I always had the sneaking suspicion that Janeway and Kim were fuckbuddies (at least for some time). Would explain why she never promoted him (perhaps some starfleet fraternisation rules?) and reacted as harshly when he had sex with this alien girl
Did Geordie marry a REAL girl?
- Thread starter Guy Gardener
- Start date
I always had the sneaking suspicion that Janeway and Kim were fuckbuddies (at least for some time). Would explain why she never promoted him (perhaps some starfleet fraternisation rules?) and reacted as harshly when he had sex with this alien girl
I always had the sneaking suspicion that Janeway and Kim were f*** buddies (at least for some time). Would explain why she never promoted him (perhaps some starfleet fraternisation rules?) and reacted as harshly when he had sex with this alien girl
One, that just seems a bit too... Oedipal for my taste. Two, I don't see it as a reason for Harry's non-promotion. If Janeway was trying to avoid the pretense of special treatment, she would have promoted him at the scheduled time, or after two or three years. Negative special treatment would have drawn attention just like positive special treatment: after all, it's what most of us remember first when Harry's name comes to mind.
AFAIK, Starfleet doesn't have any fraternization rules.
Picard said it didn't in "Lessons", but the whole latter half of the episode was all about why fraternization rules were prudent and necessary.
Janeway clearly acted like there were, but that might have been her own principles: she even held to them in "Resolutions", when she was nominally no longer in command of Voyager. And she certainly had issues with Tom and B'Elanna in "Scientific Method", though that might have been alien influence. After four days of pain and no sleep, she had issues with everything.
A number of characters become involved with each other, but I don't know of any lasting romance between any captain and another officer under his/her command. The only captain with a long term romance is Sisko, and Kasidy wasn't Starfleet.
Last edited:
If Starfleet has some fraternization rules at this time, it's possible that promotions and degradations are just more difficult to make for the higher ranking officer in such a relationship and not completely forbidden.
Maybe Kathy didn't want to go through all this headache and ignored the issue because of that.
Or in the case there are no such regulations, either it was a personal rule for her (no special promotions in such a case) or it was simply because she was so pissed of Harry for his tryst with the girl
Last edited:
While I certainly enjoy debating the Harry issue, I've gotten some static from the mods about discussing it out of topic. We have an active topic on the subject, in the Voyager forum. Why don't we return to the matter of Geordi, and did he marry a real person?
My theory remains that he did.
My theory remains that he did.
Okay. I'll repost my thoughts about the issue there.
Thanks. 
Regarding Will and Deanna, I expect that might be a commonplace issue, given that captains get married just like everyone else. There was a scene in "Lessons" where Riker was tempted to let Picard's relationship with Daren influence him... and think how big a pain the captain's kid could be in the ship's school, unless the captain made it very clear that no special treatment was permitted.
Maybe the LaForge clan had the right idea, and they just all served in different places.
Regarding Will and Deanna, I expect that might be a commonplace issue, given that captains get married just like everyone else. There was a scene in "Lessons" where Riker was tempted to let Picard's relationship with Daren influence him... and think how big a pain the captain's kid could be in the ship's school, unless the captain made it very clear that no special treatment was permitted.
Maybe the LaForge clan had the right idea, and they just all served in different places.
If you had 6 couples, and you could splits those couples up between anything from 12 ships to 2 ships... That might mean that when those 2, if you do split them evenly between two ships, ships meet up, and 6 couples spend 72 hours banging without a lot of caution... Someone's going to pregnant.
You can't split up people who have kids.
You can't split up people who are married.
So you can split up people who are dating.
How can you possibly get married and have children, if everytime you get close to someone, one of you gets a transfered?
It seems like if you want to be with someone, you have to get married, well before you're ready to get married, or you're doomed to a long distance tryst, that will expire quickly.
You can't split up people who have kids.
You can't split up people who are married.
So you can split up people who are dating.
How can you possibly get married and have children, if everytime you get close to someone, one of you gets a transfered?
It seems like if you want to be with someone, you have to get married, well before you're ready to get married, or you're doomed to a long distance tryst, that will expire quickly.
There's a VOY short story (I think it's in the Distant Shores collection) where Harry has a brief, but intense, fling with Marika, one of the ex-Borg from "Survival Instinct". They both know she's going to die but they resolve to make the best of it.
The assumption, after pairing off the crew that there would be a dozen single guys just standing there wondering if they can make do with passing aliens or the holodeck... Is that there is more men on Voyager than women.
But what if there wasn't?
Kathryn is going to be all about affirmative action in favour of women?
The line is that there is no sexual discrimination in the 24th century, but I can see Janeway trying to build a crew that reflects her values as a woman preferring to surround herself with not men, because frankly, men suck the air out of the room with their toxic musk.
So what happened?
20 percent of her crew died on the way to the Delta Quardant which might have been mostly women, and Chakotay's replacement crew was mostly boys.
Which leveled the gender division up close to even?
Point is, that the unpaired crew, after they run short on the appropriate genders, might be female.
Oh, it's still Kim, but but the leftover crew without a significant other, might be 4 women, perfectly fine women, nothing wrong with them, and Kim.
But what if there wasn't?
Kathryn is going to be all about affirmative action in favour of women?
The line is that there is no sexual discrimination in the 24th century, but I can see Janeway trying to build a crew that reflects her values as a woman preferring to surround herself with not men, because frankly, men suck the air out of the room with their toxic musk.
So what happened?
20 percent of her crew died on the way to the Delta Quardant which might have been mostly women, and Chakotay's replacement crew was mostly boys.
Which leveled the gender division up close to even?
Point is, that the unpaired crew, after they run short on the appropriate genders, might be female.
Oh, it's still Kim, but but the leftover crew without a significant other, might be 4 women, perfectly fine women, nothing wrong with them, and Kim.
Yeah I have to memory hole this episode. Geordi comes across as a creep, and the plot seems determined to vindicate his actions (Brahms initial rudeness and his little "I'm guilty of trying to be your friend!" rant) Yeah, no. You weren't trying to be her friend, you were hitting on her in your quarters and making her uncomfortable. Also why wasn't the Brahms hologram deleted? It served its purpose, and in "Booby Trap" Geordi seemed to have come to conclusion that getting involved with a holographic representation of a real person might not be a good idea. So why did he keep the hologram?
There used to be a website that kept track of the crew.
Gone now.
But there was like only 30ish unnamed crew out of 150.
The problem arises when you feel entitled to do the same things with real people...
Imagine this scene in a not-scifi TV show: a girl discovers that a boy has printed her image on a giant pillow left lying around.
The girl rightly gets pissed, but the guy screams louder. At that point the girl is ashamed, understands her mistakes, forgives the boy and becomes friends with him.
Then I think the writers should go into the witness protection program and change identities, because I don't think the viewers would let them get away with it.
The girl rightly gets pissed, but the guy screams louder. At that point the girl is ashamed, understands her mistakes, forgives the boy and becomes friends with him.
Then I think the writers should go into the witness protection program and change identities, because I don't think the viewers would let them get away with it.
From Blood Fever:
73 out of 148 (the crew complement a few episodes later. They started with 141, but added seven + more because of losses... *shrugs* more births than shown, I guess...) makes a gender ratio of about 50/50. Of course, there may be other genders involved, but it appears to be majority human ship, so I reckon the number is close to even.
Known (and presumed) males on Voyager in 2373 (the "73 of '73"):
* Andrews, Arkinson, Ashmore, Ayala, Walter Baxter, Pablo Baytart, Alan Bernard, David Bernard, Rick Berman, Ken Biller,
* Bob Blackman, Jerry Bono, Boylan, Brannon Braga, Freddy Bristow, Doug Bronowski, Dick Brownfield, Joe Carey, Carlson, Chakotay
* William Chapman, Ed Charnock, Jr., Jay Chattaway, Chell, Joe Chess, John Chichester, Ian Christenberry, Richard Chronister, Art Codron, Tom Conley
* Culhane, Dan Curry, Dick D'Angelo, Kenneth Dalby, Bob De La Garza, Doug Dean, Dell, Michael DeMeritt, Jon Djanrelian, Doyle
* Emmanuel, Fitzpatrick, Jerry Fleck, Frank, Gennaro, Cosmo Genovese, Gerron, Patrick Gibson, Grimes, Hargrove
* Mortimer Harren, Henard, Phil Jacobson, Richard James, Jarvin, Ralph Johnson, Harry Kim, Timothy Lang, Larson, Peter Lauritson
* David Livingston, Dennis Madalone, Jim Magdaleno, Mannus, Martin, MacAlister, Dennis McCarthy, William McKenzie, Scott McKnight, McMinn
* James Mees, Mendez, Mitchell
... plus...
* Molina, Tom Moore, Mulchaey, Murphy 1 (Michael Beebe), Murphy 2 (Shepard Ross), John Nesterowicz, Kashimura Nozawa
* O'Donnell, David Orlando, Tom Paris, Michael Parsons, Parsons, Bill Peets, Michael Piller, Jerry Platt, Charlie Quizzlink, Pierre Rahn
* Abraham Rawski, Tony Reynolds, Keith Rockefeller, Rollins, George Rosa, David Rossi, Marvin Rush, Russell, Alan Sims, Brian Sofin
* David Stipes, Michael Stradling, Strickler, Rick Sternbach, Mark Stimson, Ron Surma, Tabor, Angelo Tassoni, William Telfer, Thompson
* Bill Thoms, Jim Thorpe, Tuvok, Vorik, Brad Yacobian, Yosa
...for a total of about 116 males (these are all survivors of Caretaker, btw). Some of them are probably dead, but 43 of them? And the crew complement doesn't seem to fluctuate wildly throughout the series, usually between 141 and 148, so if there are massive die-offs, where are the extra people coming from? This is years before the Equinox crew was added.
I haven't counted the women, but there are way more than 32 of them. Just in case we were thinking that Vorik was being more selective in his count of partners for Torres (even if he said he wasn't).
