If I could hate Voyager, that would be an improvement, then it would manage to evoke at least some sort of an emotion in me. But it is too bland and boring to even be properly hated.
Star Trek Picard is not Star Trek
- Thread starter AnotherGalaxys
- Start date
Whenever I see a <insert show name> is not Star Trek, I am reminded of the quasi-religious overtones from the gatekeeping fans I ofter butt heads with on Twitter. 'True Trek' is a popular expression I've seen more than once, which is only a short hop from true fan arguments and all that rubbish. Star Trek is what you consider it to be, and you draw meaning from it in ways which are important to you. You don't need to justify your fandom to anyone.
What on Earth has the number of episodes to do with episodic vs serialised? You can do an episodic show with ten episodes per season.
In general, I tend to be leery of any sweeping, declarative statements about what STAR TREK is or isn't.
"Star Trek is about exploration!"
"Star Trek is about topical allegories!"
"Star Trek is about a utopian, non-scarcity society!"
"Star Trek is about the Human Condition and encountering the Other."
"Star Trek is about science and technology"
"Star Trek is NOT about politics!"
"Star Trek is NOT about sex or relationships."
Etc.
I resist any attempt to cram STAR TREK into a tight little box. One of Trek's great strengths, IMO, is that it's broad enough to encompass many different modes of storytelling, from morality plays to espionage thrillers to tragic love stories to even the occasional out-and-out farce. Why compromise that by getting too prescriptive about what constitutes a proper STAR TREK story?
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Star Trek is
Two kinds of ice cream
Finding your skate key
Telling the time
And Star Trek is
Learning to whistle
Tying your shoe
For the very first time
Star Trek is
Playing the drum in your own school band
And Star Trek is
Walking hand in hand
Two kinds of ice cream
Finding your skate key
Telling the time
And Star Trek is
Learning to whistle
Tying your shoe
For the very first time
Star Trek is
Playing the drum in your own school band
And Star Trek is
Walking hand in hand
My stupid beagle wrote that.
If you read carefully what the previous posters desired, you would see that it looked more like a 26 episode season.
This. I'm really tired of trying to fit Trek in to one size fits all box. It is incredibly limiting and ignores the variety of stories told across Trek's history.
To be fair, he was giving it all he's got:
Picard is a very different type of show than the old shows, but it's still Star Trek.
There was no way Star Trek was going to come back and make another show exactly like the old shows. TV has changed a lot since 1987 and it was time for Star Trek to finally recognize that. I think one of the biggest problems with Voyager and the earlier season of Enterprise, was that a lot of those changes were already starting to happen when they were on the air, but they were still being produced like it was 1987.
There was no way Star Trek was going to come back and make another show exactly like the old shows. TV has changed a lot since 1987 and it was time for Star Trek to finally recognize that. I think one of the biggest problems with Voyager and the earlier season of Enterprise, was that a lot of those changes were already starting to happen when they were on the air, but they were still being produced like it was 1987.
I agree, this is what made Star Trek unique. The Federation was kind of like what Earth should or could aspire to be. It represented a more enlightened society and for me as a kid, and even now, that was refreshing.
I don't like the JJ Abrams movies too much. I mean their solid, but nothing special. But they have the same tone as the TOS films. They're meant to be more appealing to the mainstream with a focus on action.
These aren't things that I would necessarily use to disqualify Picard, but I'll elaborate in a minute.
I'm guessing that this is an attempt to make the show a bit more realistic. On Earth we have very different features, so why should Romulans have the same variations. Also, it seems like they're trying to incorporate the Kelvin timeline Romulan-looks with the TNG ones. Having all Romulans with the exact same skin tone, the exact same "V" ridges, and same hair cuts might look silly in 2020.
However, I'm guessing that they also did it so Soji's boyfriend Narek can look hot and appealing to younger audiences.
This bugged me too. They talk more like contemporary people on Earth than they do being so far in the future. But Star Trek might be perceived at having typical "sci-fi" talk, which may come across as cliched or cheesy, so doing the opposite is 1) more relatable to current audiences, and 2) is a novelty in Star Trek.
Yeah, but we got that with TOS and TNG. People young and old can binge watch those episodes anytime, so if there's a point of reference, people might just think, what's the point of this new show, if the space exploration is available on Netflix?
But that's what made TOS films unique. Everything has to have it's own identity.
But things aren't supposed to go indefinitely or we'd start to resent them. Familiarity breeds contempt.
Star Trek did it's own thing, and managed to make, in my opinion, two great shows, TOS and TNG, and a great film series, TMP-TUC. That's quite a legacy on it's own. For me, there's other science fiction to explore. I don't resent what they try to do with Star Trek post-TNG. I might criticize it, but I can't blame them for trying to do something different in order to reach mainstream success.
Just like Chekov.
This is a very fair approach.
Honestly, there is no reason for Star Trek to "boldly go where Star Trek has gone before." Why would you put money in to that to tell a story people have seen again and again. I might not have taken the approach that DSC or PIC would have with Star Trek but I consider that a feature, not a bug.
I just read about that. Crazy they were purposely trying to make him look like the Beatles or Monkees. I had no idea and just assumed that's how people styled their hair in the 60s.
Exactly. I mean, I can get where those fans are coming from. But we got SEVEN great seasons of TNG. That's a lot. And TOS is great but cut short at three, but that's still quite a bit. It's nice to have those shows retain their individuality without having Discovery, Picard, etc do the same thing.
That's also true, but I'm not sure Koenig was styling his hair that way before he got the part.
No, probably not. From Koening's accounting he tried on several wigs as part of the audition process.
And that was a wig he was wearing for his first couple of production episodes, wasn't it? No doubt while he was growing out his hair for the Monkee 'do.
Can I be completely honest for a moment?
If it wasn't for the smoking and vaping, I'd probably enjoy Picard. Sure there are other elements I have some problems with, but I could live with that if we didn't have a cigar chomping captain and a vaping....whatever Raffi does... as two of the main characters.
I am 100% aware that that's a "Me Problem" I'm mentally ill (I'm serious, I actually am, I spent the last four years in an out of mental institutions), nicotine smoke is a very bad trigger for me due to my personal history and I can especially not abide it on TV or in Movies (especially not in a SciFi setting. If it was set in historical times, maybe), that's why I can't enjoy the show.
Form what I've managed to watch (and form what I've followed through friends who watch and through reading here), the Show isn't half bad. I don't have any problems with the Federation being portrayed as flawed, I don't have any problems with a person in the future living in trailer (it seemed like that's where she wanted to live,and hey, nice big trailer in the desert without any noisy neighbors, doesn't look that bad or poor to me...), I don't have any problem with Picard being called "JL" (it seemed natural considering their relationship and Raffi's personality, Beverly and Deanna both called Picard "Jean-Luc") I don't have any problem with what happened to Icheb or how it happened (or how Seven reacted to it, that was actually quite badass honestly and understandable) and I think that Elnor is pretty interesting and had a hella cool design (in general I think this show is doing a lot of good for Romulans) I even think that a "fall of the Utopia" is a natural point to take the Franchise after the Dominion War. Utopia is easier to achieve than to maintain.
I still think it's Star Trek, arguably quite a more in line with the 90s shows than Discovery and maybe even Enterprise was. Even in TNG they showed that Starfleet can be shady and that there was a sort of sketchy underbelly to Federation society, the only difference it that the show dives into that like neither TNG nor DS9 could because their characters were still Starfleet.
And honestly Picard isn't even *that* dark. Sure there's bad and unsettling stuff happening, but some people act like it's Battle Star Galactica... which it really isn't
I just can't enjoy the show for very personal reasons. I'm not saying the show runners are bad or evil for including smoking in their show. They have the right. I do think it's unnecessary and that their "justifications" are boolpoop, but they have the right to include whatever they want in their show.
Anyway, sorry for the rant. Just wanted to get that off my chest because it's been there since I tried watching Picard and just to make clear that I'm not a "hater" and don't decry Picard as "not Star Trek" I just have very personal, reasons why I don't like it.
If it wasn't for the smoking and vaping, I'd probably enjoy Picard. Sure there are other elements I have some problems with, but I could live with that if we didn't have a cigar chomping captain and a vaping....whatever Raffi does... as two of the main characters.
I am 100% aware that that's a "Me Problem" I'm mentally ill (I'm serious, I actually am, I spent the last four years in an out of mental institutions), nicotine smoke is a very bad trigger for me due to my personal history and I can especially not abide it on TV or in Movies (especially not in a SciFi setting. If it was set in historical times, maybe), that's why I can't enjoy the show.
Form what I've managed to watch (and form what I've followed through friends who watch and through reading here), the Show isn't half bad. I don't have any problems with the Federation being portrayed as flawed, I don't have any problems with a person in the future living in trailer (it seemed like that's where she wanted to live,and hey, nice big trailer in the desert without any noisy neighbors, doesn't look that bad or poor to me...), I don't have any problem with Picard being called "JL" (it seemed natural considering their relationship and Raffi's personality, Beverly and Deanna both called Picard "Jean-Luc") I don't have any problem with what happened to Icheb or how it happened (or how Seven reacted to it, that was actually quite badass honestly and understandable) and I think that Elnor is pretty interesting and had a hella cool design (in general I think this show is doing a lot of good for Romulans) I even think that a "fall of the Utopia" is a natural point to take the Franchise after the Dominion War. Utopia is easier to achieve than to maintain.
I still think it's Star Trek, arguably quite a more in line with the 90s shows than Discovery and maybe even Enterprise was. Even in TNG they showed that Starfleet can be shady and that there was a sort of sketchy underbelly to Federation society, the only difference it that the show dives into that like neither TNG nor DS9 could because their characters were still Starfleet.
And honestly Picard isn't even *that* dark. Sure there's bad and unsettling stuff happening, but some people act like it's Battle Star Galactica... which it really isn't
I just can't enjoy the show for very personal reasons. I'm not saying the show runners are bad or evil for including smoking in their show. They have the right. I do think it's unnecessary and that their "justifications" are boolpoop, but they have the right to include whatever they want in their show.
Anyway, sorry for the rant. Just wanted to get that off my chest because it's been there since I tried watching Picard and just to make clear that I'm not a "hater" and don't decry Picard as "not Star Trek" I just have very personal, reasons why I don't like it.
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