It seems there is a reason for the visual reboot and the producers aren't being honest about it.

[ITDUDE]

But - the most important part of course: CBS HAS THE RIGHTS TO USE THE OLD TREK STUFF. Yay! I suspected it was only that - a choice to sell different toys...erm..."creative choice"... - But it's very good to get a confirmation on that! CBS really can do old Trek if it wants! The future is saved!

Then again... this means the design choices in DIS so far have really been intentional...

Yep, they can totally use old stuff and intentionally chose not to.
2018’s VFX technology. Pfft, what a malarkey.
Exhibit A:

Doesn't seem out of place with 2018 VFX, not one bit. But they wouldn't be able to sell it separately as STD toy now, would they?

 

[Rahul]

Yep, they can totally use old stuff and intentionally chose not to.
2018’s VFX technology. Pfft, what a malarkey.
Exhibit A:

Doesn't seem out of place with 2018 VFX, not one bit. But they wouldn't be able to sell it separately as STD toy now, would they?

Do you see any blue smear all over those pictures? No? See, told you it doesn't fit with Discovery!

 

[CaptainMurdock]

Do you see any blue smear all over those pictures? No? See, told you it doesn't fit with Discovery!

The TMP one has lots of blue.

 

[Tuskin38]

Probably meant 2017 aesthetics.

 

[MakeshiftPython]

I love the fact that attempts to tell a story in an hour now are called "filler."

Welcome to the 21st century.

Joking aside, filler to me in the context of serialized television today is basically a standalone episode with no relation to the overall story, like "Civilization", "North Star", "Doctor's Orders", and "E2" for the third season of ENT. Had ENT been a shorter season like 13 episodes, as most serialized television shows are now, those episodes would have never been conceived.

If DISCO is going to continue with shorter seasons, I doubt we'll see the old practice of reusing props and costumes from other programs, like seeing the Discovery crew travel back to Nazi Germany or something.

 

[Lord Garth]

Yep, they can totally use old stuff and intentionally chose not to.
2018’s VFX technology. Pfft, what a malarkey.
Exhibit A:

Doesn't seem out of place with 2018 VFX, not one bit. But they wouldn't be able to sell it separately as STD toy now, would they?

These look great! I have to ask, though, are there any pictures of the Enterprise-A done like this for the Kelvin Films?

 

[Jesse1066]

These look great! I have to ask, though, are there any pictures of the Enterprise-A done like this for the Kelvin Films?

 

[Campe]

But they wouldn't be able to sell it separately as STD toy now, would they?

My problem with this argument is that when it comes to Star Trek merchandise, nothing sells better than TOS. Why the hell would they introduce a new Enterprise just to sell toys when the 52-year old model is doing just fine in the merch department?

 

[Mudd]

Welcome to the 21st century.

Been here.

Seen it before.

Most of what impressed and excited people in entertainment fifty years ago was superficial and ephemeral. Still true.

 

[Nightowl1701]

My problem with this argument is that when it comes to Star Trek merchandise, nothing sells better than TOS. Why the hell would they introduce a new Enterprise just to sell toys when the 52-year old model is doing just fine in the merch department?

'Cuz they figure a 52-year old model only appeals to the nostalgia crowd. A sizable and still profitable crowd to be sure, but they won't last forever. You don't see any Buck Rogers or Flash Gordon toys around anymore, do you? DSC is all about introducing Star Trek to a new audience, a fanbase for the 21st century. An audience that expects a lot more from their sci-fi in the looks and realism department. Since the Abramsprise (either version) proved too different and got a lukewarm response from the audience at best, the Discoprise splits the difference - close enough to the classic design (or at least the TMP version) to satisfy the die-hards (if they squint real hard), but decidedly not looking like something made of wood for low-res TV (pre-2001 A Space Odyssey, let alone pre-Star Wars) over half a century ago.

Yes, the pics above show the old design could still work under the right conditions. But amid all the new ships designed for DSC, I don't know...

 

[cooleddie74]

Do you see any blue smear all over those pictures? No? See, told you it doesn't fit with Discovery!

I can also see the ship.

 

[Mudd]

'DSC is all about introducing Star Trek to a new audience, a fanbase for the 21st century. An audience that expects a lot more from their sci-fi in the looks and realism department.

They've pretty thoroughly failed at all that.

 

[cooleddie74]

I think the classic 1701 looks "real" enough with the proper amount of surface detailing and good lighting. The design itself is just fine in any decade and looks elegant and beautiful. Most quibbles seem to revolve around the original 1960s shooting models not having enough surface detail to pass for a modern, "real world" spacecraft.

DS9 and ENT did pretty masterful jobs of giving a starship designed in 1964 a refresh that makes her look even better than most of the ones we've seen in either the new series or the Kelvin timeline films.

 

[Mudd]

Not everyone likes the Abrams movie designs, but they're vivid and first-rate. By contrast, most of the work on STD is fully derivative, unimaginative and dull. There's just nothing exciting about it.

 

[cooleddie74]

A few of the starships that warp to Vulcan and are then destroyed by Nero look so much better than most of the ones we've seen on DSC. Sure, they're largely just variants on the U.S.S. Kelvin and not terribly original or imaginative but some of them look fantastic by the standards of the new series.

I think what the Kelvin timeline films get right that the DSC producers get wrong is that even in an altered history with bigger and more advanced-looking ships the Starfleet in those movies still gets the TOS look and feel right. The colors of the starships. The uniforms. The relationships. For all their faults the Kelvin timeline movies just look and feel more like the TOS era.

 

[Mudd]

A few of the starships that warp to Vulcan and are then destroyed by Nero look so much better than most of the ones we've seen on DSC. Sure, they're largely just variants on the U.S.S. Kelvin and not terribly original or imaginative but some of them look fantastic by the standards of the new series.

I think what the Kelvin timeline films get right that the DSC producers get wrong is that even in an altered history with bigger and more advanced-looking ships the Starfleet in those movies still gets the TOS look and feel right. The colors of the starships. The uniforms. The relationships. For all their faults the Kelvin timeline movies just look and feel more like the TOS era.

So, I'm watching the new Lost In Space and the design work and effects are stunningly good. Not to mention that the characters are engaging, their motivations relatable and the dynamic of their interactions intriguing from scene to scene.

I'm not sure I've seen a science fiction series on TV this season that isn't better than the new Trek. That's a pretty sad state of affairs.

 

[cooleddie74]

The new Lost In Space is so much better than I expected it to be. It is the ideal blend of witty dialogue and relationships between the main characters and a modern aesthetic that somehow works in spite of being a reboot of a classic show that was so over-the-top and campy for so much of its production history.

The new Robot grew on me by the second episode. I don't know how the producers did it, but those bastards pulled it off.

 

[fireproof78]

I'm not sure I've seen a science fiction series on TV this season that isn't better than the new Trek. That's a pretty sad state of affairs.

Must have missed when Stargate came out. I preferred that, Farscape, Invisible Man, and Sliders over the Star Trek at the time.

 

[Saul]

CBS says it's not a legal matter:
Enterprise Redesign a Creative Decision for STAR TREK: DISCOVERY, Not “Legally Required” as Rumored

sounds legit.

Why would the two artists say they were told otherwise that it had to be different then for legal reasons? Strange.

You don't see any Buck Rogers or Flash Gordon toys around anymore, do you?

To be fair they didn't stick around long. Trek has been in the public eye with TV series, movies and on a cultural level for decades.

 

[F. King Daniel]

We have artists who think they can't use the old designs for legal reasons.

We have a writer who thinks we can't use anything from any of the movies due to the CBS/Paramount split.

We have artists calling it it's own world and producers calling it prime.


It's a sad state of affairs when the people making the show don't know what they can and cant do or why. Let's have a staff meeting - or even an email memo - where it's all spelled out, because only when you understand your job can you do it well.