Where should Star Trek go next if going forward?

[CRM-114]

There's a lot we don't know about the ST 24th century. Next Gen only shows us the ideal aspects of its society. It doesn't show us any problems that exist and humans being humans some issues must exist. For instance, we see technology all over the place but there is no mention of hackers and opportunists who manipulate that tech to their own gains. Crime may be much lower but material want still exists. There are plenty of humans who still chase profit in the 24th century. Since people no longer have to work does that create a large population of slackers who just live off of society and spend all their time in holodecks? Not everyone will be Picard who nobly wants to improve and enrich himself.
I agree that people will still be pretty much like they are today. Certain attitudes may change but even Khan after coming out of 200 years of cryogenic sleep comments that although technology has advanced, humans have not changed very much.

This perfectly summarizes why Star Trek is not the great model for the future that some fans like to think it is. We're largely shown only one significant facet of life in the Federation and that's Starfleet, which for the purposes of exploration and combat, is always going to be the Federation putting its' best foot forward. The rest of it works simply because we're told that it does, but not how.

 

[Rahul]

See, the problem with the idea of "realism" in Trek is this: To someone from 300 years in the past, we seem to be living in a utopia already. Many fatal diseases have been cured, or at least have treatments. Your chances of being horribly murdered are substantially lower. Even the poor live at a standard of living above what would pass as the upper-middle class at that time. Even among those who are working class, relatively few do back-breaking, physically dangerous labor - and that number continues to drop due to automation.

What hasn't changed of course is human nature. Culture, however, has changed in some ways. We don't look to respond to violence against our families with deadly force any longer - we trust the law to do it for us, for example. But on the whole, people are just as fallible in the 21st century as they were in the 18th. And they will be just as fallible in the 24th century as well.

Thus I think a realistic portrayal of the 24th century would be, by our standards, utopian. Nearly everything we consider "work" today would be done by super-intelligent AI. Crime would be much lower, but perhaps not totally eliminated. People will live longer and healthier lives. Material want may be largely abolished. But people will still (absent significant genetic modification affecting personalities) be pretty much the same as they are today.

Very well put!
Indeed, the Star Trek future seems to be a utopian post-scarcity society that cured all diseases and social injustices, which is really everything we hope for and strive to. But I never got into the (purely TNG) spirit that humanity "evolved" in some way. Not naturally. Just culturally.

For me, the Star Trek future is one where nobody anymore murders is neighbour for the stuff he has, or even has the need to break in and steal stuff. And there are also probably secure social safety nets, to help people with social anxieties and physical illness - like Holodeck addiction and stuff.

But it still would also be a future where some people kill their spouses for cheating on them. It might be almost non-existent, because with higher education and more social freedom comes more self-control, and everyone has a counsellor to go to, instead of a gun store around the corner. But that shit will still happen. Because it's in our human nature, and will always happen.

That's for me the Star Trek Utopia: Not perfect if you live in it. Only perfect compared to what we have now.

 

[CRM-114]

Very well put!
Indeed, the Star Trek future seems to be a utopian post-scarcity society that cured all diseases and social injustices, which is really everything we hope for and strive to. But I never got into the (purely TNG) spirit that humanity "evolved" in some way. Not naturally. Just culturally.

For me, the Star Trek future is one where nobody anymore murders is neighbour for the stuff he has, or even has the need to break in and steal stuff. And there are also probably secure social safety nets, to help people with social anxieties and physical illness - like Holodeck addiction and stuff.

But it still would also be a future where some people kill their spouses for cheating on them. It might be almost non-existent, because with higher education and more social freedom comes more self-control, and everyone has a counsellor to go to, instead of a gun store around the corner. But that shit will still happen. Because it's in our human nature, and will always happen.

That's for me the Star Trek Utopia: Not perfect if you live in it. Only perfect compared to what we have now.

That’s the problem with an utopia: the bar for perfection is set too low.

 

[Lynx]

No more retro series, please.

 

[STEPhon IT]

For me, the Star Trek future is one where nobody anymore murders is neighbour for the stuff he has, or even has the need to break in and steal stuff. And there are also probably secure social safety nets, to help people with social anxieties and physical illness - like Holodeck addiction and stuff.

But it still would also be a future where some people kill their spouses for cheating on them. It might be almost non-existent, because with higher education and more social freedom comes more self-control, and everyone has a counsellor to go to, instead of a gun store around the corner. But that shit will still happen. Because it's in our human nature, and will always happen.

That's for me the Star Trek Utopia: Not perfect if you live in it. Only perfect compared to what we have now.

Glad your not creating Star Trek shows. I guess gals and guys better not cheat on Star Trek or ELSE...!

 

[Kane_Steel]

After STD, the Prime Timeline is damaged goods.

I'd say just reboot Trek on television completely and develop a new modern vision for the universe.

 

[Matthew Raymond]

I'd say just reboot Trek on television completely and develop a new modern vision for the universe.

What would be the tone of such a reboot? I think it needs to be serious (not The Orville, Stargate SG-1) but not too serious (BSG, Stargate Universe). I think it also needs to be slightly more hard science, so a little more like The Expanse, but not too much. It also needs to EITHER incorporate new technology and new ideas about the future OR come up with some sort of explanation why those things are missing. ("Fourth Wall Breaks have been outlawed because Deadpool nested so many of them it nearly tore a hole in the fabric of the universe.")

 

[STEPhon IT]

After STD, the Prime Timeline is damaged goods.

I'd say just reboot Trek on television completely and develop a new modern vision for the universe.

DISC is not in TOS universe; forcing a cylinder into a square shaped pattern will never fit no matter what some executive fool tries to tell you. Enterprise is in the same boat. These shows are more in line with JJTrek because it simply doesn't match well with what I know of TOS. If ENT is part of TOS timeline, then it's safe to say, Picard tampered with and violated the timeline in the movie "First Contact." So TOS no longer exists, but JJTrek now does.

I would rather say this was all a dream of Picard, trapped in the Nexus... until Hugh Jackman rescues him.

 

[Matthew Raymond]

@STEPhon IT, I like to think that the differences in ENT and DSC are the result of the Temporal Cold War. So TOS is a subtly different timeline before the Temporal Cold War altered history. The events in the new timeline were roughly the same, but there are subtle inconsistencies with the original timeline. Thus, the series are smaller scale versions of what JJ did with the Kelvin Timeline.

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

I like the Trek Three Universe Theory:
Prime = TOS, TNG, DS9, VOY
Kelvin = All aspects of NuTrek
TCW = ENT, STD

 

[Rahul]

Glad your not creating Star Trek shows. I guess gals and guys better not cheat on Star Trek or ELSE...!

Dude, what?
I mean, as far as logical arguments go, this is....what?

DISC is not in TOS universe; forcing a cylinder into a square shaped pattern will never fit no matter what some executive fool tries to tell you. Enterprise is in the same boat. These shows are more in line with JJTrek because it simply doesn't match well with what I know of TOS. If ENT is part of TOS timeline, then it's safe to say, Picard tampered with and violated the timeline in the movie "First Contact." So TOS no longer exists, but JJTrek now does.

I would rather say this was all a dream of Picard, trapped in the Nexus... until Hugh Jackman rescues him.

Discovery IS in the TOS universe. That's the official canon for now.
And what the hell makes it closer to JJTrek in your opinion? That the ships have windows? Wow, not superficial at all. Because this show operates on a whole different design language than JJTrek...

 

[Valenti]

They all wanna be their own separate universes, don't they? I don't blame them. I just don't watch them.

 

[STEPhon IT]

@STEPhon IT, I like to think that the differences in ENT and DSC are the result of the Temporal Cold War. So TOS is a subtly different timeline before the Temporal Cold War altered history. The events in the new timeline were roughly the same, but there are subtle inconsistencies with the original timeline. Thus, the series are smaller scale versions of what JJ did with the Kelvin Timeline.

Heck, within so-called canon which is bullsh*t to begin with, there must be a reason the NX-01 and it's crew were never mentioned of it's existence in TOS or movies, TNG and it's spin-offs, but happened to appear on a display in "Into Darkness"?

DISC fits better, just by visual appearance alone, with JJTrek and the uniforms color scheme is more in tuned with ENT and nothing from those two series could ever fit or transition with TOS. It would've been better to make these shows set after TNG. If Scotty from TOS had a glimpse of these engine rooms and interior designs he would get a coronary attack.

 

[fireproof78]

Heck, within so-called canon which is bullsh*t to begin with, there must be a reason the NX-01 and it's crew were never mentioned of it's existence in TOS or movies, TNG and it's spin-offs, but happened to appear on a display in "Into Darkness"?

DISC fits better, just by visual appearance alone, with JJTrek and the uniforms color scheme is more in tuned with ENT and nothing from those two series could ever fit or transition with TOS. It would've been better to make these shows set after TNG. If Scotty from TOS had a glimpse of these engine rooms and interior designs he would get a coronary attack.

DISCO fits fine if you go from ENT to the USS Kelvin (which is in Prime) to DISCO. The design language is very similiar.

Also, TMP makes some pretty radical departures too. Is it in its own universe?

 

[STEPhon IT]

DISCO fits fine if you go from ENT to the USS Kelvin (which is in Prime) to DISCO. The design language is very similiar.

Also, TMP makes some pretty radical departures too. Is it in its own universe?

There was some sort of technological collapse between the TOS and the TMP, if it's in the same universe; how could we explain the sleek, simple look and feel of TOS costumes and tech into a clunky design of the Enterprise? The costumes have metal belts, the transporter doesn't work, engineering now wears radiation suits and the warp engines are inside the belly of Engineering, it would seem space had become more dangerous to travel all of sudden. It would explain why the Enterprise had to launch from Earth in every film and not from anywhere else in the galaxy.

If anyone look at the designs done from DISC, ENT, and JJTrek the progression is more in line than TOS, I mean couldn't these production designers try to make these state of the art shows look like it was in the world from "The Cage"??? If not, and ego is too large to conform to Matt Jefferies designs then push these shows after TNG. It would be easier to follow for me.

 

[fireproof78]

If anyone look at the designs done from DISC, ENT, and JJTrek the progression is more in line than TOS, I mean couldn't these production designers try to make these state of the art shows look like it was in the world from "The Cage"??? If not, and ego is too large to conform to Matt Jefferies designs then push these shows after TNG. It would be easier to follow for me.

That's fair, but it's not how I've regarded Trek for many years, so I guess it is a nonissue. Actually, I think there is a pretty good thru-line for ENT-Kelvin-DISCO-TMP. And, I know I'm the outlier on this, but if TOS is treated as in universe reproduction the historic "5 Year Mission" of the Enterprise, it works even better.

Yes, I know, I'm crazy.

 

[Valenti]

So you're saying TOS was just an historical reenactment and didn't 'really' happen. Not really. OK.

 

[fireproof78]

So you're saying TOS was just an historical reenactment and didn't 'really' happen. Not really. OK.

Like I said, it's just a theory, and just a fun thought exercise. At least for me.

 

[Lord Garth]

I don't think we'll see prequels after Discovery. I also think the next series, as a reaction to DSC, will probably be more "conventional" in its storytelling but still serialized. I can't point to previous examples within Star Trek because all the season-long arcs have been about wars: the Dominion (you have a full season's worth between S6 and S7 of DS9), the Xindi, and most recently with the Klingons. I don't think the next series will have war as a focus. You'll have TOS/TNG/VOY type stories except in arc form.

I obviously don't know that they'll do this but it's just what I think they might do. Both as an outgrowth from what DSC has done and in attempt to distance itself from it.

 

[Tim Walker]

They all wanna be their own separate universes, don't they? .

Yes. They could be described as over lapping in many respects, but not the same.