CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar 2 - Electric Boogaloo-Fanboys gone WILD-too many hyphens

[Jedi_Master]

Unfortunately, a lot of people think that's what real Trek is.

Isn't that what "True Trek Fans" (TM pending) want?

Did you two get a group rate on your joke?

@Admiral2 - that's the issue. If Alec or anyone were to make something decent, they would be able to generate enthusiasm. But the Peters' prompted brain drain has left Axanar in the hands of a bunch of folks who can't generate enough independent thought to make something worthwhile.

 

[Admiral2]

Did you two get a group rate on your joke?

@Admiral2 - that's the issue. If Alec or anyone were to make something decent, they would be able to generate enthusiasm. But the Peters' prompted brain drain has left Axanar in the hands of a bunch of folks who can't generate enough independent thought to make something worthwhile.

Which is both sad and unnecessary. I've always been a big fan of comics, and I see no reason why an Axanar comic should be as badly mishandled as the Axanar film(s), and yet, here's ArcanisIV, the plot of which seems to be "Hey, let's drop an admiral on the planet for no reason other than to get the Klingons to kill everybody! And then let's add an a-hole captain trope! And let's cap it off with the most boring action scene ever devised by man!"

And far be it from me to try to solve LFIM's problems for him, but this solution is easy: You know you're not going to make another film, be it Axanar heavy, light, mid-sized, whatever. You don't have the money and you don't have the stars, but you claim to have a "locked" script and it's awesome. Fine. Take the script and give it to the comic creators. It would cost a lot less to make a comic than to make a film, and hello! No guidelines, cause you ain't making another film, so go nuts with the page count.

You keep promising Axanar. Here's a way to do Axanar. You claim you like these guys work, so put your money - - where your mouth is.

 

[CaptGrumpy]

The hell of it is, if axalytes are really straying from the flock, a decent comic might be able to draw some of them back..

Then we are safe!!

 

[dmac]

Then we are safe!!

Hurray!

 

[Krandor]

When members of the Axamonitor facebook group posted questions for the organizers of the Honorverse Convention, along the lines of "are you aware that Alec Peters has been sued for copyright infringement, and under his direction roughly $1.5 million of donor funds were raised to make the Axanar movies, and that no movie has been made while all the donor funds are apparently gone?"
Those comments were deleted without warning, and statements made along the lines of "don't troll us".

See I'm not sure how much posting stuff like that in public really helps because I'm sure most con organizers whoa re inviting Alec know who he is and his history. However if you do want to say something I'd suggest something more like this.

"Dear Con Organizer,

I would like to inform you that I will not be attending your con on these days. The main reason is because you have Alec Peters as a guest. Due to his actions in misappropriating $1.4M dollars and getting sued for copyright infringement, I refuse to pay money for anything he is associated with including being a guest at a con. I hope you have a great convention and regret I will be unable to attend" .

 

[JD]

I'm honestly still in shock that anyone would even invite them to their convention.
Maybe they didn't know his history before hand, but I would think once it became clear just how controversial a figure he was they would have wanted nothing to do with him.
I know they gave the whole thing about not wanting to uninvite him, but personally I would rather just uninvite him than have to deal with being dragged into all of the drama surrounding him.

 

[dmac]

No way Alec is going to rule my life. Do what you must, I can respect that

 

[jespah]

See I'm not sure how much posting stuff like that in public really helps because I'm sure most con organizers whoa re inviting Alec know who he is and his history. However if you do want to say something I'd suggest something more like this.

"Dear Con Organizer,

I would like to inform you that I will not be attending your con on these days. The main reason is because you have Alec Peters as a guest. Due to his actions in misappropriating $1.4M dollars and getting sued for copyright infringement, I refuse to pay money for anything he is associated with including being a guest at a con. I hope you have a great convention and regret I will be unable to attend" .

I would change this very slightly, seeing as the case was settled and did not go to verdict:

It can probably be okay with a qualifier such as apparently misappropriating. Or it can be changed to something like him being accused of misappropriating ...

Everything else is accurate. Couching the misappropriating part as opinion (or just stating the facts, as it is a fact that he's gotten such accusations) should protect you from the inevitable scream of LIBEL!

Note: I am a retired lawyer but I am not your lawyer. Please consult competent counsel in your jurisdiction for a far more in-depth analysis. /end standard disclaimer

 

[Admiral2]

I'm honestly still in shock that anyone would even invite them to their convention.
Maybe they didn't know his history before hand, but I would think once it became clear just how controversial a figure he was they would have wanted nothing to do with him.
I know they gave the whole thing about not wanting to uninvite him, but personally I would rather just uninvite him than have to deal with being dragged into all of the drama surrounding him.

It's entirely possible that the organizers of a convention can know about the controversy and not care.

After all, AP's most devoted acolytes still think CBS and Paramount were in the wrong and conflate the lawsuit against Peters as an attack on fandom in general. I don't see why a convention organizer couldn't come in blind at this point, go over the documents of the case and read the opinions on both sides of the issue and come to the same conclusion. Or, they could think Peters was in the wrong but that the efforts of his detractors are overkill, trying to deprive Peters of the second chance that everybody deserves. Or, frankly, they see all the messages and ultimatums (ultimata?) as things to defy, because deep down grown human beings don't like to be told what to do by strangers on the internet.

So while I'm miffed that LFIM sullied another of my favorite fandoms with his presence at a convention, I realize that the organizers have to consider a thousand planning decisions before hand, and I can understand if at the time they thought the benefits of inviting AP outweighed any possible negatives.

"Generating Awareness" is a favored tactic of the activist, but it has its limitations.

 

[Tom]

So is see Alec and Cryystal are in San Deigo now, in case anyone wants to say hello.

 

[Potemkin_Prod]

It's entirely possible that the organizers of a convention can know about the controversy and not care.

Yep. This is some of it.

...they could think Peters was in the wrong but that the efforts of his detractors are overkill, trying to deprive Peters of the second chance that everybody deserves.

Yep, but it's not his "second chance." It's "another chance." And this was the consensus of many of the attendees at Treklanta 2018.

Or, frankly, they see all the messages and ultimatums (ultimata?) as things to defy, because deep down grown human beings don't like to be told what to do by strangers on the internet.

"Generating Awareness" is a favored tactic of the activist, but it has its limitations.

And frankly, this is quite true. A number of folks are getting tired of the Anti-Axanar group frothing at the mouth over things like coffee shops.

 

[Jedi_Master]

It's entirely possible that the organizers of a convention can know about the controversy and not care.

After all, AP's most devoted acolytes still think CBS and Paramount were in the wrong and conflate the lawsuit against Peters as an attack on fandom in general. I don't see why a convention organizer couldn't come in blind at this point, go over the documents of the case and read the opinions on both sides of the issue and come to the same conclusion. Or, they could think Peters was in the wrong but that the efforts of his detractors are overkill, trying to deprive Peters of the second chance that everybody deserves. Or, frankly, they see all the messages and ultimatums (ultimata?) as things to defy, because deep down grown human beings don't like to be told what to do by strangers on the internet.

So while I'm miffed that LFIM sullied another of my favorite fandoms with his presence at a convention, I realize that the organizers have to consider a thousand planning decisions before hand, and I can understand if at the time they thought the benefits of inviting AP outweighed any possible negatives.

"Generating Awareness" is a favored tactic of the activist, but it has its limitations.

Chuckle. Of course, AP could be promising that he will bring in a certain amount of dollars due to his thousands of devoted fans.
People like money, and money makes them forget a whole lot of crap they probably shouldn't.

As for people "frothing at the mouth" - I think it's beneficial to remember that Alec already worked his way through the world of collectibles, burning bridges, engaging in unethical behavior, and using various dirty tricks to attack anyone who dared to criticize him. He screws over a bunch of people, outrage abounds. Time passes, critics who care enough to remind folks of Alec's misdeeds are increasingly marginalized and ignored...and after a few years, he reinvents himself as a fan-filmmaker! Everyone loves and adores him, gives him tons of money, ignores the warnings of the few folks who still care enough to point out his former misdeeds, and then after a time, goes too far and gets sued. Screws over everybody. Outrage abounds. Time passes and now a growing number of folks are happy to ignore or re-characterize his past actions,critics who care enough to remind folks of his misdeeds are increasingly marginalized and ignored...and now he has morphed into a sci-fi convention organizer/studio manager!
Humans are weird.

 

[Admiral2]

Chuckle. Of course, AP could be promising that he will bring in a certain amount of dollars due to his thousands of devoted fans.
People like money, and money makes them forget a whole lot of crap they probably shouldn't.

Well, yeah, that goes without saying...so, like, I didn't say it...

As for people "frothing at the mouth" - I think it's beneficial to remember that Alec already worked his way through the world of collectibles, burning bridges, engaging in unethical behavior, and using various dirty tricks to attack anyone who dared to criticize him. He screws over a bunch of people, outrage abounds. Time passes, critics who care enough to remind folks of Alec's misdeeds are increasingly marginalized and ignored...and after a few years, he reinvents himself as a fan-filmmaker! Everyone loves and adores him, gives him tons of money, ignores the warnings of the few folks who still care enough to point out his former misdeeds, and then after a time, goes too far and gets sued. Screws over everybody. Outrage abounds. Time passes and now a growing number of folks are happy to ignore or re-characterize his past actions,critics who care enough to remind folks of his misdeeds are increasingly marginalized and ignored...and now he has morphed into a sci-fi convention organizer/studio manager!

And here you've just perfectly illustrated why I think some people froth at the mouth - frustration. It's been demonstrated that no matter how much information and testimony is out there about AP's misdeeds, he always manages to find somebody new to fall for his bullshit, requiring the edumacation process to start all over again from scratch. Frankly, I think some in the anti-Axanar crowd are as tired of laying this stuff out over and over again as the axalytes are of seeing it.

Humans are weird.

Here's a non-sequitur: Every time someone says this it reminds me of that Schoolhouse Rock song "Interplanet Janet" and the verse about her visit to Earth:

Earth looked exciting, kind of green and inviting,
So Janet thought she'd give it a go.
But the people on that planet looked so very weird to Janet,
She didn't even dare to say "Hello!"

She was probably hovering over Propworx HQ when she stopped by...

 

[jespah]

Moi?

 

[Admiral2]

Moi?

No, no...the other Janet.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

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[Jedi_Master]

It's been demonstrated that no matter how much information and testimony is out there about AP's misdeeds, he always manages to find somebody new to fall for his bullshit, requiring the edumacation process to start all over again from scratch. Frankly, I think some in the anti-Axanar crowd are as tired of laying this stuff out over and over again as the axalytes are of seeing it.

Amen. The worst folks are the ones who know better, but somehow think that time and space will just somehow make it all go away.

 

[Potemkin_Prod]

Frankly, I think some in the anti-Axanar crowd are as tired of laying this stuff out over and over again as the axalytes are of seeing it.

I would say that you can count me in the first group. Humans, being what we are, simply tire of being told what we know over and over. When the tellers cross the boundary of what is worthy of criticism ($1.4M) and what is not (coffee shop opened by friends), you alienate the first group (uh, me) and give ammunition for the second group to cry "persecution!" I'd say that's where we're at now.

 

[Admiral2]

I would say that you can count me in the first group. Humans, being what we are, simply tire of being told what we know over and over. When the tellers cross the boundary of what is worthy of criticism ($1.4M) and what is not (coffee shop opened by friends), you alienate the first group (uh, me) and give ammunition for the second group to cry "persecution!" I'd say that's where we're at now.

And I think we're there because of one thing: AP didn't suffer any real consequence for any of his actions. He took more than a million dollars from fans who donated in good faith and wasted it without delivering what he promised, tried to make money off of IP owned by two giant corporations and then tried to convince those corporations that he had a right to do it because they weren't using it, and as Jedi_Master pointed out, this is just the latest incident in a long string of dick moves.

And yet, he still gets to make his fan film (he won't, but he can) and he still gets to go to conventions and act like a big shot.

So I can understand the frothers, cause here's a guy who went bankrupt with a licensed business and got sued over an unlicensed one, and there are still geniuses out there that want him to help them compete with Starbucks.

So, there are people on both sides of the debate who are just tired of it all, but the ones on the anti- side who are pedal-to-the-medal about it just want to see AP go down, hard, and learn enough of a lesson to shut up, stop putting his face everywhere and quietly go be a lawyer-by-training somewhere. (I know I do...)

But that's not happening, and the frothers are frothing because nobody can come up with a good way to make it happen.

 

[urbandefault]

Donors aside, it would be interesting to see a list of all the other people used and tossed aside by His Majesty. Behind the scenes people, cast and crew, artistic contributors, etc. who were unceremoniously tossed under the nearest bus as soon as they started to speak out.

It's not as many as the 14K (alleged) donors, but I bet it's a hefty number.