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Spoilers Fugitive of the Judoon grade and discussion thread

How do you rate Fugitive of the Judoon?


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I hope this isn't true as it's just lazy writing. Why come up with something new when you can just retcon what's already been done. "Forgotten Doctors", "secret Doctors", etc-- it's all just bad fanfic wankery.

No wonder the ratings continue to plummet...

Except the overnights increased by 0.2M. The consolidated rating isn't in yet but the increase isn't much to write home about.

And, yes, some good acting aside (never let the guest actor claiming to be a new incarnation of the Doctor be scripted and acted better (regardless of any ghost writing, and/or series 12 reducing the Tennantisms and Smithisms and trying to make a comparatively original incarnation), just like how you don't bring a guest comic into TNG and see how the regulars are mopping the floor with the guest comic), as par for his era it does feel like Chibnall trying to do "RTD Style Fanfic" - complete with "Nostalgia we you know you will loooove!" All while reusing sets to reduce cost in a new and brilliant way. The new incarnation is an interesting twist, though if they're going to play into continuity then Susan invented the acronym from the initials of the craft's description. And how the TARDIS will have remained there - Hartnell had only arrived there and was there for 5 months, maybe she is the final incarnation from a previous set of 13 lives/12 regenerations and becomes Hartnell and Susan is incarnation II as she's forced to regenerate, though there are more creative avenues one could take but this being the 21st century and all, nobody wants that... The chameleon arch thing is a bit Harry Potter but it works...

If they (showrunners) wanted to definitively establish that the two Doctors were the same Doctor, they would've had them connect and share all possible information. As it was, they didn't do that or even compare notes! Seems like room for doubt was intentionally left open.

You could be right. But, I don't know, seems like it was left ambiguous for a reason.

So was Missy/Rani/Adam/Davros. There's no better way to troll audiences than to leave it all so wide-open ended as it allows people to come up with their own creative thinking. Like Susan not being biological offspring but an adopted child from a ravaged planet the Doctor rescued before going all paranoid. But, naah, why be creative - everyone copulates and that helps increase ratings and appreciation indexes via the LCD, right? (Well, not always...)

The chameleon arch thing is actually rather clever, despite it being cheesy at the same time. It was no less cheesy a gimmicky plot device in 2007 to set up the finale, but woomp there it is. In order to re-open a continuity that never was but then was cobbled together* but was quick to fall apart again, Chibnall (or his ghost writer) did take a naff idea and used it to positive effect. Like when RTD took the melodramatic schlock in Dalek Invasion of Earth with puttering Earth across the galaxy via an electric motor into something big (a gravity based superweapon thing in the mixed-bag Journey's End escapade, which also took place yet again on modern day Earth...)

* But how many Doctors have said definitively that they were x regeneration? Brain of Morbius hints at previous incarnations but it's equally valid that the Doctor was tricking Morbius in the game by putting up bogus images to troll with. The fourth, fifth and seventh Doctors clearly state the number of times they've done it in the past. Can they all be subject to the chameleon brainadope all this time? In which case why not go all the way and say all WHO prior to 2017 was just one big arch-a-thon?

But people will bicker on everything; the show never has had continuity - right down to the number of hearts and the very reason the Doctor left Gallifrey to begin with. There are better things to nitpick.
 
I miss Torchwood though we never got to see Jack get it on with Gwen I was shipping them.

I still think Dr Ruth's Tardis is just a pale imitation of Sexy. It maybe a Tardis but it's not THE Tardis. I also think she's a Doctor from an aborted timeline that never happened due to the actions of the Doctor in a previous adventure she doesn't recall.

Other way around, surely? Classic WHO had a proper TARDIS from the get-go and because this oversized, steroid-driven anthropomorphized street corner walker spitting sugar biscuits in the middle of it all along.
 
I miss Torchwood though we never got to see Jack get it on with Gwen I was shipping them.

Actually, for a little while there – in between the scene at the church where we realised something was up with Ruth, and the scene at the lighthouse where we were told what was up with her – I wondered if we were getting a follow-up to the Torchwood episode "Sleeper".

We never did find out what those guys were up to or follow up on them at all, but the circumstances seemed similar – a woman with a normal life who finds out she has alien mega fight powers she didn't know she had. Chibnall didn't write that episode but he was in charge of Torchwood at the time, so it would be within his rights to import a Torchwood villain into the main show. And with Jack having just shown up, I thought that would tie it all together – he was on the trail of Ruth / the Sleeper, trying to stop her because he knew what this was.

Turned out to be nothing to do with that of course, but it was an interesting few minutes where I thought it might be.

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Ooh new theory, the Earth we have seen the past 2 series isn't our world but actually another parallel world. All our companions have come from this Earth so that might explain why no UNIT or any memories of alien invasions, this is the mirror universe.

Yes I know old tired idea but still an idea.

The Ruth Doctor is native to this universe and so are the fam. Jodie Doctor is the alien who landed in their universe.
 
All our companions have come from this Earth so that might explain why no UNIT or any memories of alien invasions, this is the mirror universe.

Yes I know old tired idea but still an idea.

The Ruth Doctor is native to this universe and so are the fam. Jodie Doctor is the alien who landed in their universe.

None of the newer series seem to remember alien invasions. It's been an issue since the beginning of the 2000s DW.

Otherwise I almost like this idea.
 
Which he did so he could remove the best before date on Doctors.
No, up until Time of the Doctor, Moffat was perfectly okay with ignoring the regeneration limit, indeed he gave an endorsement to RTD's 507 line in SJA and was more than willing to let that stand as official until circumstances lined up and he saw what he thought was an organic way to insert the regeneration limit into an episode. Indeed, RTD even said that when he inserted the line in SJA, it was his hope that it would erase the regeneration limit, stating he never understood why among all the various things established about the Doctor and Time Lords throughout the classic era that have ended up ignored, that stuck around and loomed over the franchise ever since it was established.
Was it a video? interview? Something from a book? Sorry to ask so much, just curious as I would like to read up on it.
An interview with Moffat done just after the episode aired.
 
None of the classic series seem to remember alien invasions either.

I don't think I ever made it through a classic episode awake or sober. :beer:

But fans are crazy and think all the issues are the current person's fault. I'm here to beat the common sense back in. :biggrin: Did you know all the aliens on Star Trek speak modern English? Stunning! :lol:
 
I don't think I ever made it through a classic episode awake or sober. :beer:

But fans are crazy and think all the issues are the current person's fault. I'm here to beat the common sense back in. :biggrin: Did you know all the aliens on Star Trek speak modern English? Stunning! :lol:

It's that damn universal translator, we're lucky the aliens don't sound British
 
Was that Venusian Akido Ruth used against the Judoon?

It was more polished and violent than we usually see but it is still in keeping with thte Doctor being skilled at a martial art.
 
No, up until Time of the Doctor, Moffat was perfectly okay with ignoring the regeneration limit, indeed he gave an endorsement to RTD's 507 line in SJA and was more than willing to let that stand as official until circumstances lined up and he saw what he thought was an organic way to insert the regeneration limit into an episode. Indeed, RTD even said that when he inserted the line in SJA, it was his hope that it would erase the regeneration limit, stating he never understood why among all the various things established about the Doctor and Time Lords throughout the classic era that have ended up ignored, that stuck around and loomed over the franchise ever since it was established.

An interview with Moffat done just after the episode aired.

So...he did do it to address it directly and deal with it then. (He knew that in three Dkctors time someone was going to have to deal with it, so he took it off the table while the show was on a high in the anniversary year)
 
Ooh then a possible link to the 3rd Doctor

3 didn't learn space Karate while exiled on 70s/80s Earth.

I think that One learnt the Jupiterian Jujitsu, but the old man arthritis got so bad by the time we started following his adventures, it wasn't something he did anymore.

Three kept saying that it was hard for someone with only four limbs to learn Venusian AKido. Heavy boobs are almost like extra limbs, which should help with her form.
 
Ooh new theory, the Earth we have seen the past 2 series isn't our world but actually another parallel world. All our companions have come from this Earth so that might explain why no UNIT or any memories of alien invasions, this is the mirror universe.

Yes I know old tired idea but still an idea.

The Ruth Doctor is native to this universe and so are the fam. Jodie Doctor is the alien who landed in their universe.

I think it’s certainly an interesting idea...but I can’t see them going for anything that big and comparatively sensible. I can see them going for the Hartnell Retcon, though most seem to think that would be a very bad thing.
 
There was an old plan to bring this sort of storyline in during McCoy's run, with the intent of giving the Doc some much needed mystery back, and making him not just another run of the loom Time Lord.

Anything they do do can be undone with a thing happening anyway.
 
I wonder now if all the jarring mindwipes the Doctor has done this series are preparing us for finding out it already happened to her.

Ooh, good spot.

We are also still keeping up with the dead planet / people motif – in "Spyfall" it was Gallifrey, in "Orphan 55" it was future Earth, in "Tesla" the Doctor warned the Skithra Queen what would happen to her people if she didn't change her ways, and now suddenly we hear out of nowhere that the Cyberman Empire is obliterated with only one of them left. Definitely a theme going on there.

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