Did they ever release The God Thing?

[Allyn Gibson]

If an unused movie concept was going to be turned into a book, I'd be a lot more interested in the original Renaissance First Contact than I would be in this. The only problem with that one is that I'm not sure if it ever made it beyond a general idea.

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I'm also unclear if it ever got past an idea stage. Maybe there was a story outline, but I don't think there was a script. The whole idea of it -- the Borg in Renaissance Italy, laying siege to a castle, with Leonardo da Vinci (presumably Flint) -- is so off-concept that I can't believe they actually considered it. I can see this as a Doctor Who story -- Cybermen, Leonardo, the Renaissance, the whole nine yards -- but Star Trek? It's so weird I want to know what they were thinking.

I think about this time Jack Dann's The Memory Cathedral, a novel about da Vinci and Machiavelli, came out. It's really good, I remember really liking it.

I'd be curious about a book based on the aborted fourth Kelvin movie in which Kirk meets his dead father for some reason.

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Though Diane Carey used some of the concept for Ship of the Line (Picard consulting with Kirk on the holodeck), I'd like to see something done with Maurice Hurley's script for the seventh film. And if Braga and Moore's A versus D story ever got past outline stage, before it was abandoned for the Nexus story, I'd like to see that, too.

 

[DGCatAniSiri]

I don’t know about it as an adaptation of the idea, but one of the 90s Marvel comics (I believe it was Star Trek Unlimited #7) did do a story where Q and Trelane swapped TOS-era Kirk and Enterprise-E era Picard, then set them against one another, using their abilities to make them even and the other ship appear as an enemy. I think that’s as close to an actual adaptation to the Enterprise versus Enterprise idea as has been done, since wasn’t the problem that Braga and Moore ran into when they wanted to use it was how to get them to fight?

 

[JD]

I disagree vehemently.

Why is Marc Cushman still releasing TOS era books? Why was there a Phase II tome? Why is Susan Sackett still running a website for her book?
With the first two, I think that's more of a general interest in TOS, not necessarily Roddeberry specifically. Even with the franchise coming back in a big, I rarely ever see people talk about Rodenberry or his writing, especially compared to a certain other Space franchise where I rarely see a conversation occur where the original creator isn't mentioned.
There’s a market for it.

I like your ideas and want to subscribe to your newsletter.

I'm also unclear if it ever got past an idea stage. Maybe there was a story outline, but I don't think there was a script. The whole idea of it -- the Borg in Renaissance Italy, laying siege to a castle, with Leonardo da Vinci (presumably Flint) -- is so off-concept that I can't believe they actually considered it. I can see this as a Doctor Who story -- Cybermen, Leonardo, the Renaissance, the whole nine yards -- but Star Trek? It's so weird I want to know what they were thinking.

I hadn't heard that about anything about the castle or DaVinci or any of that.
The fact that is is so unlike what we get from Star Trek is a big part of why I'd be interested.

 

[Steve Roby]

I disagree vehemently.

Why is Marc Cushman still releasing TOS era books? Why was there a Phase II tome? Why is Susan Sackett still running a website for her book?

There’s a market for it.

In reverse order...

Susan Sackett's book was published in 2002 by a small press. The fact that it came from a small press means the large publishers didn't think there was a market for it eighteen years ago. That Sackett still has a website tells us nothing about whether there's a market for a book today.

The Phase II book was published in 1997 by Pocket. I don't remember for certain, but I seem to recall hearing that it was a disappointment, sales-wise, and I know I saw a lot of remaindered copies over the next few years. There was also some scuttlebutt about possibly adapting some Phase II scripts as novels, I seem to recall, but the sales of the nonfiction book suggested there was no market for it. Vague, I know, but there hasn't been anything to follow up on that book in 23 years, which is certainly suggestive.

Marc Cushman's books are niche products, published by what appears to be his own company at a higher price than books from a mainstream publisher would go for. They are selling to a small percentage of hardcore Star Trek fans. Based on the first one, the only one I've read so far, they're also not reliable sources. If you have to publish something yourself, once again, that suggests the major publishers do not see a market for it.

 

[Mysterion]

There was also some scuttlebutt about possibly adapting some Phase II scripts as novels, I seem to recall, but the sales of the nonfiction book suggested there was no market for it.

I would absolutely buy/read those! Especially a novelization of the Kitumba two-parter - it would be an epic alternate view of the Klingon's culture/society. If I was in charge of all time and space, I'd get KRAD to do the adaptation.

 

[EnriqueH]

Ok fine.

Lets say they won’t make money.

Solution: PUBLISH THE DAMN THINGS ONLINE!

No harm, no foul.

 

[JD]

Obviously somebody involved must think there is some sort of harm since they haven't been able to actually get them to a publishable point in over 2 decades.

 

[Daddy Todd]

Obviously somebody involved must think there is some sort of harm since they haven't been able to actually get them to a publishable point in over 2 decades.

Four and a half decades, but your point is well taken. There were reports that Roddenberry was working on novelizing his rejected script as early as 1976 or ‘77.

 

[JD]

Oh, well I think that just proves my point even more. If it hasn't happened in 40+ years, then there's probably a good reason for that.

 

[EnriqueH]

Ugh!

My curiosity will always get the better of me.

Good, bad.

We won’t know until we see it or read it.

I want to read Planet of the Titans too.

 

[Saul]

I'd be curious about a book based on the aborted fourth Kelvin movie in which Kirk meets his dead father for some reason.

How about a book or comic (hello IDW?) based on that, the Starfleet Academy movie, The Romulan War Movie, The Planet of the Titans movie (with Toshiro Mifune as a Klingon) and the Kelvin/Prime crossover movie by Robert Oric.
Heck, while we are at it throw in Ghostbusters 3 and George Lucas's Episodes 7,8,9.

It must be exposed and be brought out into the light....

Ok, this is going way back here on the Trek BBS but if you remember I mentioned a member called 'The God Thing'. He released a bunch of Phase II scripts on this board. It's a big no no to do that here so his posts were taken down but i'm sure there are people here who have them. I don't know exactly what got released but if I remember correctly I think he got some of those scripts from ebay or private seller.

 

[EnriqueH]

How about a book or comic (hello IDW?) based on that, the Starfleet Academy movie, The Romulan War Movie, The Planet of the Titans movie (with Toshiro Mifune as a Klingon) and the Kelvin/Prime crossover movie by Robert Oric.
Heck, while we are at it throw in Ghostbusters 3 and George Lucas's Episodes 7,8,9.

Oooof. You’re speaking my language.

 

[Therin of Andor]

You’ve got to wonder just how far along Friedman’s manuscript was in the 90’s? Considering that they had full-color artwork of not just the front but also back and side flaps of a dust jacket released and an audio book version in pre-production (and the artwork for that was similar but with a hyphen and in b&w), it had to have been at a level where the Koenig and Sackett versions never got.

I asked him in person in 2014. I had assumed he had done quite a bit before Majel called a halt to it, mainly because of the cover art shown in the Diamond distribution catalog. But MJF reckoned he got no further than a several-page proposal for how he intended to expand what already existed. (Although he mentioned a sample chapter to Steve Roby for his site.) He wanted to add a few major new characters. Majel felt it would overshadow GR's contribution. The cover art for the hardcover and the audio were done well in advance because Pocket had not anticipated having to cancel.

a hyphen and in b&w...

Only because the copies that survived into fan collections were the clippings from the Diamond catalog.

 

[BobbyPeru1]

There is a finished first draft of the novel, fully written (and revising/completing the collaboration between Roddenberry and Koenig), though I can't find any reference to it anywhere in any of the articles online. The title page identifies it as STAR TREK: THE GOD THING by Gene Roddenberry FIRST DRAFT NOVEL February 15, 1977. much of it resembles the the manuscript held by the anonymous collector who contacted Steve Roby, but after page 69, there are more recently typed pages revising what Koenig wrote that bring the total page count to 160 and finishing with a THE END. I know because I have a copy of it, Which I acquired in 1996 or 1997. I photocopied it from a file where I worked - it had been sent to my employer by a publisher for consideration. (Me doing this obviously wasn't authorized, so forgive me for being intentionally vague here). At the time I just thought it looked interesting so I copied it to read, not knowing anything about its history or controversial/mythical status, then forgot all about it until recently when I read about the original script and potential novelization online. As to the status of what is happening to it now I have no idea - I left that job in 2005, and the person who it was sent to and possessed the file had left the company even before that. Considering your conversation though, I thought you'd be interested to know that there is at least one competed draft of the book so there is at least something that could be published. Happy to provide more info regarding the contents if you're interested...

 

[Steve Roby]

Happy to provide more info regarding the contents if you're interested...

Pretty sure we're all interested.

 

[BobbyPeru1]

Pretty sure we're all interested.

Since you've seen parts of the 1976 WIP manuscript, you would be probably the best judge of the authenticity of the draft. Anything particular pages I could pass along to get the ball rolling?

 

[drt]

Since you've seen parts of the 1976 WIP manuscript, you would be probably the best judge of the authenticity of the draft. Anything particular pages I could pass along to get the ball rolling?

"Y'all take a listen. You'll hear the deep sound coming down from Bobby Peru."

On a more serious note, is there any indication who did the revisions you mentioned?

 

[Allyn Gibson]

On a more serious note, is there any indication who did the revisions you mentioned?

Given the timeframe of the anecdote (mid-90s, after the Friedman project fell apart) and his role as Roddenberry's official biographer, I wonder if it might be David Alexander. Perhaps he didn't so much write a draft as he revised an already existing draft.

 

[Steve Roby]

All I've seen is what's mentioned on the ol' God Thing page: https://web.archive.org/web/20150228203404/http://www.well.com/~sjroby/godthing.html.

No, no, wait. I know lots of secret stuff but I'll need a complete scan of the document to check against my secret stuff. Yeah, that's the ticket. Secret stuff. Trusted source. Absolutely.

 

[BobbyPeru1]

"Y'all take a listen. You'll hear the deep sound coming down from Bobby Peru."

On a more serious note, is there any indication who did the revisions you mentioned?

The first half of the revisions were both typewriter-typed and in some places, hand-written. The copy of the title page shows quite a bit of paper age/wear and tear, making it look like at least the first half of the revisions were completed prior to the February 15, 1977 date and the title page was added at that time. It also solely cites "Gene Roddenbery" as the author. The scenes mentioned in the God-Thing page are there, but have already been reworked (for example, the jump rope of the little girl at the bus station is now a hula-hoop). The second half is still typewriter-produced (you can spot typewriter quirks) and has some hand correcting as well, but is clearly a different typewriter. It ends with the, "Next time, he thought, next time...please...let it just be Klingons." line and the last page shows the same weathering as the title page, so I got the impression that they're both the same age. To add a little more detail from the cover letter accompanying it, it was from a top-level exec at Simon & Schuster sending it to an attorney who, at the time, represented Majel Roddenberry and the estate in May of 1996.