• Welcome! The TrekBBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans.
    If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Star Trek Discovery: The Future is Definitely Female

This is a massive oversimplification, of course they were more dynamic, they were ranging for food sources.

Prior to the advent of farming the primary role of animal based food sources was largely social, male status and thus reproductive potential was heavily tied into hunting success (and hence, providing). In most hunter gatherer societies all the evidence suggests that gathering would represent the greater net calorific income. This, however, would typically be subject to the law of diminishing returns where males and females were geographically sedentary given the limitations of any specific region as a plant based food source.

As you say, though, this is the very definition of anachronistic when applied to modern society.
Oversimplified yes, but just in a way that I am pointing out the situations that would have led to those decisions were the same that tended to cause the same social structures over and over. Obviously there are those amazing (and amazingly rare!) moments in the story of our species where some individual had enough stick on the fulcrum to say "okay, let's try it THIS way instead" and change things up.

The role of patriarchy held in place by social and religious needs and kept in check by high birthrates, still necessary to keep the populations going under constant threats from pandemics and food shortages. But it is no mistake that by the very earliest dawning of the industrial age with water-wheel mills, and Newcomen engines, those questions of equality were already being asked, and even attempted to be applied here and there in lopsided fashion.

In the Early days of the American Revolution, Abigail Adams wrote to her husband, John Adams, delegate to Continental Congress:
That your Sex are Naturally Tyrannical is a Truth so thoroughly established as to admit of no dispute, but such of you as wish to be happy willingly give up the harsh title of Master for the more tender and endearing one of Friend. Why then, not put it out of the power of the vicious and the

Lawless to use us with cruelty and indignity with impunity. Men of Sense in all Ages abhor those customs which treat us only as the vassals of your Sex.

Future president John Adams' reply to her is fascinating and telling:
But your Letter was the first Intimation that another Tribe more numerous and powerfull than all the rest were grown discontented. — This is rather too coarse a Compliment but you are so saucy, I wont blot it out.

Depend upon it, We know better than to repeal our Masculine systems. Altho they are in full Force, you know they are little more than Theory. We dare not exert our Power in its full Latitude.
 
Oversimplified yes, but just in a way that I am pointing out the situations that would have led to those decisions were the same that tended to cause the same social structures over and over. Obviously there are those amazing (and amazingly rare!) moments in the story of our species where some individual had enough stick on the fulcrum to say "okay, let's try it THIS way instead" and change things up.

The role of patriarchy held in place by social and religious needs and kept in check by high birthrates, still necessary to keep the populations going under constant threats from pandemics and food shortages. But it is no mistake that by the very earliest dawning of the industrial age with water-wheel mills, and Newcomen engines, those questions of equality were already being asked, and even attempted to be applied here and there in lopsided fashion.

In the Early days of the American Revolution, Abigail Adams wrote to her husband, John Adams, delegate to Continental Congress:
That your Sex are Naturally Tyrannical is a Truth so thoroughly established as to admit of no dispute, but such of you as wish to be happy willingly give up the harsh title of Master for the more tender and endearing one of Friend. Why then, not put it out of the power of the vicious and the

Lawless to use us with cruelty and indignity with impunity. Men of Sense in all Ages abhor those customs which treat us only as the vassals of your Sex.

Future president John Adams' reply to her is fascinating and telling:
But your Letter was the first Intimation that another Tribe more numerous and powerfull than all the rest were grown discontented. — This is rather too coarse a Compliment but you are so saucy, I wont blot it out.

Depend upon it, We know better than to repeal our Masculine systems. Altho they are in full Force, you know they are little more than Theory. We dare not exert our Power in its full Latitude.

Oh I agree, in fact questioning the power balance goes back long before the industrial revolution or the inception of the US. Arguably the evidence would tend to suggest it has gone on in fact well before the evolution of homosapiens. It was, however, often also driven at root by environmental and/or specific selection factors for much of our pre history and even into recorded times.

I would suggest that the modern age is intrinsically different in that social movements are no longer isolated or reliant on the sporadic and chaotic tidal swell and heave of information spread or limited situational factors. We literally communicate real time as a species on the global level and what once would be localised shifts in political and interpersonal dynamics can much more readily become global phenomena. Movements on all sides and aspects of political, religious and philosophical spectra can and do gain traction on an unparalleled scale literally within days. Right wing nationalism, #metoo, feminism, BLM, the politics of gender identity, radical islamic extremism and christian fundamentalism are all drastically different beasts in their nature but they all share their recent dynamism to the saturation and instantaneous interconnected nature of modern communications.

That makes media like star trek, which has traditionally championed such a progressive message, arguably more important now than ever. The platform for entertainment as a means for social change is more powerful now than at any point in the human journey and positive representation of all genders is more than simply desirable as a driver of demographics and viewing figures, it is imperative as an integral part of a broader social picture.
 
Last edited:
Oh I agree, in fact questioning the power balance goes back long before the industrial revolution or the inception of the US. Arguably the evidence would tend to suggest it has gone on in fact well before the evolution of homosapiens. It was, however, often also driven at root by environmental and/or specific selection factors for much of our pre history and even into recorded times.

I would suggest that the modern age is intrinsically different in that social movements are no longer isolated or reliant on the sporadic and chaotic tidal swell and heave of information spread or limited situational factors. We literally communicate real time as a species on the global level and what once would be localised shifts in political and interpersonal dynamics can much more readily become global phenomena. Movements on all sides and aspects of political, religious and philosophical spectra can and do gain traction on an unparalleled scale literally within days. Right wing nationalism, #metoo, feminism, BLM, the politics of gender identity, radical islamic extremism and christian fundamentalism are all drastically different beasts in their nature but they all share their recent dynamism to the saturation and instantaneous interconnected nature of modern communications.

That makes media like star trek, which has traditionally championed such a progressive message, arguably more important now than ever. The platform for entertainment as a platform for social change is more powerful now than at any point in the human journey and positive representation of all genders is more than simply desirable as a driver of demographics and viewing figures, it is imperative as an integral part of a broader social picture.
Thank you.

Some of hose movements mentioned I think we would agree to some degree stem from an attempt to hold back the tide on global culture, and others are counter-movements to those reactionary trends. Regional and local culture is almost a myth now, or at least a pale shades of what they were. The world hasn't really moved away from embracing globalism as much as at best reveling in the most positive aspects and sullenly adapting to those that are most difficult to swallow.

The days of people advocating for a world government like Sir Harold Mackinder or Wendell Wilkie seem long over in this backlash tide of nationalism. I mention this in a thread about the future being female because I do not think a truly gender equal society can exist on a nationalist footing. The nationalist cause is paternal and regressive. That is built into its very structure. A true gender and ethnic equal world requires a world society and a world government, and more importantly it requires a good chunk of the world population to embrace it rather than the old alternatives, or more especially than just sullen acknowledgement of globalism, as that leads in a completely different tangent.

We need Star Trek.
 
I would suggest that the modern age is intrinsically different in that social movements are no longer isolated. The platform for entertainment as a platform for social change is more powerful now than at any point in the human journey and positive representation of all genders is more than simply desirable as a driver of demographics and viewing figures, it is imperative as an integral part of a broader social picture.
The platform for modern Star Trek is more isolated. It is on paid access TV for all but Canadian viewers. It could show anything, represent anything as long as it pays the bills. Welcome to the real modern age.
 
The platform for modern Star Trek is more isolated. It is on paid access TV for all but Canadian viewers. It could show anything, represent anything as long as it pays the bills. Welcome to the real modern age.

Netflix is more isolated than network television? Those networks didn't have bills to pay? Global discussions in fan forums, on youtube and facebook are less influential and interactive than letters written to fan magazines?
 
7.99 for on demand viewing versus, what's Sky's cheapest package, £40 plus installation of a dish?
And back in the 90s when it was on free to air terrestrial, it was years behind the states.
So? Surely you are not suggesting current pay as you go options make the product more available? I've never had to pay for Trek before.
 
Surely you are not suggesting current pay as you go options make the product more available?
That's exactly what I'm suggesting, which is why I said it. For Enterprise, I could either sign up to sky, or wait for the DVD. It wasn't until Netflix was a thing that I even saw some of that show. Plus Netflix allows unlimited watching of TV Trek's entire back catalogue for 7.99/month, which would have needed DVD purchases before. I'm seeing the Animated Series for what in many episodes' case is the first time. Trek has never been more easily/cheaply accessible.
 
That's exactly what I'm suggesting, which is why I said it. For Enterprise, I could either sign up to sky, or wait for the DVD. It wasn't until Netflix was a thing that I even saw some of that show. Plus Netflix allows unlimited watching of TV Trek's entire back catalogue for 7.99/month, which would have needed DVD purchases before. I'm seeing the Animated Series for what in many episodes' case is the first time. Trek has never been more easily/cheaply accessible.
Well I guess our viewing trends and histories differ, as would those in the US. The platform for Discovery is specifically designed for paid customers from the get go. Its rating, its style has been tailored for those customers. Except it doesn't have viewers ratings - yet. Not so sure that a platform that is not for the 'every' man/woman is perfect for affecting social message.
 
Last edited:
Hmmm I don't know if types of audience are the same anymore. That everyday person is the one that might be more important to reach and influence than the likes of us who apparently have all the answers. I'm not even sure if the future female as depicted in Discovery is one to aspire to. It's a numbers game. Seeing more actual representation and Discovery has that, is encouraging.
 
That's exactly what I'm suggesting, which is why I said it. For Enterprise, I could either sign up to sky, or wait for the DVD. It wasn't until Netflix was a thing that I even saw some of that show. Plus Netflix allows unlimited watching of TV Trek's entire back catalogue for 7.99/month, which would have needed DVD purchases before. I'm seeing the Animated Series for what in many episodes' case is the first time. Trek has never been more easily/cheaply accessible.

I'm amazed anyone in Australia could complain about the Trek access we now have. In every other series we were far, far behind. I seem to recall renting VOY's finale on video when it hadn't been seen on tv yet. We spent years with NO star trek available on tv at all. When ENT was shown it was on anywhere between 10 and 11 at night, cancelled for weeks because of sports and infested with phone sex ads seemingly every 7 minutes. I had to quit watching it because it was unwatchable like that. Star Trek has never been big here, never as much a part of the public consciousness as in the US because it's just not been accessible.

Netflix has changed ALL THAT and it's amazing. I have met so many people who have gone back and discovered the other series because they can do it so easily, in their own time.
 
Additionally bear in mind Netflix already has a massive global audience of people already paying anyway. That audience is at the bare minimum one order of magnitude bigger than any 1960s TV network's share.
Not everyone has Netflix and will want it. Then there are people like my brother-in-law who has it and I had to tell him what Discovery was, lol. We and I mean us fans speak from our already invested perspective I'm not sure we are the yardstick.
 
Well teacake, in the 1960s not everyone had TV, in the 90s not everyone had sky. For all the previous trek iterations not everyone lived in the US. For all previous iterations social media was either non existent or relatively limited in it's scope.

No one can seriously suggest Discovery has a narrow audience next to earlier shows, not unless they are just arguing for the sake of it. No one would do that would they?
 
Such a tired argument. But especially laughable if you live in Aus. "Available" is exactly what Star Trek wasn't for many years at a time long before streaming platforms showed up.

But whatever, I enjoy my 10 bucks a month. Have found all manner of things I'd never see otherwise. Totally worth it, cost of 3 coffees here :lol:
 
If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Sign up / Register


Back
Top