The best part is that none of it actually happens. So it makes this approach very easy!
What's the worst canon decision in the history of Trek?
- Thread starter Unimatrix Q
- Start date
The best part is that none of it actually happens. So it makes this approach very easy!
I guess I don't find it insane. That line obviously varies.
Mirror universe anywhere else but TOS.
MU worked well back in the 60s but not again after that. In DS9 it was somewhat OK but everytime it pops up in DSC it just grinds me the wrong way. So much that I'm not interested in that series at all these days.
MU worked well back in the 60s but not again after that. In DS9 it was somewhat OK but everytime it pops up in DSC it just grinds me the wrong way. So much that I'm not interested in that series at all these days.
The first DS9 was good. You could take it “seriously.” The rest leaned in to the campiness too much.
Some people like the ENT episodes, but aside from Hoshi, the new intro, and the delight of seeing a Constitution Class and Gorn again, it wasn’t up my alley. I don’t enjoy evil people being evil and winning and that’s that. That’s the given when we get there. If we don’t have a good reason for being there, it’s a rather awful place.
DSC did it okay. You wonder why a starship captain on our side is the Terran emperor on theirs, but you get that it’s more about using your cast than doing a “perfect” mirror, especially as Jaresh-Inyo couldn’t be the Terran emperor, could he?
Somewhere, beneath that exterior, is a much more assertive person.
You mean he's really not an evolved cow?
I give him more props than most. You can’t rise to that high a position if you’re not a formidable person.
But overall the Terran empire doesn’t work as a one to one reflection of the Federation. It was easy on TOS because there was exactly one alien on the entire ship?
But even if everyone in the UFP is eeeeevil, they can’t be mostly independent evil without a human in sight, with humans being a minority at the upper echelons of government, and it be the same Terran Empire.Although I’d love for someone to figure out how it could work mostly 1:1.
We were dumber than cows way back when. On his planet maybe the primates there still are.
No.
I think if one tries to imagine the Empire too far out then sure, it doesn't work. But, as a mirror of the characters we know? Works fine as that dramatic conceit.I give him more props than most. You can’t rise to that high a position if you’re not a formidable person.
But overall the Terran empire doesn’t work as a one to one reflection of the Federation. It was easy on TOS because there was exactly one alien on the entire ship?
Although I’d love for someone to figure out how it could work mostly 1:1.
From my perspective, the Empire is predicated on the strongest survive. Which means that relying on people can be construed as a weakness, while mutual need can be manipulated to ensure continued survival. Aliens work as the other for them to set their anger and hatred against.
Kurtzman Era: Michael Burnham being Spock's brother. Nothing wrong with Burnham being adopted by Vulcans, or looking to Sarek & Amanda Grayson as mentors, or Spock holding value to Burnham as a childhood friend. But being siblings? That means Burnham was probably familiar to Sybok as well. As well as gives off small universe syndrome for the post-ENT, pre-TOS universe.
Now, if she was adopted by the children of T’Pol or Soval or T’Pau or Kos, then it would have been better received.
Pre-Kurtzman: Introducing phase pistols and phase cannons into ENT instead of sticking with the EM pistol & high yield plasma cannons. It contradicted “A Matter of Time” even though a couple of other factoids regarding 22nd tech turned out to be true. The bit about warp coils being important is true, as seen with the entire series of ENT (even though the emphasis is placed on the warp engine created by Archer’s dad) and space boomers before them, and highlighted specifically in the episode “Damage”. The bit about surgical masks and gloves being present were true, through “A Night in Sickbay” at least. But the issues over phasers is an inaccuracy that makes the difference between phase pistols/cannons in the 22nd century and phasers in the late 23rd century and beyond something so technical in regards to emissions, type of technology, and type of atomic/subatomic particles. And does not explain why Worf ignored United Earth Starfleet’s use of phase pistols and phase cannons. Just because it was not in widespread use and was exclusive to United Earth Starfleet personnel does not mean it wasn’t in use.
Although maybe he was testing to see if Rasmussen would correct him.
Now, if she was adopted by the children of T’Pol or Soval or T’Pau or Kos, then it would have been better received.
Pre-Kurtzman: Introducing phase pistols and phase cannons into ENT instead of sticking with the EM pistol & high yield plasma cannons. It contradicted “A Matter of Time” even though a couple of other factoids regarding 22nd tech turned out to be true. The bit about warp coils being important is true, as seen with the entire series of ENT (even though the emphasis is placed on the warp engine created by Archer’s dad) and space boomers before them, and highlighted specifically in the episode “Damage”. The bit about surgical masks and gloves being present were true, through “A Night in Sickbay” at least. But the issues over phasers is an inaccuracy that makes the difference between phase pistols/cannons in the 22nd century and phasers in the late 23rd century and beyond something so technical in regards to emissions, type of technology, and type of atomic/subatomic particles. And does not explain why Worf ignored United Earth Starfleet’s use of phase pistols and phase cannons. Just because it was not in widespread use and was exclusive to United Earth Starfleet personnel does not mean it wasn’t in use.
Although maybe he was testing to see if Rasmussen would correct him.
In Enterprise, there have been some really bad decisions. For example Archer siding with Shran who had just beat the crap out of him for I don't know how long against the Vulcans who were supposed to be their allies.
On one hand, you have some new species that you didn't know anything about who resort to hostage-taking and torture to get what they want and on the other hand, you have long-time allies. Whom are you going to side with? Archer's decision was nothing short of traitorous and he was lucky the consequences weren't direr than that. The Vulcans could have decided to stop all relations with Star Fleet and remove T'pol immediately and it would have been perfectly justified.
Let's face it, if the deck wasn't stacked in favor of Archer, it's exactly what would have happened.
On one hand, you have some new species that you didn't know anything about who resort to hostage-taking and torture to get what they want and on the other hand, you have long-time allies. Whom are you going to side with? Archer's decision was nothing short of traitorous and he was lucky the consequences weren't direr than that. The Vulcans could have decided to stop all relations with Star Fleet and remove T'pol immediately and it would have been perfectly justified.
Let's face it, if the deck wasn't stacked in favor of Archer, it's exactly what would have happened.
In a lot of ways, the first stone that helped create the Federation was laid right there.
Still small universe but slightly more tolerable.
Indeed. This is one of my biggest frustrations with Enterprise was the insistence that it have these familiar elements, which pretty much negated the purpose of a more primitive starship. Yeah, we are super primitive and have hull plating percentages rather than shield percentages.
Yeah, the complete betrayal of a long time ally is inexcusable.
Indeed. This is one of my biggest frustrations with Enterprise was the insistence that it have these familiar elements, which pretty much negated the purpose of a more primitive starship. Yeah, we are super primitive and have hull plating percentages rather than shield percentages.
NO #@*$!-ING KIDDING! And they finished the job later in the series by making transporter travel routine and changing out the spatial torpedoes for "photonic" (i.e. PHOTON) torpedoes.
It’s one of those risks that ENT should have taken, seeing the Vulcans just abandon Earth due to poor diplomacy from Archer. Could have made for a nice redemption arc.
It’s that they made Sarek’s Burnham’s adoptive father just because he was in TOS. Even though DIS S1 would have a number of references to ENT.
Indeed. This is one of my biggest frustrations with Enterprise was the insistence that it have these familiar elements, which pretty much negated the purpose of a more primitive starship. Yeah, we are super primitive and have hull plating percentages rather than shield percentages.
And they could have just kept the spatial torpedo casing, and therefore make the photonic torpedoes look “primitive” during the ENT era.
The stun setting being the new feature of the EM pistol was believable. And probably could have had an interesting story behind that.
And if low yield plasm cannons were good enough for freighters to deal with breaking up asteroids and meteors, why couldn’t making the plasma cannon switch between high and low yields be good enough for Enterprise?
Having a transporter (which should have been half its size in height if it was going to be there), better sensors, a pair of shuttlepods, a pair of grapplers, a warp 5 engine and a crew compliment of 83 should still qualify as state of the art. Phase pistols and phase cannons is going overboard.
Making her related to an ENT reference is just as small universe as TOS.
Yeah, I don't remember any of that either.
I don't recall Guinan referring to anyone but herself?
I should have put some parentheses in there. This was the impression I got from the novelization.
There were El Aurians and Starfleet people killed, but some were sucked into the Nexus and pulled back (eg Guinan), leaving their echoes behind. Maybe Soren went mad because he had no Echo left behing? Kirk was trapped intact. Then Picard.
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I like cheese.
What Starfleet people?
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