Star Trek III Self Destruct
- Thread starter Pauln6
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Detonating the antimatter would've probably blasted the atmosphere off the Genesis Planet, which, considering the crew was down there, would've been bad.
Mr. Scott's Guide to the Enterprise postulated that there were two self-destruct modes. Destruct One, if the ship wasn't near anything or anyone the Captain wanted to keep safe, would detonate the ship's antimatter supply and that'd be that. Destruct Zero, if the ship was near a planet or friendly ship or enemy ship the survivors planned to hijack, would eject the antimatter pods so they could fly off far away from anything, and destroyed the most critical sections of the ship (command and control systems, computers, advanced technologies like warp drive and weapons, anything else dangerous or of value) with smaller explosive charges so the remaining hulk would be unsalvageable and useless to anyone who'd tried to capture it.
Seems like if there were a hostile takeover of a ship, wouldn't the enemy try to gain access to the bridge first? If that strategy is viable, then it makes sense the bridge would be the first part of the self-destruct to blow up.
Anti-matter sort of detonates itself when its magnetic containment fails. They're screwed either way.
I suppose it's the computer core they want to destroy.
In TMP, the goal was for the anti-matter explosion to take out V'Ger. If they don't want the warp core to explode in TSFS, we certainly don't see them take any special action to avoid it, like ejecting the core or fuel pods. That means there will be an anti-matter explosion inside the atmosphere.
I agree that it would be sensible to have a mechanism by which the anti-matter storage is jettisoned away from nearby planets before the destruct but it's also it's true to say that definitely didn't happen in TSFS.
In TMP, the goal was for the anti-matter explosion to take out V'Ger. If they don't want the warp core to explode in TSFS, we certainly don't see them take any special action to avoid it, like ejecting the core or fuel pods. That means there will be an anti-matter explosion inside the atmosphere.
I agree that it would be sensible to have a mechanism by which the anti-matter storage is jettisoned away from nearby planets before the destruct but it's also it's true to say that definitely didn't happen in TSFS.
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We actually don't know it didn't happen. Not seen/heard doesn't equate to "didnt happen." In fact, all things being equal, I'd argue that it definitely did happen, since the antimatter didn't explode.
Yeah, what I meant was, it wasn't mentioned, and it would have tipped off the Klingons sooner that something was up if they'd ejected the anti-matter before the saucer explosion. I don't see an opportunity to do it after the destruction has started. Even if it is part of an automatic chain reaction, it doesn't seem sensible to wait until after the process has started before ejecting the highly explosive stuff .
Actually, you could theorize that it does happen after the destruct process starts, as this would be a reason why the saucer explodes, but not the engineering hull. It stays intact so the ejection can happen at the last possible minute.
It may be that the final destruct code dictates which version? Code zero zero zero destruct being one version but you would think all the zeroes would be for warp core intact destruction. Zero zero one for last minute ejection, one zero zero for pre destruction ejection.
Yep. But as with the callback, since apparently the mandatory password reset is over two decades, it's all dramatic fanservice. In reality, a nacelle or matter/antimatter chamber would go boomboom first and then spread outward. Or multiple consoles in strategic areas go simultaneously for a planned self-destruct, in this case it's all in the saucer... or ILM didn't have any more time and money to rig more than the admittedly spectacular effect for the saucer disintegrating like that. The saucer didn't get blown off, just uninhabitable and the whole thing still burnt up in the atmosphere in what was rather a chilling scene.
It's all quite amazing, as a near-teen the callback (to "Let That Be Your Last Battlefield" for the password reuse) was one of those infantile "SQUEEEEEEEEE!" moments, but on a logistical level it's utterly crackers and that's nothing compared to mimicking Klingon words the first time ever and actually getting beamed off upon stating it, which makes Kirk quite the convenient Marty Stu in that scene. Then again, III's saving grace is not plot consistency but the array of moral themes used - which is historically Trek's strongest point. Had III not the continuing saga and emotional depth that reached out along with its sense of pulp adventure overriding the nitpicky details... the tribbles were a silly callback as well. Maybe by then they had all been spayed and neutered but forgot to tell us in the script.
Now I'm just imagining one of the Klingons with the Discovery accent trying that trick. "Beeh meh, 'yip Shqot'ti." It's a shame there aren't any of those nice rolling r's in the phrase.
The way the Enterprise self-destructed made no sense whatsoever. The bridge blew up, and maybe 1/4 of the saucer section exploded. But if the ship didn’t just happen to be thrown into the gravitational pull of the Genesis planet, most of the ship would have still remained intact. That’s not what I’d call “self-destruction.”
Followed by a matter-antimatter explosion that would "... consume ze planet".
Nothing happened to the secondary hull (where the matter/antimatter reactor was), so there would have been no explosion. There wasn’t even one in the movie; all we saw was the ship burning up in the atmosphere (which could also be argued that this would have caused the m/am explosion that would have destroyed the planet...but didn’t). Also, the Ent-D’s destruction didn’t take Veridian III with it either.
So you're saying in all of his experience Kirk hasn't learned a few words of Klingonese?
Why would he, with his trusty UT and all?
But getting the single word halfway right seems plausible enough - Maltz or his putative transporter operator wouldn't be inclined to question their boss, who was calling for immediate action amidst lots of background noise associated with impending Armageddon.
The elaborate sequence of code words would suggest user-selectable options.
I mean, it obviously isn't a security precaution: identification and verification of authorization is not by those code words, but by voice recognition of the bit where the heroes say "I yam who I yam", or else the heroes couldn't use the code words of each other willy-nilly.
It may be partially a safety precaution: were it non-elaborate, accidental commanding of detonation might happen, say, a countdown-free kaboom instead of the intended ten-minute countdown.
But there's still plenty of room for selectable options. "Destruct 0" through "Destruct 47" sounds quite plausible, there being the option to just scuttle the computer or vent the living spaces in addition to blowing up the whole ship for good.
So in all likelihood, we're seeing a botched self-destruct, halfheartedly conducted by a damaged computer aboard a crippled ship.
Had Kirk commanded the idiotproof Destruct 3 where antimatter is sprayed from every valve, less would have gone wrong. But here he wanted different results, and almost suffered the consequences.
Heck, perhaps the self-destruct malfunctioned the opposite way? Perhaps Kirk just wanted to blow up the saucer and leave the ship afloat, so that the Klingons would be dead but he'd still have a warp drive to return to? Kirk would have gotten no tactical gain from denying the Klingons the use of the starship - he just wanted a maximum number of them dead, and couldn't get at Kruge no matter what.
Timo Saloniemi
But getting the single word halfway right seems plausible enough - Maltz or his putative transporter operator wouldn't be inclined to question their boss, who was calling for immediate action amidst lots of background noise associated with impending Armageddon.
The elaborate sequence of code words would suggest user-selectable options.
I mean, it obviously isn't a security precaution: identification and verification of authorization is not by those code words, but by voice recognition of the bit where the heroes say "I yam who I yam", or else the heroes couldn't use the code words of each other willy-nilly.
It may be partially a safety precaution: were it non-elaborate, accidental commanding of detonation might happen, say, a countdown-free kaboom instead of the intended ten-minute countdown.
But there's still plenty of room for selectable options. "Destruct 0" through "Destruct 47" sounds quite plausible, there being the option to just scuttle the computer or vent the living spaces in addition to blowing up the whole ship for good.
So in all likelihood, we're seeing a botched self-destruct, halfheartedly conducted by a damaged computer aboard a crippled ship.
Had Kirk commanded the idiotproof Destruct 3 where antimatter is sprayed from every valve, less would have gone wrong. But here he wanted different results, and almost suffered the consequences.
Heck, perhaps the self-destruct malfunctioned the opposite way? Perhaps Kirk just wanted to blow up the saucer and leave the ship afloat, so that the Klingons would be dead but he'd still have a warp drive to return to? Kirk would have gotten no tactical gain from denying the Klingons the use of the starship - he just wanted a maximum number of them dead, and couldn't get at Kruge no matter what.
Timo Saloniemi
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