didn't even ask it of him.

 

[cardinal biggles]

I think a key ingredient of that "It" factor is charisma. Sir Roger had boatloads of it. And as good a thespian as Dalton may be, it's arguably the area in which he's most lacking. I daresay that even Lazenby had more onscreen charisma in his own way (earnest charm?) than Dalton did.

But Dalton does have charisma when he wants to — as someone else mentioned upthread, go rewatch The Rocketeer, made just two years after Licence to Kill — but he totally eschewed it in both of his Bond films, I guess because he was trying to bring out the gritty government assassin side.

Dalton was mediocre at best at being funny. "Salt corrosion" from TLD is an example of a line that Sir Roger would have delivered perfectly with a twinkle in his eye. Dalton just couldn't do comedy until perhaps Hot Fuzz.

"Salt corrosion" was a lame nudge-nudge wink-wink kind of line, and yeah, Dalton sucked at delivering it. Roger and Pierce would have both nailed it. On the other hand, I love his line "I guess this is farewell to arms" just before he does a Peter Pan off the balcony at the Hemingway House. That was much more his speed.

 

[The Old Mixer]

Acting swagger isn't the same thing as having charisma.

 

[MakeshiftPython]

Connery was not a good actor for emotional depth and tenderness. When Aki the Japanese agent was poisoned to death he just went: "She's dead" and went on with his mission even though he'd displayed affection for her in previous scenes. Lazenby may not have been much of an actor but he got it right when it counted, and his pained expression and body language after Tracy is shot dead is all that scene needed short of maybe a few tears.

And Peter Hunt said: "James Bond doesn't cry" so he didn't use the take wherein Lazenby shed tears over Rigg's crumpled form.

I wouldn’t hold YOLT against Connery. He was checked out by that point. The filmmakers were more concerned with the lavish sets and gimmicks rather than rounded characters like in earlier films. Had EON thought he was worth paying $1M and hired him for OHMSS, I have every confidence he would have been reinvigorated with the material he would work with, and audiences would buy Connery Bond falling in love because by then Connery earned the audience goodwill.

But we’ll never know.

 

[Starkers]

Dalton can be funny, its just that much like Craig his humour is very dry, it isn't the quips of a Moore or a Brosnan. You've got to give him the right material. There are plenty of moments in TLD when he's amusing or there's clearly a twinkle in his eye.

"We have a pipeline to the west."

"Glad I insisted you brought that cello"

"You should have brought lilies"

"We have a phrase too, Georgi, and you're full of it."

"Are you calling me a horse's arse?"

I think the other thing people neglect with Dalton is how much of a romantic leading man he is. The relationship between he and Kara is more convincing than anything outside of Bond/Tracy or Bond/Vesper.

 

[cooleddie74]

The cello line is great. Dalton is one of my favorite Bonds, but he doesn't do comedy like Sir Roger could. And yeah, when I think about it I agree on Bond and Kara. They're forced together out of pure necessity of the mission and there's little chemistry at first, as it gradually develops over the course of the film. It's a believable situation whereby a female target being pursued or protected by a male agent slowly develops feelings for him as a result of the adrenaline of the life-or-death situation she's in.

They don't even consummate their relationship until the end credits roll. Sir Roger's Bond would have slept with her at least twice before then and made at least a few sexual innuendoes about it.

 

[Starkers]

Isn't it implied something happens on the big wheel? There's also plenty of time for something to happen overnight at Kamran Shah's palace.

Sir Roger was one of a kind, it takes talent to play a role straight, yet at the same time play it like you're in on the joke yet not make your performance a joke (hoping that sentence makes sense!)

Compare that to Connery in DAF.

Roger would definitely have shagged Paloma in NTTD (to be honest so would most of the Bonds!)

 

[cooleddie74]

Maybe they did make love before the end of the film. I guess that's why I like the two Dalton films so much in some respects. Things are implied or go unseen. In any case TLD was advertised as the first Bond film of the AIDS Era and 007 was seen as being far more chaste and careful in Dalton's first outing than Roger had been throughout his whole tenure save for FYEO.

 

[Starkers]

Although Dalton does probably sleep with two women in TLD given he also scores in the pre title sequence. Then again Roger has his way with four woman in AVTAK which is insane!

Not sure if four conquests is a record or not. We're never quite sure how many of Blofeld's angels Lazenby manages to seduce before he's found out.

Lowest number of seductions has to be Daniel Craig in QoS (unless something happens with Camille in the cave but it's not implied that it does) and in NTTD (come to think of it does he actually sleep with Solange in Casino Royale?)

 

[Captaindemotion]

I still wish TLD or LTK had gone full 80s and shown Bond struggling to locate and put on a condom, midway through a love scene.

 

[cardinal biggles]

I still wish TLD or LTK had gone full 80s and shown Bond struggling to locate and put on a condom, midway through a love scene.

Q probably would have invented some sort of self-deploying prophylactic cleverly disguised as... hell if I know. I'm trying to imagine it and just end up laughing instead.

 

[cardinal biggles]

Connery donated his fee ($1.25 million) from Diamonds Are Forever to start the Scottish International Education Trust. United Artists also wooed him back by offering him a two-film contract, his choice. The first film was Sidney Lumet's The Offence; the second film didn't get made because Connery wanted to do a Macbeth adaptation, but Polanski was already doing his version.

 

[MakeshiftPython]

The best humor with Dalton isn’t the quips. It’s in the exchanges.

“Don’t worry, our technicians have spent months perfecting this.”
“How many times have you done this?”
“You’re the first.”

“I must get my cello!”
“No way!”
*hard cut to an annoyed Dalton waiting in his AM*

Also, I wouldn’t say Dalton was too PC compared to Brosnan. There’s a lot of sexism in his treatment of Pam in LTK to the point that she has to take the initiative. Even when she saves his ass he’s trying to lecture her about how unfit she is.

“It’s a tough business you picked, Miss Bouvier. Leave it to the professionals.” Then’s remarks like telling her “it’s a man’s world”. But he’s not a total buffoon about it, once he realizes the scope of it all is when he accepts her as his equal.

 

[Starkers]

I've always been forgiving of the 'It's a man's world' comment given he caveats it by saying they're south of the border. Isthmus City is a man's world, the only women with any notable role or visibility are Lupe and the female Hong Kong narcotics agent. The only other women we see are the hookers arranged for Franz's clients.

 

[cardinal biggles]

The best humor with Dalton isn’t the quips. It’s in the exchanges.

“Don’t worry, our technicians have spent months perfecting this.”
“How many times have you done this?”
“You’re the first.”

Not just that, but the whole interplay in that scene between Bond, Koskov, and Rosika Miklos is priceless. "Pigs! Borscht! Cake!"

But the best exchange in the whole film belongs to John Rhys-Davies:

"Put him on the next plane to Moscow..."
"Oh, thank you, General! Thank you so much—"
"...in the diplomatic bag."

 

[cooleddie74]

I'm glad TLD gave us one last appearance of General Gogol before the actor died and the series moved away from the Cold War. Six appearances has to remain the record for recurring antagonist/troublemaker if we don't count a lead villain like Blofeld.

 

[Starkers]

And seven films in total, though obviously only six as Gogol

 

[cooleddie74]

Yep. His stand-in for A View to a Kill in the scene where Gogol picks up Pola Ivanova and they think they have the right audio cassette recording is atrocious but by 1985 the producers honestly weren't even trying with stunt doubles and stand-ins.