2021 Emmy Nominations

[Richard S. Ta]

I'm not saying go all in, like I have, but don't be afraid to speak up. Don't let them intimidate you. Add your voice and bring something to the table. What's the worst that can happen? Someone disagrees with you? Someone flames you? If they flame you, they broke the rules. If they disagree with you, that's just how it goes.

Lord Garth, I haven't been here long but I just would like to say I'm glad you're sticking around.

I don't mind sticking my oar into a debate, but honestly the majority of my doings in that area are over on Gallifreybase (Doctor Who forum, under the same name) where things are way nastier than they are here. Plus, though I love it, I'm way less invested in Star Trek than I am Who.

It is tiring. In a perfect world we'd have nobody mouthing off on here about how everything is so 'woke' in Trek these days, or folks mouthing off about how the latest iteration of Trek is shit, compared to the other iterations that they also hated when they were new. Sadly, it is what it is and there are, on any forum, any number of people who are just plain stupid who pipe out the above mentioned crap as 'facts'.

Regardless, I'm pleased to see the forum won't lose a good contributor and a gent. I was gonna send you a PM when you said you're done to plead with you to stay, but finally I decided it was weird because I've only been here a few months and don't know you from Adam. You're one of the good guys and we need that, 'cause there's way too many of the bad.

 

[gblews]

No nomination for writing or acting.
No nomination for directing, cinematography or editing.
Not even a nomination for production design or costumes.

Only nominations for technical proficiency.
Color me surprised!

And only four nominations!
For comparison:

I guess your point is that because DSC only got tech, and hair and make-up noms that that reflects poorly on the shows writing, acting and production? Not sure.

I think the Emmys are a prestigious award but it certainly is not the definitive, objective arbiter on what is good or bad on TV,

For example, I don’t think The Expanse has ever been nominated and that show, by many accounts, including my own, is crazy good. You think lack of Emmy noms means The Expanse sucks? You might even have a point if DSC had no awards, but that is not the case. I swear, the Emmys must have an unwritten rule that Trek shows can only get one type of nom.

This may be the reason SAG gave the casts of all the Trek show casts a special award on SAG’s award show several years ago.

So, using Emmy noms as a means of bashing DSC is particularly weak.

 

[Locutus of Bored]

No nomination for writing or acting.
No nomination for directing, cinematography or editing.
Not even a nomination for production design or costumes.

Only nominations for technical proficiency.
Color me surprised!

With the exception of an Outstanding Drama Series nomination in its final season, all of TNG's Emmy nominations were in the Creative Arts / Daytime Emmy's / technical categories as well. As were all of DS9's, Voy's, and Ent's. Pretty standard for the franchise, really.

 

[lightspeedbear]

I guess your point is that because DSC only got tech and name-up noms that that reflects poorly on the shows writing, acting and production? Not sure.

I think the Emmys are a prestigious award but it certainly is not thedefinitive, objective arbiter on what is good or bad on TV,

For example, I don’t think The Expanse has ever been nominated and that show, by many accounts, including ny own, is crazy good. You think lack of Emmy noms means The Expanse sucks? You might even have a point if DSC had no awards, but that is not the case. I swear, the Emmys must have an unwritten rule that Trek shows can only get one type of nom.

This may be the reason SAG gave the casts of all the Trek show casts a special award on SAG’s award show several years ago.

So, using Emmy noms as a means of bashing DSC is particularly weak.

I'm struggling to think what Emmys Discovery deserves though. Definitely not ones for writing, that much is beyond argument. Also no to editing or direction. Cinematography possibly, although the cold amber/teal grading they use for the entire show is cliched and generic. Seriously, scroll through the episode list of season 3 on Netflix and see if you can spot any other colours on this show. I watched a couple episodes of season 3 with a friend the other day followed by two Mandalorian episodes and the difference in quality was night and day. Discovery almost gives me a headache watching it, especially with all the visual noise, Mando was clean and crisp by comparison, and quite beautiful. Nothing is over-designed like on Disco.

 

[Mudd]

What fantasy series has ever been a strong Emmy contender? Game of Thrones?

 

[fireproof78]

Mando was clean and crisp by comparison, and quite beautiful. Nothing is over-designed like on Disco.

So visuals automatically mean good? If that's the case The Phantom Menace is a masterpiece.

 

[lightspeedbear]

So visuals automatically mean good? If that's the case The Phantom Menace is a masterpiece.

I was talking about the various nominations Discovery, could have been up for, in that case: cinematography. Hence the:

Cinematography possibly

bit preceding the rest.

 

[fireproof78]

I was talking about cinematography. Hence the:

No, I get that. But, it's a meaningless category save for tawdry glory.

 

[lightspeedbear]

No, I get that. But, it's a meaningless category save for tawdry glory.

You really need to have the last word in everything don't you? Ok. Cinematography is meaningless. Cool.

 

[cooleddie74]

Trek rarely gets acting nods for major awards outside of performers like Nimoy. That's just how the franchise has operated going all the way back to the late '60s.

 

[fireproof78]

You really need to have the last word in everything don't you? Ok. Cinematography is meaningless. Cool.

No, not really. Nor was that my point.

But, I'm curious, upon further reflection. What would it mean if Star Trek did get the Emmy?

 

[Jayson1]

Shatner, Nimoy, Stewart, Spiner, Auberjonis, Vistor, Shimerman and Picardo would have all been worthy Emmy winners and Robinson as Garak in The Wire episode for guest appearances which I believe people get Emmys for.

 

[fireproof78]

Shatner, Nimoy, Stewart, Spiner, Auberjonis, Vistor, Shimerman and Picardo would have all been worthy Emmy winners and Robinson as Garak in The Wire episode for guest appearances which I believe people get Emmys for.

But what does that mean? There are many performances I think are "worthy" from my lay person's perspective but that is because I'm moved. I don't know if it would more moving because award.

 

[Jayson1]

I think it would especially back then give Trek and sci fi more mainstream credibility. More respect than it often gets.

 

[fireproof78]

I think it would especially back then give Trek and sci fi more mainstream credibility. More respect than it often gets.

Interesting.

 

[CorporalClegg]

Shatner, Nimoy, Stewart, Spiner, Auberjonis, Vistor, Shimerman and Picardo would have all been worthy Emmy winners and Robinson as Garak in The Wire episode for guest appearances which I believe people get Emmys for.

Sorry Jason, but nothing any of those have done for Star Trek is Emmy worthy. Not in the slightest.

 

[Sci]

That was in service to the story, very different.

In Tilly and Stamets' case it was just expletive for the sake of it.

In Tilly/Statmets's case, it was in service to the story. The entire point of that exchange was Stamets starting to emotionally connect to Tilly for the first time, by sharing in a small mutual "taboo" of using the word fuck. It was the first step into what has become an enduring friendship between the two characters.

I'm struggling to think what Emmys Discovery deserves though.

"Forget Me Not" was an incredibly moving, well-written, well-acted piece of television, and it would be entirely worthy of a writing, directing, and acting nomination.

 

[gblews]

I'm struggling to think what Emmys Discovery deserves though. Definitely not ones for writing, that much is beyond argument. Also no to editing or direction. Cinematography possibly, although the cold amber/teal grading they use for the entire show is cliched and generic. Seriously, scroll through the episode list of season 3 on Netflix and see if you can spot any other colours on this show. I watched a couple episodes of season 3 with a friend the other day followed by two Mandalorian episodes and the difference in quality was night and day. Discovery almost gives me a headache watching it, especially with all the visual noise, Mando was clean and crisp by comparison, and quite beautiful. Nothing is over-designed like on Disco.

Yes, I get that you don’t like DSC, but the point of my post was that maybe Emmy noms aren’t the best way to judge a sci-fi show, particularly a Star Trek show. The Emmys have consistently overlooked all Trek shows, so the fact that it again under nominated a Trek show says, perhaps, more about the Emmys than it does DSC.

The Emmys have consistently ignored a great show like The Expanse as well, not to mention ignoring most of the sci-fi shows. I”d say that the fact they acknowledged DSC’s existence, unlike some of the other sci-fi shows released over the last few years, is definitely a positive for DSC.

No, DSC didn’t get any of the prestige Emmy noms, hut if the show was as objectively bad as you say it is, how do you explain all the other awards the show has gotten?

BTW, I feel the opposite about DSC. I think it is one of a very few great sci-fi shows to be released in the last 4-5 years: as evidenced by the show’s popularity and the accolades it has wracked up.

 

[lightspeedbear]

In Tilly/Statmets's case, it was in service to the story. The entire point of that exchange was Stamets starting to emotionally connect to Tilly for the first time, by sharing in a small mutual "taboo" of using the word fuck. It was the first step into what has become an enduring friendship between the two characters.

If you head canon it like that, then yes it's in service to character development (not plot), but in the most minuscule and (imo) silly way.

It's funny you say that actually, I've finally plucked up the motivation to watch season 3 in the past week. The third or fourth episode, Tilly and Stamets had this bizarrely out of the blue and paper thin argument in the science lab. Really strange but no less than I would expect from the writing department. Maybe they should have said fuck and that would have made it all better!

No, DSC didn’t get any of the prestige Emmy noms, hut if the show was as objectively bad as you say it is, how do you explain all the other awards the show has gotten?

BTW, I feel the opposite about DSC. I think it is one of a very few great sci-fi shows to be released in the last 4-5 years: as evidenced by the show’s popularity and the accolades it has wracked up.

Trek always gotten nominations for visuals or make-up or costumes. My personal issues with the show are to do with the writing, the direction, the acting, the characters. I'm no fan of the high contrast, blurry, terribly lit visual effects either but I'm sure some people like it.

I'm not saying that no nominations = bad, I'm saying I can't really think of any nominations it deserved.

I'll take your word for it on its popularity, all I ever hear about Discovery online is how people hate it and can't wait for Strange New Worlds. 50%, 36% and 41% on Rotten Tomatoes audience score doesn't scream "popular" to me though

 

[Sci]

In Tilly/Statmets's case, it was in service to the story. The entire point of that exchange was Stamets starting to emotionally connect to Tilly for the first time, by sharing in a small mutual "taboo" of using the word fuck. It was the first step into what has become an enduring friendship between the two characters.

If you head canon it like that,

That's not head canon. That's the text of the show.

then yes it's in service to character development (not plot),

Good writing is not just about plot.

but in the most minuscule and (imo) silly way.

It was neither minuscule nor silly.

It's funny you say that actually, I've finally plucked up the motivation to watch season 3 in the past week. The third or fourth episode, Tilly and Stamets had this bizarrely out of the blue and paper thin argument in the science lab.

Which scene was this?