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So how important is canon, then?

From that era myself, and I always understood that the books/games/comics/toys weren't official storylines, but would have always assumed that the live action stuff needed to all be compatible.... even then in my mid-teens I was bothered by things like the Scotty/Kirk/Enterprise disparity between Relics and Generations, and thought there could have been more TOS easter eggs in TNG.
 
even then in my mid-teens I was bothered by things like the Scotty/Kirk/Enterprise disparity between Relics and Generations

That one is pretty easy to paper over if it bothers you, Scott’s brain was a bit scrambled after spending 75 years in a transporter buffer.
 
From that era myself, and I always understood that the books/games/comics/toys weren't official storylines, but would have always assumed that the live action stuff needed to all be compatible.... even then in my mid-teens I was bothered by things like the Scotty/Kirk/Enterprise disparity between Relics and Generations, and thought there could have been more TOS easter eggs in TNG.
I mean, I suppose but I don't think it needs to line up with 100% compatibility.
 
That one is pretty easy to paper over if it bothers you, Scott’s brain was a bit scrambled after spending 75 years in a transporter buffer.

Yeah, thats the go-to answer now, just saying it stands out in my mind as one of the first "Ahh! Canon!" arguments in my Trek history lol.

There are a lot of early fanon assumptions that got congealed in my 12-14 year old brain, as well, like Kirk being the youngest Captain ever, or Spock being the only Vulcan/human hybrid ever (or at least the first) lol.
 
Yeah, thats the go-to answer now, just saying it stands out in my mind as one of the first "Ahh! Canon!" arguments in my Trek history lol.

There are a lot of early fanon assumptions that got congealed in my 12-14 year old brain, as well, like Kirk being the youngest Captain ever, or Spock being the only Vulcan/human hybrid ever (or at least the first) lol.
DISC ended that notion which never made any sense. Billions of Humans and Vulcans, in 200 years only two get married and have children? Even when real human society was at its most racist, there were consensual inter racial relationships
 
Question for discussion: why is continuity pretty highly regarded in the Marvel Cinematic Universe, while the median opinion of continuity for Trek appears to be "If you can make it fit continuity, sure, why not?"

As far as I can recall, I don't think I've ever read a review or a comment about the MCU which was along the lines of "These movies fit together nearly seamlessly, and I guess that's OK, but their efforts could have been better spent elsewhere." The MCU receives praise for its efforts, usually with acknowledgement that it makes the stories more believable and the characters more understandable.
 
Question for discussion: why is continuity pretty highly regarded in the Marvel Cinematic Universe, while the median opinion of continuity for Trek appears to be "If you can make it fit continuity, sure, why not?"

As far as I can recall, I don't think I've ever read a review or a comment about the MCU which was along the lines of "These movies fit together nearly seamlessly, and I guess that's OK, but their efforts could have been better spent elsewhere." The MCU receives praise for its efforts, usually with acknowledgement that it makes the stories more believable and the characters more understandable.

People have less imagination, and are more OCD now.
 
DISC ended that notion which never made any sense. Billions of Humans and Vulcans, in 200 years only two get married and have children? Even when real human society was at its most racist, there were consensual inter racial relationships
I guess the Vulcans were more against it than the Humans - and if you only do it every 7 years with prearranged marriages... it's not easy XD
 
Yes, seriously. There is less apparent willingness to use one's imagination and more inclination to want word of god confirmation for all the most minute of details. At least, that is the impression I get with questions of canonization and continuity being a regular feature.

I don't think writing something that fits in an established universe and writing something imaginative are mutually exclusive...
 
I don't think writing something that fits in an established universe and writing something imaginative are mutually exclusive...
Since that isn't what I said I don't think that tracks very well.

I think fans are more OCD and less imaginative when it comes to their interaction materials at times.
 
If we're veering into that somewhat vague canon/continuity territory (again), my answer would be that in my opinion, its main function still is to give a framework of reference to tell entertaining and inspiring stories in. Within those constraints, a lot goes. I don't mind inconsistencies, it's all fiction anyway- it doesn't (necessarily) spoil the immersion for me. I couldn't care less if Picard's first command would have been something else than the Stargazer in a future TNG reboot. I don't mind the new timelines created since 2009 existing along the old ones.

However, I wouldn't accept a version in which e.g. the Federation is shown to be a cynical joke, with hypocritical officers, outwardly friendly, but inwardly secretly conniving. A Picard that covertly abuses his position of authority to further his own interests. A Riker that takes advantage of the female ensigns under his command, knowing that they won't dare to complain, etc. In short, a version that betrays the core notion that in the future, humankind can better itself. That stuff can be acceptable for "evil mirror universe" episodes at best.
 
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Question for discussion: why is continuity pretty highly regarded in the Marvel Cinematic Universe, while the median opinion of continuity for Trek appears to be "If you can make it fit continuity, sure, why not?"

Because the MCU gets way more credit for its continuity than it really deserves. I mean, if you really sit down and think through MCU continuity, it all falls apart pretty quickly. For instance: How is it that SHIELD was in the middle of building a big giant Triskelion building on Roosevelt Island in the Potomac River in 1989 (as established by Ant-Man), and yet it was so obscure as an organization that Agent Coulson kept giving out its name in 2010 or 2011 without anyone having heard of them (per Iron Man)? (It's even worse in Agents of SHIELD, which establishes that SHIELD's existence was literally unknown to the public until The Avengers -- as though no one was going to ask what the giant skyscraper of an HQ was doing just off the Lincoln Memorial!)

And there's more: If Hydra agents controlled a significant percentage of SHIELD before they were exposed in 2014, how come they didn't just steal the Tesseract away to a Hydra base decades before Fury began trying to experiment with Asgardian technology? If the Winter Soldier was a brainwashed Hydra assassin, why did he wear a Soviet red star and speak Russian? (Seriously -- why would you brainwash an English-speaker with your Russian branch? Much easier to brainwash someone using the language of their birth.) Avengers: Endgame establishes that you can't actually change your own past and time travel just creates new branching timelines... and then somehow magically Steve Rogers is there at the end, elderly, after having traveled back in time, having used up all his time travel serum, and somehow he's magically back in his own timeline instead of the branching timeline he created by staying with Peggy. In Spider-Man: Far From Home, we find that the overwhelming trauma of the Snappening -- with its cities so devastated that they're partially in ruins even five years later -- is just brushed aside for the fun and whimsy of Peter's adventure. We're supposed to buy that the clash of the Avengers was a huge deal that could lead to serious prison time in Civil War, but then Ant-Man and the Wasp reveals Scott only gets house arrest? And how exactly did the Hulk end up on Trash Planet?

And that's not even trying to figure out how to add events from the MCU-branded TV shows in. I have no idea how or where to fit in Wilson Fisk setting half of Manhattan on fire in S1 of Daredevil, for instance.

Then there's just the messed up timeline. Avengers: Endgame establishes that the original Avengers film took place in 2012. The Avengers establishes that it takes place one year after Thor. Thor takes place the same week as Iron Man 2, and Iron Man 2 takes place six months after Iron Man. Spider-Man: Homecoming's opening establishes that it takes place eight years after The Avengers, and dialogue establishes it is set six months after Captain America: Civil War. Dialogue in CA:CW establishes that it is set eight years after IM. That gives us this timeline, using 2012 for The Avengers as our baseline:

Year -1.5 (Iron Man) = Late 2010 at the earliest
Year -1 (Thor, Iron Man 2) = Mid-2011
Year 0 (The Avengers) = Mid-2012
Year 6.5 (Captain America: Civil War, 8 years after Year -1.5) = Mid-2018
Year 7 (Spider-Man: Homecoming, .5 years after CA:CW) = late 2018 or early 2019...
But Spider-Man: Homecoming is also supposed to be eight years after Avengers, which would put it into 2020...!

As far as I can recall, I don't think I've ever read a review or a comment about the MCU which was along the lines of "These movies fit together nearly seamlessly, and I guess that's OK, but their efforts could have been better spent elsewhere." The MCU receives praise for its efforts, usually with acknowledgement that it makes the stories more believable and the characters more understandable.

Again, people severely overstate the continuity of the MCU films. Not only are they full of little errors, but, more to the point, up until the Infinity War/Endgame duology, the continuity bits don't really matter to the individual films. Yeah, it's nice that we've seen Martin Freeman and Andy Serkis before, but Black Panther would not be a fundamentally different film if they were absent. Seeing Black Widow in Iron Man 2 and The Avengers adds some depth to her role in Captain America: The Winter Soldier, but honestly The Winter Soldier could have been done immediately after The First Avenger without much loss of quality. Guardians of the Galaxy's crossovers pre-IW/EG are almost nonexistent. For most of the MCU films, the bits of continuity are just little Easter eggs either tacked on at the end (e.g., Thanos in Avengers: Age of Ultron or Benecio Del Torro's character at the end of Thor: The Dark World), or are minor elements compared to a larger plot. Hell, they event had to re-write their own continuity on the fly and insert a random scene of Cate Blanchett calling the Infinity Gauntlet on display in Asgard's vault "fake" in Thor: Ragnarok so that the forging of the Gauntlet could be a plot point in Avengers: Infinity War.

Really, MCU creates more of an illusion of continuity than real full continuity. And their attitude towards continuity basically boils down to, "Try to make it look like it fits together, but don't let that get in the way of the story." Which is basically what the median attitude towards ST continuity is.
 
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I think fans are more OCD and less imaginative when it comes to their interaction materials at times.

So, in the context of my original question, one implication of your statement is that Trek fans are more imaginative and less OCD than MCU fans. I'm not saying that's not true; I've studied fandom a lot, though, and it doesn't seem to be true. In my experience, there's a large amount of crossover between Trek fans and MCU fans. Do you find that MCU fans are more OCD?
 
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