Hey,
Sorry about that. The thing with me is that I often come online, check the board for a few minutes and then I gotta run.
I do really wanna hear your thoughts on Roswell though. I problem I often face though, is that we agree on a lot of things so there's nothing new for me to add.
I'm curious though, would my previous reply have been better had I not started with the 'I'll be quick 'cause I gotta run'? Because I read it again and it's not that short.
Well, you've said that about 3 times now...so I kinda got the impression that you were really busy and didn't have time to respond, but were doing so to be polite. Check your last few posts on this topic - I think about 3 of them start out that way.
I don't mind if you don't respond right away anyway. I'd rather you just waited until you had time than feel like you had to respond within a few hours. I mean, you are halfway around the world! - I don't expect you to drop everything you know.
This sort of discussion takes a bit more time than your typical BS TrekBBS post - shoot, I was busy today myself and so didn't even try to fit it in during the day. It's easy to squeeze in a silly little post here and there during a busy work day - I did so today. But I was too busy to post anything long, so I just waited until I got home. I certainly do not expect any more of you than I expect of myself!
Anyway, here's some more of my thoughts.
Like I said in my previous post, I really loved the ep where Alex dies and the one after it. The way the ep got to the death so quickly was totally unexpected. Liz and Maria finding out was just heart-breaking. And then when Max tried to revive him and couldn't... I really had no idea what was going through Liz's head at that time. From what I remember, it actually felt like she was mad at Max. Like he didn't try hard enough. It's possible I'm either not remembering it right, or that I misinterpreted the whole thing though. The scene where Valenti comes home and tells Kyle that Alex died the day before ('cause today was Kyle's b-day) was also awesome. The way Bill Sadler and Nick Wechsler delivered that scene... wow. I've actually always thought those two worked sooooo well together. You could actually feel that father/son bond between the though (which I never really got from Max and and his folks).
Well, that episode did not waste any time, that's for sure. I think that Liz came pretty much unhinged right away, and pretty much stayed that way until the end of
Departure, when Michael decides to stay and so opens the entrance to the granolithe, thus allowing Liz and Kyle the opportunity to get in there and spill the beans on Tess.
Part of the reason I love that whole series of episodes is because both Liz and Max come unhinged...partly for the same reasons and partly for different ones. But at the end of the day, it is shown rather clearly that they work alot better when they are working together than when they are working at cross-purposes.
And yeah...I got a kick out of Valenti and Kyle. But then, I always get a kick out of Kyle! He really came into his own in season 2, and when all was said and done, he ended up with some of the funniest lines spoken that entire season. Paraphrased (to Isabelle): "Okay...so I'm a guy, and I know what flips guys out most. How about...Max wakes up with one nut?"
HI-larious! :thumbsup:
And many of his Buddhist-related lines are hilarious too. Really...I totally looked forward to his scenes in S2, because he said all kinds of goofy stuff. He was still a jock...but a much more 3D jock than he was in S1. He was a jock with a goober side to him. Good stuff!
But I agree about Nick Wechsler and Bill Sadler working well together. Last night I watched the season 3 episode where Valenti starts his lame country/western band...and the scenes between Valenti and Kyle about Kyle supporting them were very good. Totally believable.
Oh, and was it just me or was the scene in the "Heart of Mine" (the prom ep) where Liz says she has a feeling this is the last time the whole group would be together like this a bit similar to the last scene in "The Sound of Her Voice" from DS9 where everyone is together and toasting Lisa Cusak (and then Jadzia dies in the next ep).
Well, I have to admit that I didn't make the connection...but yeah, it's pretty much the same situation.
The rest of the stuff dealing with Alex's death was pretty good as well. Some of it was a bit far-fetched though (the finger tapping especially, like you said). I thought the conflict and the rift between the human and the alien sides of the group worked pretty well as well. Previous to that big conflict, Max and Liz really did grow apart a bit. So I think the fact that he doubted Liz (when she said aliens were behind Alex's death) was fairly believable.
Well, I think the two of them ran the gambit in season 2, from love to mutual pain to anger to near-hatred at one point. And that made the characters really alot more interesting. During the second half of season 2, you sure didn't need other characters playing off of Max for him to be interesting! The guy was out-of-control on a few occasions.
And it was so cool seeing Michael be the one to help Liz and Maria figure out what happened to Alex. You saw him slowly realizing, over the course of this entire season, that earth was home. It wasn't a huge surprise to me during
Departure that he was the one who wanted to stay...because he'd been moving toward that all season...from the exact opposite extreme he was at during season 1, when he wanted to leave as soon as possible. And that conversation he has with Max in the park - Max telling Michael he'd been right all along...and Michael telling Max that no...now HE thought he'd been wrong? It really was awesome that the two guys did that. And it really drove home why, on their home planet, Michael was Max's second in command: because they DID need each other. Like two sides of the same coin.
There is alot of really good symmetry in this show...and the characters backstories were clearly well developed, because so much of those backstories are utilized later in important ways.
And yeah, the end of S2 worked really well. I mean, as a viewer you know they're not gonna leave Earth (especially 'cause I knew there was a third season, lol), but still... getting there was great. I've said it before and I'll most likely say it again; this group of people has so much chemistry together. And it's not just about the individual relationships (Max & Liz; Michael & Maria; Liz & Maria; Max, Isabel & Michael) but the relationship of the group as a whole. Yeah, they may disagree or even fight sometimes, but they really care a ton for each other.
So yeah, like I said in my previous post, I did actually like (or even love) most of S2, except for Max and Tess hooking up. You know the ep where Max and Tess have sex? Man I hated that ep. Like with every fibre of my being, haha. It just... it felt like the only reason they writers decided to do it was for conflict. Up to that point I had so much faith in Max, but I lost some of it after that. You know... it was like a good friend of yours screwing up and you're disappointed. You're still their friend, but your perception of that person changes a bit.
Well, of course I felt the same way about him. I think we were meant to. I think we were meant to think "Max! Dude! What the FUCK are you thinking?
This girl could not BE any worse 'Bad News'. "
But that is what made him interesting to watch. In season 2, Max became flawed. He had some strong moments of good leadership...but we saw him make some huge errors in judgment, we saw him lose his temper and come unhinged...and we saw him in kinda a 'nasty bastard mode' when he was trying to control Isabelle and her desire to go to college in San Francisco.
It was good to see some of his flaws...even though it was painful, because you respected the character so much. It was like Sisko in
For the Uniform. He just....lost it. And even the best people lose it at one time or another and screw up.
Anyway, do me a favour and let me know what you thought about what part of S2 I hated - the Max & Tess relationship.
Well, I think we were meant to hate the relationship. In pretty much every episode, Tess showed, in sometimes small and subtle ways, that she saw humans as bugs to be squashed underfoot. She was sorta like the Founders in DS9 - of the opinion that humans were irrelevant and not nearly as important has her and 'her kind'. Alien life was valuable to Tess...but human life was not. And as it turns out in
Departure, not even alien life was all THAT important!
By the end of it, you are left even wondering about her relationship with Kyle and Valenti. I mean, she mind-warped Kyle, who was her closest friend, without a second thought. Even Kyle, who took her under his wing in every way, was betrayed by her. And she thought nothing of it. Nothing at all. She cared only about herself.
I was very disappointed, however, when Max slept with her. I mean, it is true that he had to from a story perspective in order to set up season 3, if for no other reason. But yeah....that was not my favorite scene to watch. As I said, you sit there and think "
MAX!!! You IDIOT!!!"
You expect more from Max...and he lets you down. Just like real people let you down. But it gives that character a better basis in reality - even Max fucks up occasionally, it seems! Even Max can act like a douchebag.
P.S.: Oh, what did you think of "Viva Las Vegas"? 'Cause personally I loved it. It was such a light and fun episode. And with all the drama going on at the time, it really worked so well. You also had some really good moments like the one at the end with Maria singing and Max showing up. Yeah, it was incredibly predictable, but still done really well.
And Michael making fake IDs with all those funny names for everyone was just priceless. Harvey Wallbanger (Kyle), Rob Roy (Max) and Dr. Love (Michael) were just priceless.
And Kyle saying Buddha was OK with gambling was just hilarious.
I liked that one alot. It was a good break after all of the intensity of that whole story with Laurie and that other story about the New York Summit. A good break before that final Alex/Departure Arc.
Besides....how could you not love a Michael-gets-out-of-hand episode? The drink names on the IDs were great (best was him naming Max after a non-alcoholic kiddie drink!
)...but I loved the way they made him so out-of-bounds...but then had him do something so cool at the end when he gets Maria the singing gig.
Michael was alright! :thumbsup:
Last night I watched another Michael-out-of-control episode: "Michael, The Guys, and the Great Snapple Caper" or whatever it is called.
Yeah...Maria has certainly got her hands full with HIM!
One note about episode 3x1: Armed robbery????
Nah...that one I REALLY don't buy. I can buy aliens...but Liz Parker even PRETENDING to rob a convenience store?????
No...I don't think so.
