Production Order Group Viewing 2018

[Poltargyst]

I think someone may have confused the "Eden" the Space Hippies were searching for with the Sha-ka-ree/Vorta Vor/Eden that Sybok and his followers were seeking.

Oh, yeah, I was confused.

 

[Poltargyst]

Not too bad TBH, except that Sulu does explicitly say "galaxy centre" before they get transported to the Megans' dimension.
This is my re-interpretation of the dialogue, using the "Galaque-Sea nebula" notion:
Now at least one of my verbal re-interpretations IS weak!

True, but I had more in mind Death Wish which is where we see the Q continuum for the first time.

Ah, if only!

Ordinarily I would agree, but as this is a whacky alternate dimension maybe oxygen doesn't work the same way without a little magical help?

I have a similar interest in early Christian religion too - it's really tantalising to see glimpses of what got chucked out when the official canon was formed.
The Gospel Of Judas is interesting in that in it Judas was the only one who understood the true meaning of Jesus' message - that must humans are too involved with the physical realm and only a select few have the insight to transcend to eternity after this life
Marcion of Sinope interpreted inconsistencies between the depictions of God in the old and new testament by purporting that they were actually separate deities! This is some Star Trek level of continuity error resolution!
As for Lucifer himself being a misunderstood guy - I've not heard of that one! Which Gnostic gospel is it from?

Oh, interesting stuff, thanks.

I don't know what Gnostic gospel it's in, but for example

https://theforbiddenreligion.com/lucifer-the-liberator.htm

 

[Maurice]

[...]I have a similar interest in early Christian religion too - it's really tantalising to see glimpses of what got chucked out when the official canon was formed.
The Gospel Of Judas is interesting in that in it Judas was the only one who understood the true meaning of Jesus' message - that must humans are too involved with the physical realm and only a select few have the insight to transcend to eternity after this life
Marcion of Sinope interpreted inconsistencies between the depictions of God in the old and new testament by purporting that they were actually separate deities! This is some Star Trek level of continuity error resolution!
As for Lucifer himself being a misunderstood guy - I've not heard of that one! Which Gnostic gospel is it from?

Have you read Elaine Pagels' book on the subject (a review I largely agree with here)? That was my introduction to the subject.

 

[Mytran]

Thank you both for the information, I shall give it a read!

 

[Mytran]

THE TIME TRAP
(AKA the Bermuda Triangle…in SPAAACE!!!!)

Just like last week we begin in a spooky part of space filled with explosions. Must be anomaly exploration month for the Enterprise.

Hey, it’s Kor! Nice to see him again. He seems the lack the dramatic screen presence he had in Errand Of Mercy though. He’s also a lot more sinister than when we last met him too and even makes reference to Kirk as his “old enemy” Did Kor and Kirk had a further altercation between EOM and this one? Certainly they way that they parted company in that original episode didn’t make it appear that they were mortal enemies, more respected adversaries. They even shared a drink together!

The story is one of enemies being forced to corporate in order to defeat a common enemy – or in this case to resolve a common problem. In fact, the only enemy in this episode is the sneaky Klingons themselves, since the effects of the Delta Triangle is just natural phenomena. Even the Elysian council are not bad guys, which a most welcome subversion of that old trope. True, the council seem resigned to the fact that it is impossible to leave Elysia, but they are not opposed to Kirk and Kor trying, even to the extent where they must suspend judgement on Kor’s violent action to give the escape attempt a chance.
It really is a very just and fair society!
But Kirk makes a good speech about home too, so off we go

Kirk is very mellow at the end, not worrying about the Klingons claiming all the credit for their escape since getting home was the true objective and that was achieved.
I guess a little treachery is just part and parcel of dealing with the Klingons?
Spock’s subtle way of finding out information from the Klingons is a excellent new way of using his telepathic powers too, even if ultimately they had to be told outright by the Elysians about the bomb.

All in all this is a decent and involved story with lots of plot elements. It does feels somewhat rushed though and would really have benefited from the full 52 minute treatment to expand on some of the themes raised. But still a good effort that adds a lot to Trek lore.


NEW TECH!

• When Kor’s ship vanishes Sulu states that it couldn’t have been the vessel just using its cloaking device.
  WAIT - Klingons have cloaking devices? This is a first! Perhaps a result of the Romulan alliance?
  Sulu states it so matter of fact that this can’t be the first time cloaked Klingon vessels have been encountered by Starfleet. I wonder how many times Kirk encountered the Klingons that we didn’t see.
• The approximate Klingon equivalent of a warp drive is the “S2 graf unit” but it is unknown whether that refers to the power source, the nacelles, or a whole new way to achieve FTL speeds.
  However, it can’t be all that dissimilar to the Enterprise’s systems, otherwise they would not be able to combine their efforts and escape the Delta Triangle.
• Hey, it’s the Bonaventure, the first ship with a warp drive! The existence of this ship and its various oddities has fuelled fan speculation for years, but Aaron Harvey (author of the recent TAS book) has a theory that is as good as any, detailed in his podcast where they also build a 3D model of the vessel!
  
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OTHER THOUGHTS:

• So, time passes only very slowly in the Delta Triangle? I can see that raising all sorts of questions since everyone seems to be experiencing normal passage of time, but fortunately Xerius does add that the zone is a “curious” trap so there’s probably more going on than he could be bothered to summarise for Kirk and Kor (if he even knows the answer).
• George Takei gets to do some more voicework as Klingon commander Kuri, but despite a good effort he lacks James Doohan's vocal diversity.
• Wow, that’s a smorgasbord of alien races on the council! A tour de force of the various species we’ve seen over the years
• Magen and her psionic abilities get used a lot and veers dangerously close to having vague “plot convenient” superpowers that we’ve seen in the past. Her voice is also annoying
• Yet again the dilithium crystals are deteriorating, providing a ticking clock. No real reason is given for them to fail, it is just chalked up to the general weirdness of the pocket universe or something.
• That Klingon briefing room table is awesome! But is it sabotarge or sabotaage?
• The saboteur is a female officer – the Klingons continue to fairly represent both genders on board their ships (for the 1970s)
• We only see the final 0.5 seconds of the Orion Slave Girl dance – maybe it’s too saucy for kids TV?
• Reference is made to Klingons sneaking about the Enterprise’s dilithium vault. Is that the same room we saw in The Alternative Factor?
• We see the warp control panel too, apparently in the main computer room of the Enterprise. And what’s with TAS’s obsession with reel to reel tapes?
• I don't think I'll ever get over the sight of the Enterprise mounted atop the Klingon battlecruiser.
  Is that how baby starships are made?

Now that a solution has been found to leave the pocket universe, I wonder if Starfleet will be sending any other ships back. The tech that slows down again must be worth the effort alone!

 

[Ssosmcin]

While I’ve heard this one is a bit of a fan favorite, I find it deadly dull. As much as people complain about the music being on an endless loop in this series, the music helps make the episodes work. This one goes for long stretches without background score. The editing, pacing and lack of energy in the vocals really NEEDS that score and this episode dies without it. And yes, Takei is not a v/o artist. He never had the chops to sound like anyone either than himself.

A decent concept (which was also used in a Gold Key comic, I believe), but it just hangs there.

 

[Maurice]

[...]Now that a solution has been found to leave the pocket universe, I wonder if Starfleet will be sending any other ships back. The tech that slows down again must be worth the effort alone!

Or, you know, maybe to help those trapped within to escape if they wish?

 

[Poltargyst]

The Time Trap

I don't remember many of these episodes, but I do vaguely remember this one. I also remember considering it my favorite. Interesting to see if I still think so as an adult.

Delta Triangle? Bermuda Triangle, anyone?

When do we first learn that Klingons have cloaking devices?

How did the Klingons know that the Enterprise was going to the Delta Triangle in order to set their trap? Do they have spies in the Federation?

Takei's Commander Kuri says "Kling-Gon" like Sulu.

The Bonaventure was the first ship with warp drive. Rather conflicts with the show Enterprise, doesn't it?

Oh, the Ruling Council. I think this council was a big reason I liked this episode so much. So many aliens we already know, enough to thrill a TOS fanboy: Gorn (I think I was especially thrilled by the Gorn), Tellarite, Andorian, Orion, Klingon. Even one of those plant guys. It's the appearance of all these aliens together that makes it fun.

Is Xerius a Vulcan or a Romulan? I think I'm leaning Vulcan but we don't really know, do we?

It's Kor! This episode should be GLORIOUS.

And in Reused Themes from TOS of the Week: Once again Kor and Kirk are prevented from fighting by a higher power. That must be really frustrating.

KIRK: I don't want a prediction. You will start work immediately, around the clock, nonstop, until you arrive at a formula that gets us out of here.

Is Kirk spoiled much? Some of the best minds from 123 races over a thousand years have been trying to escape the trap, and Kirk expects Spock to figure this out in a matter of hours. But then, of course, Spock does.

We see the inside of a Klingon ship! Although we did see the inside of that model in The Enterprise Incident.

Spock with the touchy-feely. Is he still under the effects of Mudd's roofie?

So Spock can do casual contact telepathy now?

Woo hoo! An Orion dancing girl! Complete with bare midriff.

So of course they figure out how to escape in a matter of hours because Spock has the most brilliant mind in the galaxy.

So Kirk allows the Klingons to just galavant away after trying to kill them?

We didn't see Christine this episode. I assume she's in the brig?

I can see why I liked this episode so much. It has a good, classic Star Trek message. Being willing to set aside differences and work with enemies is beneficial to all, and it was just cool to see representatives of all those races together.

Okay, the Klingons didn't really set aside their differences with the Federation in trying to blow up the Enterprise, but the crew of the Enterprise did.

A better ending would be the Enterprise helping the others get out as well. I'd like to think they gave the Council the formula for escape and gave them the idea that if they work together, they can all get out.

Actually, now that they know how to escape, the Enterprise or other Federation ships could go into the Triangle and leave again any time they want.

Okay, Spock came up with a formula to escape the Triangle, but what exactly did they do to escape? I'm glad they don't technobabble us, but some explanation would be good.

Alien Watch! A council full of them!

Season One
The Glommer
Arex*
Retlaw Plant
Agmar and his Phylosian posse
Swoopers
Yellow winged bird guy (Aleek)
Spock's teddy bear with fangs (sehlat)
Green cat thing that sounds like Godzilla (le-matya)
300 million year old alien on viewscreen log
Green energy Redjac wannabe
The Vendorian
Lt. M'Ress
Remarkably human-looking Taureans.
The planet-eating, Majel Roddenberry-voiced cloud from another galaxy.
Alien miners of Arcadia
Rigelian hypnoid
Giant rock creatures
Remarkably human-looking (when they want to be except for that rebel Lucien guy) Megans
Assorted heretofore unseen aliens on the Delta Triangle's ruling council

*by request

 

[Poltargyst]

• When Kor’s ship vanishes Sulu states that it couldn’t have been the vessel just using its cloaking device.
  WAIT - Klingons have cloaking devices? This is a first! Perhaps a result of the Romulan alliance?
  Sulu states it so matter of fact that this can’t be the first time cloaked Klingon vessels have been encountered by Starfleet. I wonder how many times Kirk encountered the Klingons that we didn’t see.

I was wondering. Is this the first time we learn that Klingons have cloaking devices?

• I don't think I'll ever get over the sight of the Enterprise mounted atop the Klingon battlecruiser.
  Is that how baby starships are made?

 

[Maurice]

[...]
We see the inside of a Klingon ship! Although we did see the inside of that model in The Enterprise Incident.

We saw some of the insides of one in "More Flat Cats More Troubles".

 

[Mytran]

Okay, Spock came up with a formula to escape the Triangle, but what exactly did they do to escape? I'm glad they don't technobabble us, but some explanation would be good.

I got the impression it was just their combined power which did the trick. Hard to believe that none of the other aliens had tried that before, but maybe this is the first time that two ships (of the right specs) got pulled in within the same narrow time window?

I was wondering. Is this the first time we learn that Klingons have cloaking devices?

I honestly think it is (although Timo did a good effort recently in retconning them into the TOS episodes where Klingon ships seemed to appear out of nowhere)

We saw some of the insides of one in "More Flat Cats More Troubles".

Yep! Between that and this TAS is really expanding the Klingon design aesthetic - and not one gloomy, smoke filled room in sight!

 

[Henoch]

I got the impression it was just their combined power which did the trick. Hard to believe that none of the other aliens had tried that before, but maybe this is the first time that two ships (of the right specs) got pulled in within the same narrow time window?

Agreed. Previous ships were most likely pulled into the pocket universe one at a time. Plus time is not on their side due to the accelerated deterioration of their ship's dilithium crystals. The Klingons were also experiencing a similar issue as determined by Scott noting their depleted energy readings. Also, previously trapped ships are older models with lower power curves. The Klingon solo attempt proved that one ship cannot escape. In the end, it takes two powerful ships with full power capability to escape the zone.

 

[johnnybear]

The many alien ships and their crews trapped in the Delta Triangle may not wish to leave it's folds of immortality as many stories where such people did had disastrous endings for the escapees!
JB

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

The Bonaventure was the first ship with warp drive. Rather conflicts with the show Enterprise, doesn't it?

Might it be the first with a well-built, custom parts (think assembly line rather than guy in his basement) drive rather than cobbled together by an experimenter?

 

[Poltargyst]

Might it be the first with a well-built, custom parts (think assembly line rather than guy in his basement) drive rather than cobbled together by an experimenter?

I'll go with that.

 

[Mytran]

Might it be the first with a well-built, custom parts (think assembly line rather than guy in his basement) drive rather than cobbled together by an experimenter?

I agree too - it seems that the Bonaventure was the first "proper" ship with what Scotty considers a "true" warp drive installed - test vehicles are a far cry from starships after all and it doubtless took decades for warp drive technology to resemble the form that Kirk's Enterprise uses.

 

[johnnybear]

The Bonaventure was the first ship with warp drive agreed but then why was it moving? I thought all the ships using Dylithium crystals as their sources of power had been neutralised? Plus forget the Enterprise NX-01 as that was from another altered timeline!
JB

 

[Mytran]

Perhaps less sophisticated forms of propulsion (thrusters, for example) are still possible in the void? In most episodes dilithium crystals only seem to be necessary for the "heavy hitters" (warp drive, shields, weapons etc)

 

[Commishsleer]

The Time Trap


We didn't see Christine this episode. I assume she's in the brig?

I think she got away with it. I mean no-one else knows about what she did aside from Mudd and he's probably going to use it later to blackmail her. Not that there's not already a sinister connection between Chapel and Mudd re Roger Korby and the androids in I Mudd. And its not as if security are going to work it out. TOS seciurity has always been rubbish. I know they attempted to create an identity card but you see how Mudd trod all over that one.

The Time Trap


KIRK: I don't want a prediction. You will start work immediately, around the clock, nonstop, until you arrive at a formula that gets us out of here.

Is Kirk spoiled much? Some of the best minds from 123 races over a thousand years have been trying to escape the trap, and Kirk expects Spock to figure this out in a matter of hours. But then, of course, Spock does.

Would Thelev have been able to do it?

 

[Henoch]

Chapel will be back soon as her old self after a few sessions under the neural neutralizer. Installation of the device in the psychiatric department hasn't slowed traffic through Helen Noel's office.